[rfedd]

Any way you could do some data logging? Do you have SCT or Diablo? E-mail the data log to MD and they can e-mail back a much closer tune.

[2FNFAST]

I have the SCT Xcal2, but for some reason my computer with vista doesn't want to make a file for it. That and i'm a n00b to datalogging and may not be doing it right. Im hoping it'll make decent power once it's tuned with the port and the tt inlet, etc. I'd be jussst fine with anywhere near 400 trq.

[Gearbanger 101]

You'll need some sort of wide band set up to work in conjunction with your XCal2 to datalog the A/F ratio. Look into one of the Innovate Motorsports LM-1/LC-1 systems. I've got the LC-1 and it works great. Just make sure you wire it up properly, or it can be a bit of a hassel. The LM-1 might be the better unit for the beginner. A little more costly, but it's much easier to use.

[eviligloo]

Originally Posted by rfedd

No. Chris works for JDM where a car went for tuning. But it is an M90 with the new TTI inlet.



The inlet has to be a 6 bolt. I have a picture of it somewhere that I can post. If they made an adapter what would the market be?

What JDM airkit did they use on that? Did they adapt an 05+ S197 airkit for the application or something? Or did they use an airkit made for the terminator cobras? JDM doesn't really do much with the new edge body style.....(i've spoken with them a couple times about modding my car)

[rfedd]

No. The kit comes with a 1300 CFM throttle body (single blade) new throttle cable and bracket, cold air intake tube and filter and a cruise cable extension bracket. You can ad a MAF and adapter if needed.


Ron

[eviligloo]

Oh...ok. The dyno sheet says "jdm air kit." If I went with this....I wouldn't be upgrading to the M112 supercharger...just reusing the eaton M90. I'm still looking for more info as to what people have picked up with this gain while reusing the stock M90. There's really not much out there...


I spoke with JDM and they didn't do an initial dyno....so they can't completely compare. They just estimated that the person picked up about 35rwhp.

Does the boost drop because of efficiencies gained in this setup?

Last question....does the 90mm MAF fit directly onto it or do you need to buy an adapter?

[Gearbanger 101]

Originally Posted by eviligloo

Does the boost drop because of efficiencies gained in this setup?

Unless one opened things up on the exhaust end, manifold pressure (boost) should actually increase a little.

[eviligloo]

Originally Posted by Gearbanger 101

Unless one opened things up on the exhaust end, manifold pressure (boost) should actually increase a little.

That's where I'm confused.....because the dyno graph supports what you're saying. Around 5k RPM you see he's pushing closer to 12lbs of boost.

I would have thought that clearing the restriction of airflow should drop the boost pressure because the air can flow freely.

[Gearbanger 101]

Originally Posted by eviligloo

That's where I'm confused.....because the dyno graph supports what you're saying. Around 5k RPM you see he's pushing closer to 12lbs of boost.

I would have thought that clearing the restriction of airflow should drop the boost pressure because the air can flow freely.

Yes and no. You’re clearing restriction on the inlet side, without opening things up on the outlet end, which is what’s causing the jump in manifold pressure. A quick rule of thumb is as follows.....removing restriction on the inlet (intake) side increases airflow and as a result boost pressure, while removing restrictions on the outlet (exhaust) side will lower boost pressure. Changes will also be seen when altering cam profiles (overlap, LSA, etc) but the principal is still the same.

That being said, anytime you’re able to make more power, with less or the same boost pressure as you were seeing before the alteration you've made, you’ve essentially increased the overall breathing capability, and thus the over all "efficiency" of the engine.

[eviligloo]

Just as a follow up to this thread....I am trying out a portion of the tork tech kit.

I bought the entire intake side from the plenum all the way down to the filter and will be linking it up to my stock series II (eaton M90) supercharger. I also purchased the chicane intercooler and some 42lb injectors. I'm using the stock saleen manifold.

Hoping for around 390rwhp (including my other mods). I'll post up when everything is finished being installed (It's currently at the shop).

