[Fast05]

Originally Posted by SS02

Automakers September Sales

General Motors: 156,673 Down 43%
Toyota: 126,015 units sold, down 16.1%
Ford Motor Company: 114,655 units sold, down 6%
Honda: 77,229, down 23.3%
Chrysler: 62,197, down 42%
Nissan: 55,393, down 7%

It'll be interesting to see how much further GM's numbers tank when they don't have Pontiac or Saturn. Good thing they have a 40k plug in car on the way.

[Top Speed]

So, how'bout Toyota's big recall? Wasn't it like the largest in history, or something? 3.8 million vehicles!

Anyway, I think it was for something minor, like floormats.

[MeanMike]

Originally Posted by Fast05

It'll be interesting to see how much further GM's numbers tank when they don't have Pontiac or Saturn. Good thing they have a 40k plug in car on the way.

I dont think Pontiac has really been in it for some time, considering my local PBG dealer has had the same G8's on the lot no kidding for almost 8 month's now or wait 10 month's. That is sad because the G8 is actually a decent car.

RIP. Pontiac

[Top Speed]

Originally Posted by MeanMike

I dont think Pontiac has really been in it for some time, considering my local PBG dealer has had the same G8's on the lot no kidding for almost 8 month's now or wait 10 month's. That is sad because the G8 is actually a decent car.

RIP. Pontiac

Actually, Pontiac has been "in it." In fact, they sold DOUBLE the amount of vehicles that Buick had sold in 2008, with the G8 heading the pack. The G8 sold better than Pontiac's "bread and butter" G6!

And gee, then Fritz Henderson says, "There's currently no place for a G8 in GM's line-up," and that was AFTER Bob Lutz said that the G8 was "too good to waste." Bob Lutz had to retract his comments.

So, let's see; no room for a full-sized car with 361 hp that can be scored for $30,000, has decent build quality, great styling (IMO), and performance that rivals that of a 2005 BMW M5? Help me out, because maybe I'm missing something.

[Fast05]

Originally Posted by Top Speed

So, let's see; no room for a full-sized car with 361 hp that can be scored for $30,000, has decent build quality, great styling (IMO), and performance that rivals that of a 2005 BMW M5? Help me out, because maybe I'm missing something.

Yea, you are missing something. It's GM, this won't be the last bonehead decision they make, I'm sure.

[Toms_2003_Stang]

"So, let's see; no room for a full-sized car with 361 hp that can be scored for $30,000, has decent build quality, great styling (IMO), and performance that rivals that of a 2005 BMW M5? Help me out, because maybe I'm missing something."

I wish Ford would bring the Falcon and G series sedan's over

[Top Speed]

Originally Posted by Fast05

Yea, you are missing something. It's GM, this won't be the last bonehead decision they make, I'm sure.

See, I KNEW there was something! Hey, come to think of it, didn't GM do the same thing with the 1984-1987 Buick Grand National, 1989 Turbo TransAm (no continuation for rest of 3rd Generation model years?) 1994-1996 Impala SS, and the 1988-1996 Beretta/Corsica (which were their highest-selling cars)?

Originally Posted by Toms_2003_Stang

"So, let's see; no room for a full-sized car with 361 hp that can be scored for $30,000, has decent build quality, great styling (IMO), and performance that rivals that of a 2005 BMW M5? Help me out, because maybe I'm missing something."

I wish Ford would bring the Falcon and G series sedan's over

That Falcon sure is nice. It sure couldn't hurt to step in where GM stepped out. Well, I guess they sort of did with the new Taurus SHO...sort of...

[verbwiser]

Originally Posted by newbstang05

i'm pretty late to post in this thread i know lol...but you're not the only camaro on the forum now (i don't know how many others there are by now too though)

sorry everyone i sold off my '05 modded v6 and got a new camaro ss 6M because i had a little money built up and wanted to buy something nice before i graduate college and i get shipped off in the air force (i'm commissioning in as an officer next summer)

i have always loved mustangs and am really just a true fan of american muscle so please don't hate guys...

p.s. i can't wait till the coyote engine comes out i'm actually considering getting a mustang too so i can't wait to see what happens

That car looks dead sexy.

This car just defies logic to me. I see those pictures and think it's gorgeous, but when I see the thing in real life, I just don't like it.

