Electrical Fan Spins Intermittently

[JordanB21]

My fan spins intermittenly, as stated.

Right now the car is running with the a/c on max and the fan is spinning (waiting for it to magically stop ).

I started the car today to see if the fan would spin on its own and it didn't. I pulled up the CCRM and did nothing with it other than disconnect and reconnect it. Started the car up and the fan was spinning, went inside (left the car on while I was inside), came back and the fan stopped.

I turned off the car, came back to it in 10 minutes, turned it on (again with max a/c) and it was spinning. and that's where I am right now with it still spinning.

Ideas on this bitch of a problem?
Thanks, Jordan

 

[JordanB21]

I turned off the a/c, the fan ran for about 45 seconds or so and then stopped spinning, turned the a/c back on and it started to spin again.

Update: Repeated test with a/c on, turned it off, 45 seconds or so it stayed on again, then stopped. Moved a/c control to 'vent' setting, nothing happened. moved to max a/c setting, fan kicked on.

Update Update: Repeated test, consisten results again!

The fan only spins when max a/c is on. It seemed when I turned off the a/c the fan was slowing down, would kick a bit, then slow down, kick then stop.

This kind of makes sense since I never ran with the a/c on since I liked to drive with the windows down. Seems the low fan isn't spinning, though the car was hot the high speed fan wouldn't run unless the max a/c fan was on either.

 

[toyman]

The factory settings are for the high fan to come on with the A/C on and at speeds less that about 48 mph or if the coolant temp reaches about 230*F. Low fan comes on when coolant temp reaches 210*-220*F and will stay on until the coolant temp falls to about 200*F.

 

[JordanB21]

I've had issues in the past where the car would begin to run hot, and I would have to get out and check the fan and it would be off. So I had to park it.
I would happily drive it around town, except I have possibly a bad ground to my temperature and fuel gauges so I can't really track the temperature when it rises and I don't want to risk it switching off for whatever possibly issue might be present or not.

 

[JordanB21]

I fixed the temperature gauge and I see that the temp on the highway rests at the middle, in stop and go traffic the fan is clearly off as when I check it it isn't spinning and it picks up passed the L close to the red, in which case I shut it down.

I tested the fan, it's good.
Ideas? CCRM, temperature sensor it relies on?

To confirm, the temperature sensor for the computer is on the passenger side, with a tube connected to it runningback to the car, right?
Thanks.

 

[toyman]

That sounds right. The hose running back is to the heater core. But, you need to verify the actual temps before focusing on the rad fan function and controls. It may be that everything is operating normally except for your dash gauge.

 

[JordanB21]

Would a thermostat cap for the radiator be accurate enough in determining temperatures?
Like this:http://www.autopartswarehouse.com/d...l?apwcid=productads-apwidvUexMF2-apwidEg1v8c7

or do I really need to tap the other temperature sensor with a gauge?

 

[toyman]

A cap that reads temps would be good enough for your purposes. If your gauge is at the "L" you would expect the temp to be near the 230* plus range. If the cap reads 200* then it's reasonable to assume the dash reading means nothing. As mentioned earlier the fan will come on somewhere around 210* and stay on until the ECT signals the PCM the temp has cooled to about 200*.

 

[JordanB21]

I'll go an order it up, and get back here with the results.
In the case that the gauge means nothing, it would be safe to assume the temperature sending unit on the driver side has gone bad?

 

[99FiveOh]

I don't think it's any of those things. Check the plug I'll bet it's charred on the low speed side. Same thing happened to mine. You can get a brand new plug from a Ford dealership and it should fix you up. I simply got hold of a used 99 plug and added the third prong in the center (the newer fans only use 2 prongs instead of 3). But a new Ford plug would be easier to install.

 

[JordanB21]

I don't think it's any of those things. Check the plug I'll bet it's charred on the low speed side. Same thing happened to mine. You can get a brand new plug from a Ford dealership and it should fix you up. I simply got hold of a used 99 plug and added the third prong in the center (the newer fans only use 2 prongs instead of 3). But a new Ford plug would be easier to install.

Referring to the plug that goes into the fan? I checked all three for power and they all tested (except for the ground of course) good. It looked fine, and had power.

With having power to the fan, the fan tested, that's why I would think the CCRM (Code K, couldn't even find it on ebay-___-), gauge (like toyman thought), or temperature sending unit(s) are messed up.

 

[99FiveOh]

Having enough power to light up a test light and having enough amps to power a fan motor are two different things. What is the condition of the plug? Does it look burnt at all? You must remember that the fan requires a lot of amps to function. Corrosion on the terminal and inside the actual wires acts as an insulator and does not carry electricity. This taxes the electrical system and causes the fan not to work.

 

[JordanB21]

Having enough power to light up a test light and having enough amps to power a fan motor are two different things. What is the condition of the plug? Does it look burnt at all? You must remember that the fan requires a lot of amps to function. Corrosion on the terminal and inside the actual wires acts as an insulator and does not carry electricity. This taxes the electrical system and causes the fan not to work.

I took a double look at it, hoping I missed something, the metal pins on the female and male ends are all in good condition (besides dust bunnies). The wires looked decent, except maybe to the coolant sensor, but that's more than likely unrelated (I'd like to believe). The clip is broken, but i've done wiggle play with it at hot (what I think is hot) temperatures.