I will say, though, that there have been a few hangups with the installation so far. If you have a stock S/C'd saleen like I do there are a couple of problems. You have to order a stock EGR kit from a GT in order to use their EGR adapter. The EGR for the saleen is in a different place than on a GT.

Also...the stock location of the heater hose in the saleen is a problem because it interferes with the intake plenum. The heater hose will have to be modified.

As a plus.....I'm not a paid spokesman so I'll give you an unbiased review and honest dyno numbers!

[mat82284]

Originally Posted by eviligloo

Just as a follow up to this thread....I am trying out a portion of the tork tech kit.

I bought the entire intake side from the plenum all the way down to the filter and will be linking it up to my stock series II (eaton M90) supercharger. I also purchased the chicane intercooler and some 42lb injectors. I'm using the stock saleen manifold.

Hoping for around 390rwhp (including my other mods). I'll post up when everything is finished being installed (It's currently at the shop).

I will say, though, that there have been a few hangups with the installation so far. If you have a stock S/C'd saleen like I do there are a couple of problems. You have to order a stock EGR kit from a GT in order to use their EGR adapter. The EGR for the saleen is in a different place than on a GT.

Also...the stock location of the heater hose in the saleen is a problem because it interferes with the intake plenum. The heater hose will have to be modified.

As a plus.....I'm not a paid spokesman so I'll give you an unbiased review and honest dyno numbers!

ARE You serious! Thats a total waste of money. I cant believe you did that. The Saleen supercharger is junk and i learned that the hard way. I actually sold my unit on ebay for $2200 and bought a vortech v2 for $1800 I not only got a better supercharger capable of more power, but it IAT's are extremely low its unbelievable. Mine is intercooled to. You just spent about 2k on all those parts, The tork tech pipes cost like $1000 and the intercooler is 800 plus if you do install. You could have saved 2k and sold the unit, and bought another. Or sold it and bought Tork techs complete kit for $3700 and you would definitely be over 400hp. You wont reach that on that small saleen blower because the crappy intake manifold design. Your money would have better been spent on Cams and Heads, because you could have reached 400hp with those two and that blower, ive seen it done. Thats a far better way to spend that type of money. The object is to not try and max the blower more, but find a better way for that engine to breath and accept more. Cams and heads would have been my first choice. Or if you didn't want to spend any cash, sell it then buy a used vortech and it'll get you 400hp easily.

I once thought about doing what you were, but after tons of people one here suggesting many other things, i realized they were right and money was better spent elsewhere.

[eviligloo]

Originally Posted by mat82284

ARE You serious! Thats a total waste of money. I cant believe you did that.

Haha...thanks for the enthusiasm!

Points to consider:

1. In order to get the full tork tech kit to fit on my car I would have to buy a new hood because of clearance issues. It won't fit with a saleen supercharger hood and I happen to like the looks of the stock hood.

2. I don't have any interest in a centrifugal supercharger. I don't go to the track and I could care less about high end horsepower. I like down-low torque.

3. I have modest goals for my car and they look doable without having to take everything out and sell it on ebay just to spend even more on a full kit to get the same HP. I priced it out. Also, see #1.

4. The tork tech kit I do have is already running into a couple of problems because things in the engine bay are configured differently on a supercharged saleen than on a mustang GT. I can only imagine the nightmare trying to install the full tork tech kit when we haven't even STARTED to put the manifold back in on my build and have already found two problems.

5. I'm not forging my 2v engine in the future. 400rwhp is the max for me.

6. If I had a series I like you did then I would completely agree that it's not worth salvaging. Those things don't put out any power and are severely limited because of the design. Series II superchargers are a different story. By no means is it the best supercharger......but isn't bad either.

You can be the first in line to congratulate me when I kept the stock S/C and got the power I wanted or the first in line to laugh when my engine blows up.