This is a car that I WANTED to love. But for some reason, when I actually see it, something gets lost in the transition.

I saw one at K-mart the other day (no lame comments about k-mart and camaro's) and it was black, just like the one in the picture, but it didn't look nearly as good as the one does in pictures. Beats the hell out of me why this is.

I really wanted that 400 plus horsepower.......I knew I would hate the interior on the camaro, but I thought I would love the exterior.

Before seeing the car, the only thing I didn't like about it was how it was attached to that goofy movie.

I wish they could have put the camaro power in the mustang. Maybe next year it will finally happen.

[Top Speed]

Originally Posted by verbwiser

That car looks dead sexy.

This car just defies logic to me. I see those pictures and think it's gorgeous, but when I see the thing in real life, I just don't like it.

This is a car that I WANTED to love. But for some reason, when I actually see it, something gets lost in the transition.

I saw one at K-mart the other day (no lame comments about k-mart and camaro's) and it was black, just like the one in the picture, but it didn't look nearly as good as the one does in pictures. Beats the hell out of me why this is.

I really wanted that 400 plus horsepower.......I knew I would hate the interior on the camaro, but I thought I would love the exterior.

Before seeing the car, the only thing I didn't like about it was how it was attached to that goofy movie.

I wish they could have put the camaro power in the mustang. Maybe next year it will finally happen.

Well, I don't wanna bash on the guy's new ride, because it's a nice car if it's your thing, but personally, I don't like it, and I share your opinion on how they're photogenic, but other than that...meh.

I was just at one of our Camaro club meets last weekend and one of our members has a new 5th Gen. We all had our 4th Gens backed into spaces, and right smack in the middle was the 5th Gen, and it was riding high...literally.

As I stood there looking at the 5th sitting next to the 4ths, I couldn't help but think to myself how ridiculous the 5th Gen looked amongst the 4ths; a lack of style, shape, aerodynamics, and it looked just plain clumsy. IMO, the Camaro is one of those cars that looks good as long as there isn't anything else with the slightest hint of style parked near it.

[SS02]

I disagree, I ve seen plenty in person and think the cars just amazing !! And I have a 4th Gen

[Top Speed]

Originally Posted by SS02

I disagree, I ve seen plenty in person and think the cars just amazing !!

Clearly you've never seen one parked next to any other generation of Camaro...

[Fast05]

Originally Posted by Top Speed

Clearly you've never seen one parked next to any other generation of Camaro...

Or maybe a Mustang

[Top Speed]

Originally Posted by Fast05

Or maybe a Mustang

The Mustang II would be an exception, but even that car looks better than a 5th Generation Camaro. At least its body curves look right...

[rpburnette]

Just goes to show we all have different opinions. For me, the 4th gen Camaro is one of the ugliest cars made. The 5th gen Camaro while not perfect looks great to me. The 2010 Mustang looks great except for the rear. I just don't see how Ford did such a good job on the rest of the car and than stopped at the rear.

[Top Speed]

Originally Posted by rpburnette

Just goes to show we all have different opinions. For me, the 4th gen Camaro is one of the ugliest cars made. The 5th gen Camaro while not perfect looks great to me. The 2010 Mustang looks great except for the rear. I just don't see how Ford did such a good job on the rest of the car and than stopped at the rear.

Your opinion of what the rear looks like is just that, an opinion. Ford was going for the look of the Fastbacks. Whether they failed is a matter of opinion, but I've seen some with decklid panels that look alright.

As for 4th Generation Camaros being the ugliest, I'm not a real big fan of the 1998-2002 models, but the 1996-1997 SS models are smokin'.

If you want to talk about ugly, look no further than a 1994-2004 Mustang. The only ones that looked remotely good were the Cobras. I've never seen such a mish-mash of ill-fitting body panels as on the 1999-2004 models.

[newbstang05]

Originally Posted by Top Speed

Well, I don't wanna bash on the guy's new ride, because it's a nice car if it's your thing, but personally, I don't like it, and I share your opinion on how they're photogenic, but other than that...meh.

I was just at one of our Camaro club meets last weekend and one of our members has a new 5th Gen. We all had our 4th Gens backed into spaces, and right smack in the middle was the 5th Gen, and it was riding high...literally.

