Quad Shock Debate

[stangzroastrice]

ok, i put in new senstratic shocks, pro3i non adjustable tubular upper control arms, and non adjustable lakewood lower control arms, all with polyurethane bushings. My question is, do i really need these quad shocks? this is going to be my daily driver so i don't want it to handle like **** or anything because yeah i'm focusing more on straight line but also want to make sure my cornering or anything doesn't get ****ed up by taking these out. also i dont want a **** load of wheel hop either so thats another factor to consider. any suggestions as to whether ill need to keep these in or not? let me know !!! thanks

 

[TwinTurbo93]

Take out the quad shocks, as soon as you replaced you upper and lower control arms you made them obsolete.

 

[stangbear427]

Take them out, but don't throw them away- many people have thought what TT93 said and found out they were wrong. There's more to it than that, and unless you want to run huge slicks, they aren't hurting anything.

 

[custom89stang]

I am getting new KYB shocks/struts/ and QUADS on this saturday making way for the rims i am getting, if i put 275's on the rear of my rim (17X8.5) should i just have the guy flip the quad shocks when hes putting the new ones in? or do you think 275's will fit on a KYB normally? in an 89 wheel well?

 

[stangbear427]

Can't hurt to flip 'em either way, can it? May as well!

 

[89MustangGX]

IMO, any decent upper and lower control arm setup shouldn't need the quad shocks anymore. I could see them causing binding in the rear suspension as well, they weren't really designed for the movement of aftermarket pieces.

 

[90mustangGT]

Quad shocks were put there to dampen any excessive movment that causes wheel hop, and these excessive movements were cause by the weak UCA&LCA's the factory installed. More stabalizers/dampeners than actually shocks. If you have aftermarket UCA and LCA's then you really don't need them because you fixed what they were designed to fix.

What I don't understand is the "get rid of them asap" attitude as though the do something bad. If you run bigger tires just flip them.

 

[stangzroastrice]

ok sweet, i won't throw them away but i'll take them off. thanks for the help guys

 

[v8only]

it's a common misunderstanding to believe that good aftermarket control arms will solve the wheel hop issue. this is simply NOT the case most of the time.

Generally, most will remove them and never have a problem, however, there is another percentage of us who launch, hard.

I can launch with my pro3i arms at 2k all day long with no quads, but as soon as I start launching real hard, my arms hop all over the road. My buddy tony with aftermarket arms thought his problem was solved and went so far as to tell me something was wrong with my car if I had wheel hop still. THEN he went to the strip and tried a few HARD launches and got massive wheel hop.

Remove em, but don't throw them away. if you are into racing pretty hardcore, you're gonna need em again.

Leaving them on will NOT result in any binding issues. Lateral movement of the axle and binding issues are concentrated on the rear upper/lower control arms, and the quads will not effect that.

 

[89MustangGX]

it's a common misunderstanding to believe that good aftermarket control arms will solve the wheel hop issue. this is simply NOT the case most of the time.

Generally, most will remove them and never have a problem, however, there is another percentage of us who launch, hard.

I can launch with my pro3i arms at 2k all day long with no quads, but as soon as I start launching real hard, my arms hop all over the road. My buddy tony with aftermarket arms thought his problem was solved and went so far as to tell me something was wrong with my car if I had wheel hop still. THEN he went to the strip and tried a few HARD launches and got massive wheel hop.

Remove em, but don't throw them away. if you are into racing pretty hardcore, you're gonna need em again.

Leaving them on will NOT result in any binding issues. Lateral movement of the axle and binding issues are concentrated on the rear upper/lower control arms, and the quads will not effect that.

It was my opinion, so I'll ask: what is it that makes you think because your Pro3i arms don't eliminate wheel hop that other's don't either -- and that it's a common misconception? Part of the idea of aftermarket control arms is to eliminate that problem. I've seen the same DESIGN arms that launch "hard" and never have wheel hop -- hard enough to break parts, hard enough to break part of the arms even -- still no wheel hop. If that's the case, I would tend to think the wheel hop problem lies in those particular arms you have.

Like I said, it was only my opinion -- but check out some other cars that launch "hard" -- see if it's just cars that run Pro3i or similar control arms that need the quad shocks. Look around at cars that run really fast on stock type suspensions...I don't think you'll find them there. I know I've never seen or heard of a car with UPR or similar suspension that needed them.

