[strtrcr50]

Originally Posted by DocG2828

These threads are great. Take a news article, not even a well written one, and run with it!

In many areas, supplies of the vaccine are being given to those most at risk of having complications with the flu. When supplies are more readily available, it will be open to anyone that wants it.

Soo....what is the big deal around here?

Soo.... Will you be getting a swine flu shot? If you have children, how about them? Line up with the rest of the sheep and get stuck... I'm not sure why you are critizing the article. It reported factually accurate information.

[Venom351R]

Originally Posted by Dusstbuster

One thing I considered in passing... H1N1 has been made to be this HUGE deal yet in reality its death toll is not really much greater than the death toll from other common diseases. Could the White House be using H1N1 to somehow try push through its version of healthcare reform?

Yes. The flu kills hundreds of thousands of people a year across the globe. but only now this particular strain gets all the attention b/c it targets people w/ underlying health issues....just like how the regular flu would

Its all just scare tactics. And they call the right the fear mongers

[DocG2828]

Originally Posted by strtrcr50

Soo.... Will you be getting a swine flu shot? If you have children, how about them? Line up with the rest of the sheep and get stuck... I'm not sure why you are critizing the article. It reported factually accurate information.

Nope, and nope. I'm not criticizing the potential dangers of the shot itself.

And calling them sheep is just a passive aggressive way to say everyone that does not agree with you is stupid. There are many very intelligent and educated people getting the shots. Many that understand the vaccine is made the exact same way as the normal flu one, only with the different virus. Sure, there are contamination concerns, it may not be fully tested....nothing any different than the antibiotics you take sometimes or many other things you probably do put into your body.

If your child died of the swine flu and in 5 years we realize the vaccine was perfectly safe and actually worked.....would you feel any guilt about not giving your child something that woudl have saved them?

Merely commenting on the ruckus about the First Kids getting it, not getting it, getting it, got it stuff. The original article did not seem to report the information about the First Kids and the Prez's intentions very clearly. There also seems to be a lot of confusion as to who can currently get a swine flu shot. There is no where in my area where I could get one right now even if I wanted one. Maybe in some areas you can.

Besides, tell me this, what "well written article" uses the author's personal family's experiences as proof of his statement.

[strtrcr50]

I didn't say it was well written. I said it was accurate.
If 0bama is going to tell us the swine flu is a national emergency and we should all take the flu shot, he should lead by example. Not exempting himself, michelle, sasha, and malia.
I have possted links above where they are vaccinating school children. Apparently, in this area, there is at least enough to hit the schools with it.

[Dusstbuster]

One thing I wonder with the anti-shot crew though is why are people so against getting the H1N1 shot? Will I get it? No, I don't get flu shots or anything like that because I never get sick and if I do I'd rather my body just fight it off on its own.

That being said...why do people make it out to seem like getting the H1N1 shot is like being injected with some top secret serum that will make you vote Democrat and do your governments bidding? It's just a shot, and like every other shot, it contains a deactivated or crippled form of the virus it is intended to vaccinate against. Why such the uproar over this particular shot?? Who cares...If you want to get the shot great, go get it. If you don't want it, great, stay home and don't get it!

[sphinx]

Originally Posted by Dusstbuster

One thing I wonder with the anti-shot crew though is why are people so against getting the H1N1 shot? Will I get it? No, I don't get flu shots or anything like that because I never get sick and if I do I'd rather my body just fight it off on its own.

That being said...why do people make it out to seem like getting the H1N1 shot is like being injected with some top secret serum that will make you vote Democrat and do your governments bidding? It's just a shot, and like every other shot, it contains a deactivated or crippled form of the virus it is intended to vaccinate against. Why such the uproar over this particular shot?? Who cares...If you want to get the shot great, go get it. If you don't want it, great, stay home and don't get it!

Quickest thing I could find that sums it up.

Excerpted from The Vaccine Guide, North Atlantic Books, 2002

Everyone knows about the flu and the flu vaccine. What people do not know is that flu vaccines are nearly useless in preventing flu, they will cause the flu, and they often result in nervous system damage that can take years for the body to repair. Other nations chuckle at Americans' infatuation with the flu vaccine. The joke would indeed be funny, if it weren't for the damaging effects caused by the vaccine.

The history of the flu vaccine reads like one stumbling fiasco after another. Take an example. Ever wonder how the particular viruses are chosen for next year's vaccine? The answer could be drawn from a 1930s film noir of Shanghai villainy. Scientists kill migrating ducks in Asia, culture the viruses and put those in next year's vaccine, because they have seen an association between bird and pig viruses and the following year's human flu epidemics. Perhaps this desperate guesswork is responsible for so many years when the flu vaccine's viruses had nothing in common with circulating viruses. According to a CDC report of the 1994-1995 flu season, 87 percent of type A influenza virus samples were not similar to the year's vaccine, and 76 percent of type B virus were not similar to the virus in that year's vaccine. During the 1992-1993 season, 84 percent of samples for the predominant type A virus were not similar to the virus in the vaccine.