As I stood there looking at the 5th sitting next to the 4ths, I couldn't help but think to myself how ridiculous the 5th Gen looked amongst the 4ths; a lack of style, shape, aerodynamics, and it looked just plain clumsy. IMO, the Camaro is one of those cars that looks good as long as there isn't anything else with the slightest hint of style parked near it.

Lol guys you can bash all you want! In the end I'm a Mustang guy who switched to a new Camaro and then posted about it on a Mustang forum...Who wouldn't expect a little bashing?! hahahaha It's all good I'm secure enough in myself to take it...In the end this is America and we have freedom of speech and if you really think about it competition and things you hate (the Camaro hahahaha) unite the Mustang guys, otherwise we might run out of things to talk about eventually and start hating on each other

For me, this car is amazing! I've never driven a faster car and believe me I had a major concern about the weight (I went from an '05 Mustang to this...big weight difference)...But the first time I drove it my concerns about weight were put to rest by the engine when I tried my first 0-60 run (although the Mustang has better exhaust feedback [i.e. sweet! lol])...For me, it gets my adrenaline running and it's enjoyable and that's all I can really ask for and want out of my car until I go off into the Air Force...I wanted something I could enjoy for a while because I don't know if I'll be able to take it with me if I get stationed overseas, so this car has done that for me so far!

And like I already said...I'm already considering buying a Mustang too - so take that in to consideration before too much bashing! Ha I wonder how bad my insurance would stick it to me being 21, unmarried, and with 2 400+ horsepower cars (assuming the coyote engine comes next year...hopefully! ) hahaha...Then again I might just buy an older GT or GT500...Something in me just likes variety

[SS02]

Originally Posted by Top Speed

Clearly you've never seen one parked next to any other generation of Camaro...

Actually I have...and still would chose the 5th gen everytime......remeber its an opinion, and it seems when differed with yours......you just cant stand it, or you wouldnt respond negativly to every positive 5th gen camaro post.....

You not liking the 5th gen is fine with me.....wont change my mind about owning one....as far as the Sn-95 stangs I really liked them, more a fan of the old 60s models but I think besides the Mustang IIs, the Mustangs have always had great styling.

[Top Speed]

Originally Posted by newbstang05

Lol guys you can bash all you want! In the end I'm a Mustang guy who switched to a new Camaro and then posted about it on a Mustang forum...Who wouldn't expect a little bashing?! hahahaha It's all good I'm secure enough in myself to take it...In the end this is America and we have freedom of speech and if you really think about it competition and things you hate (the Camaro hahahaha) unite the Mustang guys, otherwise we might run out of things to talk about eventually and start hating on each other

For me, this car is amazing! I've never driven a faster car and believe me I had a major concern about the weight (I went from an '05 Mustang to this...big weight difference)...But the first time I drove it my concerns about weight were put to rest by the engine when I tried my first 0-60 run (although the Mustang has better exhaust feedback [i.e. sweet! lol])...For me, it gets my adrenaline running and it's enjoyable and that's all I can really ask for and want out of my car until I go off into the Air Force...I wanted something I could enjoy for a while because I don't know if I'll be able to take it with me if I get stationed overseas, so this car has done that for me so far!

And like I already said...I'm already considering buying a Mustang too - so take that in to consideration before too much bashing! Ha I wonder how bad my insurance would stick it to me being 21, unmarried, and with 2 400+ horsepower cars (assuming the coyote engine comes next year...hopefully! ) hahaha...Then again I might just buy an older GT or GT500...Something in me just likes variety

So what do you do that you're 21 years old and can afford to buy $60,000 worth of cars? I'd really like to know, because I'm in the wrong field.

Originally Posted by SS02

Actually I have...and still would chose the 5th gen everytime......remeber its an opinion, and it seems when differed with yours......you just cant stand it, or you wouldnt respond negativly to every positive 5th gen camaro post.....

You not liking the 5th gen is fine with me.....wont change my mind about owning one....as far as the Sn-95 stangs I really liked them, more a fan of the old 60s models but I think besides the Mustang IIs, the Mustangs have always had great styling.

Wow! You are SO right! Have no fear. I think the 1998-2002 Camaro's styling sucks, too. What's it like to drive a car that looks like a catfish?