[2FNFAST]

Still waiting to get myne to a dyno to get the finished tune.... Im on a stiege ported eaton with a modestly ported manifold, home job intercooler fix, tork tech inlet/tbody and bbk 03 cobra cai, 42lb injectors, 90mm maf, kb bap, full exhaust, upgraded heat exchanger... Hoping for 380+, and ill be happy as ****. My cars a vert and is mainly a looker, but my procharged setup @ 360 horse was damn fun, and had none of the low end like the heaton... Will update once the 4 feet of snow melt and i make it to a dyno for numbers! If i don't like what I see next step is blower cams and possibly Trickflows new heads...

[eviligloo]

Final numbers:

387rwhp / 394rwtq

Gains all across the power band.

PS- That's with a conservative tune. 14 degrees of timing. Throttle response alone makes it wicked. Much better than the Accufab 75mm TB I had on before.

[mat82284]

Originally Posted by eviligloo

Final numbers:

387rwhp / 394rwtq

Gains all across the power band.

HAHA i see you added my quote to your signature lol.

We'll those are good gains congrats. Still not worth the money to hp ratio though.

How much did it cost you total to get those numbers? was that on a dynojet or mustang dyno. Post the dyno sheet.

[Gearbanger 101]

Those are 2.1L Kenne Bell'esqe numbers....so assuming he doesn't have the kind of money into his kit that he would have spent on a new intercooled 2.1L KB, I'd say he's no further behind than anyone who bought one of those?

[mat82284]

Originally Posted by Gearbanger 101

Those are 2.1L Kenne Bell'esqe numbers....so assuming he doesn't have the kind of money into his kit that he would have spent on a new intercooled 2.1L KB, I'd say he's no further behind than anyone who bought one of those?

Except the kenne bell 2.1 has huge upgrade features. It can handle 500hp where as his saleen unit cant. He has pretty much maxed that unit out 99% but if he's happy with it then thats good.

I on the other hand, decided not to go that route and im so happy i that i didnt. I was about to put 3k in upgrades in that saleen unit as well, and instead i sold it. Got 2k. Bought a vortech for 1.8k Then rebuilt my engine for 6k. So all in all i not only have 500hp and a new engine but it only costed me an extra 2.8k over my budget and i must say it was well worth it. I could have saved 2k by not getting my heads ported and cams, valve springs, head bolts installed. then it would have only cost me 800 over my budget.

We'll anyways we all learn from experiences. I have learned before that its better to do it right the first time, it saves a ton of money and you will always be happy.

If those are dynojet numbers then he is actually behind a kenne bell. If there mustang dyno numbers, then he's doing pretty good. I dont go buy dyno jet numbers because its not real world numbers. I like dynojet because it account for air resistance. Its physics and its apart of the real world. Dynojet is like driving your car down a hill.

[Gearbanger 101]

Your average Kenne Bell 2.1L will put out 360-375rwhp (automatic) and 375-390rwhp (5-speed) on a Dynojet and slightly less than that on a Mustang Dyno. I've yet to actually see one put out the 405rwhp claimed (and that figure were actually from an old 1.7L, not the 2.1L) by Kenne Bell. Kenne Bell adds a ton of timing and race fuel during their dyno testing, which is why they're able to advertise such great numbers, but in any real world situation you wouldn't make near that amount of power.....at least not without breaking something.

The 2.1L still does have the greater potential, I will agree with that. And its a quality blower....I just thought we should clear the air on their realistic average power capabilities.

[eviligloo]

Originally Posted by Gearbanger 101

Kenne Bell adds a ton of timing and race fuel during their dyno testing, which is why they're able to advertise such great numbers, but in any real world situation you wouldn't make near that amount of power.....at least not without breaking something.

This is a very good point and why you can't necessarily compare results with what I have.

My timing was 14 degrees which is the stock saleen timing. That's a VERY important difference. I went conservative on purpose because I'm on stock internals. If I want a paper to read 400....then I'd increase the timing (or tune it for race gas) and go more aggressive. I'd rather keep my car safe and have peace of mind when I floor it.