Here is a list of the most common side effects of the flu vaccine as stated by the CDC – fever, fatigue, muscle aches, and headache. Sound familiar?

The primary targeted population for flu vaccine is the elderly, yet the vaccine is notoriously ineffective in preventing disease in that population. According to the CDC, the effectiveness of flu vaccine in preventing illness among elderly persons residing in nursing homes is 30-40 percent (CDC, 2001b). Other studies have shown an even lower efficacy of 0-36 percent (averaging 21 percent). The CDC proudly notes that for those elderly persons living outside of nursing homes, flu vaccine is 30-70 percent effective in preventing hospitalization for pneumonia and influenza. Yet the Department of Human and Health Services found that, with or without a flu shot, pneumonia and influenza hospitalization rates for the elderly are less than one percent during the influenza season. Regardless of vaccination status, 99 percent of the elderly recover from the flu without being hospitalized. The ineffectiveness of flu shots in the elderly led the CDC in 2000 to begin recommending the shots for all persons age 50 years and older. The rationale being that one third of Americans have a risk factor or chronic disease that puts them at risk of increased morbidity from the flu.

Annual flu vaccination is recommended for those individuals with asthma and other chronic respiratory and cardiovascular disorders. However, those people with impaired immune systems are the most likely to suffer adverse autoimmune reactions.

Children are the next frontier for the lucrative flu vaccine campaign. Vaccination is currently recommended for children over six months of age with high-risk medical conditions, but is not recommended for healthy children. Experts in the field suggest that parents of children age six months to two years "be informed that their children are at risk for serious complications of influenza, and allowed to make individual informed decisions regarding influenza immunization for their children" (Neuzil et al., 2001). This statement was made by Marie Griffin (and others), the same author who was implicated in the flawed study that supposedly exonerated the pertussis vaccine of nervous system damage. She is also a paid consultant to one of the world's largest vaccine manufacturers, Burroughs Wellcome. The children's market is the next big hope for vaccine campaigners. A 1998 working group began investigations to not only support, but also to "recommend" flu vaccine for young children.

The next big change in flu vaccines will be the introduction of a live intranasal flu vaccine, a dose that is actually sprayed into the nose. This vaccine has already been tested on young children. Live intranasal vaccine was found 93 percent effective in preventing influenza in children age one to six years old (Belshe et al., 1998). Unanswered questions about the live vaccine include the possibility of transmitting other, more dangerous viruses through the vaccine, the possibility of enhanced replication of the attenuated virus in individuals with compromised immune systems, and the possibility of bacterial superinfection if the replicating live virus disrupts nasal membranes (Subbarao, 2000). This vaccine waits in the wings for its chance as the next big gun in the vaccine arsenal aimed at our children.

Guillain-Barré Syndrome

In 1976 the flu vaccine was dealt a near fatal blow when reports appeared that the vaccine caused Guillain-Barré syndrome (GBS), an autoimmune nervous system reaction characterized by unstable gait, loss of sensation, and loss of muscle control. A mass vaccination program was mounted that year by the US Government, and 45 million Americans received the swine flu vaccine. Statistical studies have confirmed a causal relationship between the vaccine and GBS. During that year the rate of GBS in Ohio was 13.3 per 1,000,000 in vaccine recipients compared to 2.6 per 1,000,000 in nonrecipients (Marks & Halpin, 1980). A follow-up study also showed a significantly increased incidence of GBS during the first 6 weeks following receipt of the vaccine in patients residing in two other states. The rate of GBS was 8.6 per million vaccinees in Michigan and 9.7 per million vaccinees in Minnesota (Safranek et al., 1991). This episode, which became known as the swine flu catastrophe, left doctors extremely reluctant to administer flu vaccine, and shattered the public trust in the flu vaccine campaign.

The association between GBS and flu shots was not unique to the swine flu. Earlier reports had also summarized cases of nervous system disorders occurring soon after the flu vaccine (Flewett & Hoult, 1958; Horner, 1958). More recently, an increased risk for GBS occurring in patients during the six weeks following the flu vaccine was revealed in the 1992-1993 and the 1993-1994 flu seasons (Lasky et al., 1998).