[MeanMike]

Originally Posted by Top Speed

So what do you do that you're 21 years old and can afford to buy $60,000 worth of cars? I'd really like to know, because I'm in the wrong field.



Wow! You are SO right! Have no fear. I think the 1998-2002 Camaro's styling sucks, too. What's it like to drive a car that looks like a catfish?

I have to disagree the 93-97 Camaro's are by far worse than the 5th gen IMO there probably the worst Camaro ever made. But when you talk about the 98-02, now that's a car. Allthough I would prefer a 02 ws6 over the Camaro any day.

[Top Speed]

Originally Posted by MeanMike

I have to disagree the 93-97 Camaro's are by far worse than the 5th gen IMO there probably the worst Camaro ever made. But when you talk about the 98-02, now that's a car. Allthough I would prefer a 02 ws6 over the Camaro any day.

Now that right there is just plain...FUNNY! You're the first person I've ever talked to that doesn't like the 1993-1997 style better than the 1998-2002, but, to each his/her own. I mean, besides the 5th Gens, I would have marked the 1974 Z28 as the ugliest Camaros ever built, but that's me.

As for the 1993-1997, why are they the worst ever made? The styling? Performance? What? Or are you just mad because they're nearly just as fast as a stock 2009 Mustang GT and they're 12 years older at the very least?

[MeanMike]

Originally Posted by Top Speed

Now that right there is just plain...FUNNY! You're the first person I've ever talked to that doesn't like the 1993-1997 style better than the 1998-2002, but, to each his/her own. I mean, besides the 5th Gens, I would have marked the 1974 Z28 as the ugliest Camaros ever built, but that's me.

As for the 1993-1997, why are they the worst ever made? The styling? Performance? What? Or are you just mad because they're nearly just as fast as a stock 2009 Mustang GT and they're 12 years older at the very least?

Because IMO they are just plain ugly , it has nothing to do with power. I dont buy my car's based on that, you can make anything fast. I wont say your wrong, but I dont see many of those year's on the road, so that must mean something . Any how I'm not bashing your's, or your choice, I just dont care for them.

[MeanMike]

Originally Posted by Top Speed

Actually, Pontiac has been "in it." In fact, they sold DOUBLE the amount of vehicles that Buick had sold in 2008, with the G8 heading the pack. The G8 sold better than Pontiac's "bread and butter" G6!

And gee, then Fritz Henderson says, "There's currently no place for a G8 in GM's line-up," and that was AFTER Bob Lutz said that the G8 was "too good to waste." Bob Lutz had to retract his comments.

So, let's see; no room for a full-sized car with 361 hp that can be scored for $30,000, has decent build quality, great styling (IMO), and performance that rivals that of a 2005 BMW M5? Help me out, because maybe I'm missing something.

Just because they sold more than Buick does'nt mean anything considering they have'nt sold any Buick's, it's not real hard to do.

I agree the G8 is a great car I kind of miss mine. The only thing it is lacking are the option's and the interior could have been a bit more interesting.

[Top Speed]

Originally Posted by MeanMike

Because IMO they are just plain ugly , it has nothing to do with power. I dont buy my car's based on that, you can make anything fast. I wont say your wrong, but I dont see many of those year's on the road, so that must mean something . Any how I'm not bashing your's, or your choice, I just dont care for them.

You'll be seeing quite a few of them in time. Just like 3rd Gens are really starting to gain popularity with the "restoration crowd,'" so will the 4ths. The reason being is because all of the classics cost an arm and a leg.

You don't see many of them because they're either wrecked, or they've become LS1 nut-huggers. Trust me, there are plenty of them out there, just like there are plenty of Fox Mustangs out there that are rarely seen anymore...well, at least where I live.

[Top Speed]

Originally Posted by MeanMike

Just because they sold more than Buick does'nt mean anything considering they have'nt sold any Buick's, it's not real hard to do.

I agree the G8 is a great car I kind of miss mine. The only thing it is lacking are the option's and the interior could have been a bit more interesting.

I wish I had $40,000, because I'd be all over the G8 GXP. FWIW, come the end of this year, they can probably be had at real good prices because Pontiac is being cancelled.

[MeanMike]

Sure if you can even find one they only ended up making like 2 or 3 thousand of the GXP's if I remember right.