So so tired of driving my rent's mazda 6, I miss my gas guzzling baby

Decided to try some testing, and, well. Not good. I had an extra CCRM box but it's a code R, and my mustang's is a code K. So I figured, might as well try it. The fuel pump relays turn out to be the same and the car fires off with the R (not meant for it) on it. It works just like it did before. The fan wouldn't move, I had the car run all the way near the red (based off the gauge cluster). At this point I doubt it's an error in reading the gauge cluster..
When I shut her down cause she was getting so hot, the overflow reservoir started to gurgle, and, finally it poured out the top. Covering the sensor, dripping down onto the ground in decent size portions, steaming into a vapor.

I think the car is getting hot enough at this point, with or without a way to accurately read temperature. The fan did not turn with the a/c on max, and did not turn through any of the testing between the two CCRMs.

I also did check the anti-freeze before starting the experiment, the levels were resting at the cold mark in the overflow reservoir. So it wasn't because there was too much antifreeze.

I'm not entirely sure if I can rule out the CCRM just because they're different codes and the code R was from like a 2001 mustang. But I more so doubt it's that or temperature.

I also read (a few moments ago), that unplugging the ECT would make the PCM respond in a safe mode and have the fan run constantly to protect it, the only difference is the guy said it in response to a sn95 from 96-98. wmburns (he's going to think something like "what's going on in the 5.0 section that I was tagged?")
http://www.stangnet.com/mustang-forums/threads/ccrm-help-pls.859053/


Final note, the antifreeze also did douse the connector to the fan when it poured out the top of the reservoir.

 

[toyman]

Did you test the fan by running 10 ga jumper wires from the battery to the fan side of the connector. There are 3 male pins gnd, hi and lo fan. If the fan comes on then the issue will most likely be the CCRM.

 

[JordanB21]

Did you test the fan by running 10 ga jumper wires from the battery to the fan side of the connector. There are 3 male pins gnd, hi and lo fan. If the fan comes on then the issue will most likely be the CCRM.

I tested both the low and the high, grounded it out on the battery negative terminal, and I used 12 gauge wire, not 10. The rate at which it spun did change between the two.

So I know the motor is good. Maybe I'll finally resort to the old fashion rich guy method of buying and replacing everything, within a sequence of what is suspect.
But yeah, I'll look and see if I can find a new-used CCRM then.

I found a CCRM code K on ebay, the numbers all match except for the last one, mine, off the car is code E9DF-12B577-EA while the other is E9DF-12B577-EB, the single letter difference at the end isn't anything to worry about, is it?
And finally, why the hell do I have a code K CCRM? It doesn't seem like there's any info on them because the 5.0s had a different code box, R I think.

 

[HISSIN50]

I didn't read all of this, but in case it was not mentioned:

If low speed isn’t coming on, but you are getting 12 volts to CCRM Pin 14 at or greater than 208*F and the fuses are intact: With the key on, check CCRM Pins 1 and 2 for twelve volts when the fan should be on. If there’s not 12 volts: Check Pin 15 for ground. Check pins 3 and 4 for constant 12 volts.

 

[99FiveOh]

You cursed me, now I'm having issues! I noticed my A/C starting to blow warm and looked at the temp gauge and it was hovering just over mid point. It usually runs right on the N or below. Unfortunately, every time I'm able to check, the fan starts working again and the temps come back down. But feeling the A/C warm up I knew there was no air passing over the condenser so the fan was indeed off. Also, the first time the temps started climbing with the A/C on, I turned it off and the temps continued to rise. So the fan didn't even come on low or high speed.

 

[JordanB21]

I didn't read all of this, but in case it was not mentioned:

If low speed isn’t coming on, but you are getting 12 volts to CCRM Pin 14 at or greater than 208*F and the fuses are intact: With the key on, check CCRM Pins 1 and 2 for twelve volts when the fan should be on. If there’s not 12 volts: Check Pin 15 for ground. Check pins 3 and 4 for constant 12 volts.

I'll do this testing thanks Hissin

You cursed me, now I'm having issues! I noticed my A/C starting to blow warm and looked at the temp gauge and it was hovering just over mid point. It usually runs right on the N or below. Unfortunately, every time I'm able to check, the fan starts working again and the temps come back down. But feeling the A/C warm up I knew there was no air passing over the condenser so the fan was indeed off. Also, the first time the temps started climbing with the A/C on, I turned it off and the temps continued to rise. So the fan didn't even come on low or high speed.

This way I have someone to work with me on my endeavors into the cooling system! ha. Let me know what you figure out, when I first started it was like that, the fan would start spinning as soon as I'd go to test it and then I wouldn't have anything to test.

 

[99FiveOh]

I plan to remove all control of my fan from the CCRM. I am going to install 2 separate relays to control the fans by themselves. I just have to figure out how to do it without frying the computer and without burning wires. The fan pulls a lot of amps so I need to make sure to use the correct size relays.

If I could put a flex fan on this car I would do it in a heartbeat!

 

[JordanB21]

The most my electrical capabilities allow me to do is add buttons and switches for everything so I can't exactly do that, so fixing it back to stock is the route im pursing.