Pregnancy

One of the most bizarre twists on the flu vaccine saga is the CDC recommendation of 2001 that all pregnant women receive the vaccine in their second or third trimester. This recommendation even has doctors confused, since the vaccine remains a category C drug (unknown risk for pregnancy). No adequate studies have been conducted to monitor safety of the vaccine for mother and fetus. The only studies of adverse effects in pregnancy were conducted in the 1970s (Heinonen et al., 1973; Sumaya & Gibbs, 1979). Some flu vaccines still contain mercury as a preservative, despite a 1998 FDA instruction to remove mercury from all drugs. According to the CDC, two groups are most vulnerable to methylmercury¾the fetus and children ages 14 and younger. An article published in the American Journal of Epidemiology in 1999 stated, "the greatest susceptibility to methylmercury neurotoxicity occurs during late gestation" (Grandjean et al., 1999). How did CDC committee members determine that flu vaccines were safe for pregnant women? They did not. The committee, despite its own recommendation, states, "additional data are needed to confirm the safety of vaccination during pregnancy" (CDC, 2001b).



Flu Facts

·Flu vaccine manufacturers are notoriously inaccurate at predicting the appropriate viruses to use in an individual year's vaccine, rendering the vaccine ineffective.

·Flu vaccine is relatively ineffective in those patients most at risk of flu complications.

·The vaccine has caused GBS in recipients during several different flu seasons.

·Those most at risk of flu complications probably share a higher risk of adverse reactions to the flu vaccine as well.

A Personal Strategy

Avoid the flu vaccine. Risks are not worth the slim chance of vaccine effectiveness.

[6Stang7]

It is absolutely amazing how utterly ignorant you guys can be. In a way it makes me sad.

No one here is a doctor, so anything is merely an opinion. You're failing to grasp what part of H1N1 are overkill and what parts are a serious issue.

Yes, the seasonal flu kills more people per year then the swine flu has killed so far. However, H1N1 has the potential to explode in the number of people that become infected, giving it the opportunity to kill many more then the seasonal flu. When you reduce the number of people that can be infected, you reduce the ability of the virus to spread.

At the end of the day, no one here is a doctor. Go to your family doctor and talk to them. Seriously.

[Wart]

Originally Posted by strtrcr50

The hypocrisy abounds.

Is THIS your reference?





And you Whine about Huffington Post ...

[Wart]

Originally Posted by sphinx

Quickest thing I could find that sums it up.

Excerpted from The Vaccine Guide, North Atlantic Books, 2002

A seven year old reference for a strain of flu that didn't exist at the time,

And we all know there have been absolutely no advancements in any kind of medical, tracking or other pertinent technology in that time.



Only thing I can figure is you didn't look very hard.

[strtrcr50]

Two posts in a row with no Shrub reference? Wart, you're slipping.
6Stang7, thank you for that viewpoint from an enlightened progressive. I'd forgotten how ignorant the proles are. In regards to our other discussion, I looked everywhere I could and I couldn't find anything that clearly states that proof of citizenship is not required. \
Both of you, enjoy your swine flu shots.

[Dusstbuster]

Originally Posted by Wart

A seven year old reference for a strain of flu that didn't exist at the time,

And we all know there have been absolutely no advancements in any kind of medical, tracking or other pertinent technology in that time.



Only thing I can figure is you didn't look very hard.

While I am sure advances have been made, I do recall seeing recently that the general vaccine production method hasn't really changed since vaccines were first created....

[strtrcr50]

Not only that Dusstbuster, but just think about how well it's been tested.

[sphinx]

Originally Posted by Wart

A seven year old reference for a strain of flu that didn't exist at the time,

And we all know there have been absolutely no advancements in any kind of medical, tracking or other pertinent technology in that time.



Only thing I can figure is you didn't look very hard.

Since you think things have changed so much since 02' here are some current links for you. Want to try to disprove them?

History and Progress of Vaccine Development,Immunotechnology,Louis Pasteur,VaccineTechnology,Human Immunodeficiency Virus (HIV)

Does the Vaccine Matter?

H1N1 Vaccine Risks

Legal Immunity Set for H1N1 Vaccine Makers

H1N1 Virus: Manufactured
or Result of “Human Error”?

Swine Flu Hype: Political Lies and
Media Disinformation are Rampant

So have YOU gotten your shot yet?

[JH96GT]

Interesting issue.

[poneypower89]

thought this news report was relevant.

YouTube - Flu Shot Permanently Disables Washington Redskins cheerleader Desiree Jennings

[grey5.0beast]

Yeah because I'd really like to risk my nervous system for eternity to be immune from a 5 day flu. **** THAT

[strtrcr50]

I'm just hoping that fearless leader, wife, children, and all those criticising those who don't want the shot make sure they get the vaccine. Lead by example.