The tech drove it 35 minutes to the dyno....strapped it down and then fired it up (no cooldown). We did it this way in order to compare results with the last time I had a tune. Why did we do it this way? Because we wanted to compare it to how it was done last time on the same dyno.

There were no tricks on my dyno runs. No race gas, no nitrous shot, no packing ice or letting it cool overnight on a dyno to inflate the numbers. Just increased the tune for added air and still left the timing at stock (14 degrees). The air temperature and humidity were almost exactly identical. Whenever you see people add an intercooler or a tork tech intake or a CAI.....shops typically increase the timing which increases the gains. I left HP and torque on the table in the interest of extreme caution.


It's pointless to compare a dyno sheet against someone else's because dyno sheets are very easily manipulated......but here you go. Have at it!

PS-potential HP of 500 with a KB system are a moot point for me. Like I said....I was looking for 390 on a safe tune and I have no intention of forging in the future.

PSS- The throttle response with the single blade oval throttle body is like night and day. I really can't describe how much quicker my car feels...even compared to my old accufab 75mm.

(attached)

[mat82284]

Originally Posted by Gearbanger 101

Your average Kenne Bell 2.1L will put out 360-375rwhp (automatic) and 375-390rwhp (5-speed) on a Dynojet and slightly less than that on a Mustang Dyno. I've yet to actually see one put out the 405rwhp claimed (and that figure were actually from an old 1.7L, not the 2.1L) by Kenne Bell. Kenne Bell adds a ton of timing and race fuel during their dyno testing, which is why they're able to advertise such great numbers, but in any real world situation you wouldn't make near that amount of power.....at least not without breaking something.

The 2.1L still does have the greater potential, I will agree with that. And its a quality blower....I just thought we should clear the air on their realistic average power capabilities.

We'll that all depends on the dyno they use and the tune they use. I have seen some kenne bells on a non kenne bell tune reach 400hp but then again thats on a dynojet. dynojet's read 12-15% higher on the numbers then a mustang dyno. A mustang dyno puts resistance on the wheels so its the real world hp you would see on the road. I'm all for both of those dynos, but i wouldn't get a tune on a dynojet, the tune would be more accurate and safe on a mustang dyno because your accounting for real world physics. Now mustang dyno's arn't perfect and are no way exactly like real world conditions but are very close.

I wasn't really comparing average power. It was more about max potential of the blower. Everyone starts out wanting 330, 350 hp then 400hp. Then later on its 500, 600, and so on. It happens and everyone says they will be fine at 400 but they will get used to it, then want more. I went through this as well. I never planned on rebuilding my engine but the option came up, and i already had 100k on the odometer so i figured it was a better investment over upgrading a saleen unit.

Originally Posted by eviligloo

This is a very good point and why you can't necessarily compare results with what I have.

My timing was 14 degrees which is the stock saleen timing. That's a VERY important difference. I went conservative on purpose because I'm on stock internals. If I want a paper to read 400....then I'd increase the timing (or tune it for race gas) and go more aggressive. I'd rather keep my car safe and have peace of mind when I floor it.

The tech drove it 35 minutes to the dyno....strapped it down and then fired it up (no cooldown). We did it this way in order to compare results with the last time I had a tune. Why did we do it this way? Because we wanted to compare it to how it was done last time on the same dyno.

There were no tricks on my dyno runs. No race gas, no nitrous shot, no packing ice or letting it cool overnight on a dyno to inflate the numbers. Just increased the tune for added air and still left the timing at stock (14 degrees). The air temperature and humidity were almost exactly identical. Whenever you see people add an intercooler or a tork tech intake or a CAI.....shops typically increase the timing which increases the gains. I left HP and torque on the table in the interest of extreme caution.


It's pointless to compare a dyno sheet against someone else's because dyno sheets are very easily manipulated......but here you go. Have at it!

PS-potential HP of 500 with a KB system are a moot point for me. Like I said....I was looking for 390 on a safe tune and I have no intention of forging in the future.

PSS- The throttle response with the single blade oval throttle body is like night and day. I really can't describe how much quicker my car feels...even compared to my old accufab 75mm.

(attached)

I'm not saying those gains suck or your car is slow. I'm just saying there was other routes you could have taken and ended up with more hp. If anything you can get maybe 400hp from that thing on a dynojet, but you wont ever see that on a mustang dyno. You'll blow the engine at that point.

Trust me that if you own that car long enough, and the engine decides it wants to head out and you replace it with a forged engine (because its only a little more than stock) then you will regret putting all that money into the saleen unit, and wished it had the upgrade capability of the kenne bell.

Just drive safe and remember that as long as your happy that's all that matters. I hope you dont have many miles on your car, if so and your car starts to feel slow i would take it to be checked out.

I had 90k on the odometer when i slapped on my saleen unit. When i got it rebuilt, i found out that the cams jumped 5 degrees, and the timing tentioners were worn down and my engine was about to blow. I thought that i was just getting used to the power because thats what everyone was telling me, but actually my car was getting slower, which is why i wanted 500hp because i thought i was used to it lol. So just keep an eye out, and listen for any issues, check fluids and so on and you should be ok.

[lucianhunt]

Hi' I been looking at the tti post ,and got hooked on this setup,I got a tt inlet in to day, and waiting to install it. I been looking at the dyno numbers that the tt inlet kit was install on, something got to be worng. I got 354rwhp 387rwtq on S/C 424rwhp 449rwtq on 35 shot .I have no cams stock heads, and I have a 66mm pulley, heat exchanger, and inter cooler,And i have not install the tt inlet yet.I'am hoping to see above the 400hp mark on just S/C. I order the inlet only for $499.00, and purchase a 03 cobra throttle body $100.00 on ebay and cobra 4.5 inch JLT cold air intake looks awesome.I will post the # when i install and get it dyno.




Roush Stage 3 Body Kit,18 inch wheels 18x10 rear, 18x9 front, Roush side exhuast, flow masters, long tubes , x-pipe, Saleen series 2 S/C 35 shot nitrous, 3.90 gear, focus fuel pump, kenne bell boost-a-pump,66mm S/C pulley, 75mm idler pulley, large heat exchanger, inter-cooler,4000w kenwood system,
Dyno by Tim at MPH Catersville Ga, 364rwhp 387rwtq, on my supercharger tune tune # 1 35 shot of nitrous, 449rwhp, 479rwtq.

[Gearbanger 101]

Originally Posted by 2FNFAST

Still waiting to get myne to a dyno to get the finished tune.... Im on a stiege ported eaton with a modestly ported manifold, home job intercooler fix, tork tech inlet/tbody and bbk 03 cobra cai, 42lb injectors, 90mm maf, kb bap, full exhaust, upgraded heat exchanger... Hoping for 380+, and ill be happy as ****. My cars a vert and is mainly a looker, but my procharged setup @ 360 horse was damn fun, and had none of the low end like the heaton... Will update once the 4 feet of snow melt and i make it to a dyno for numbers! If i don't like what I see next step is blower cams and possibly Trickflows new heads...

I see you decided to give up on the Tork Tech project?

For Sale: Tork Tech Inlet and Ported Blower upgrade for your 99-04 Saleen

[2FNFAST]

Not necessarily give up, needed more is the right answer. I bought a forged longblock, ported heads, blower cams and a kb 2.2 that will fit on the saleen manifold. Going for 650 plus now... m90 won't cut it.

[lucianhunt]

Hi' has any one put the new tork tech inlet on with out taking the supercharger off, i tried but the far botton nut is hard to get off, and wordering how bad is going back on with the inlet being so big.

[2FNFAST]

putting it on without the blower off would be a nightmare. Spend the extra couple hours to take it off and save yourself alot of frustration! While it's off seal up your intercooler! Same effect as a chicane for 1/100 the price.