As for the quad shocks causing binding, again, it was only my opinion, but I think an arm that eliminates wheel hop, then throw in another piece connected to the frame horizontally, it may not allow the suspension to work as well as it should.

Hey -- I could be wrong, but I have to go by what I see...

 

[powershift351]

a panhard bar, and torque arm set-up will definitely eliminate the quad shocks. One of those two, I can't remember each one. Check out www.maximummotorsports.com/ta.asp , and www.maximummotorsports.com/panhard.asp

 

[Qwk88LX]

Well, I've been running without quad shocks for a while..I don't get wheel hop but then again I don't launch that hard & even when I replace my converter I'll probably launch around 3k. I didn't notice a big difference in handling, actally I like the ride better without the quads. I plan on installing a panhard bar and upper & lower control arms along with some drag shocks.

 

[v8only]

It was my opinion, so I'll ask: what is it that makes you think because your Pro3i arms don't eliminate wheel hop that other's don't either -- and that it's a common misconception? Part of the idea of aftermarket control arms is to eliminate that problem. I've seen the same DESIGN arms that launch "hard" and never have wheel hop -- hard enough to break parts, hard enough to break part of the arms even -- still no wheel hop. If that's the case, I would tend to think the wheel hop problem lies in those particular arms you have.

Like I said, it was only my opinion -- but check out some other cars that launch "hard" -- see if it's just cars that run Pro3i or similar control arms that need the quad shocks. Look around at cars that run really fast on stock type suspensions...I don't think you'll find them there. I know I've never seen or heard of a car with UPR or similar suspension that needed them.

As for the quad shocks causing binding, again, it was only my opinion, but I think an arm that eliminates wheel hop, then throw in another piece connected to the frame horizontally, it may not allow the suspension to work as well as it should.

Hey -- I could be wrong, but I have to go by what I see...

actually, I have the pro3i arms, and my friend I think has southsides. My experience is from just that. I'm no expert, but I've read a whole lot on this. there is a certain suspension guru on another board who is a god at suspensions, and he preaches the same thing all day long, that good arms will not gaurantee elimination of wheel hop. If you want, as a civil debate, i could research and post up a few links, as he's able to go into a technical explanation that I cannot.

 

[Sevan]

Over winter I did my whole suspension, but I want to talk about the Quad shock theory and due to a tight budget I picked up a set of Steeda lowers and Police uppers, but went with stock shocks and springs and I thought once I removed my quads that I would not have any wheel hop, not the case. On easy launchs it was fine until I punch it and it did massive wheel hop. Hard launches were even worse. So its hard to say that by removing the quads you will eliminate wheel hop. My fix was to get an adjustable pinion snubber its a quick and cheap fix and no more wheel hop.

 

[stangbear427]

Because there's more to it than control arms. Wheel hop can also be cured with the right shocks and springs. Every case is different, since every cars springs and shocks have a different degrees of abuse in their history. I've seen separate cars running the same arms, some had hop and some didn't. It just isn't that simple. Every suspension is a package, and there's a lot more to it than any one or two parts. If the package isn't put together right, then there's no guarantees that anything will work right.

 

[85_SS_302_Coupe]

A friend of mine has no quads and stock arms, and he hops like crazy. When he's taking corners if he steps on it hard enough to break the tires lose, you can actually feel the axle shifting sideways under the car.

 

[89MustangGX]

actually, I have the pro3i arms, and my friend I think has southsides. My experience is from just that. I'm no expert, but I've read a whole lot on this. there is a certain suspension guru on another board who is a god at suspensions, and he preaches the same thing all day long, that good arms will not gaurantee elimination of wheel hop. If you want, as a civil debate, i could research and post up a few links, as he's able to go into a technical explanation that I cannot.

Definitely interested...I have no more input than just what I've seen firsthand, and the usual what's been said deal -- but I'll read and analyze anything.

Over winter I did my whole suspension, but I want to talk about the Quad shock theory and due to a tight budget I picked up a set of Steeda lowers and Police uppers, but went with stock shocks and springs and I thought once I removed my quads that I would not have any wheel hop, not the case. On easy launchs it was fine until I punch it and it did massive wheel hop. Hard launches were even worse. So its hard to say that by removing the quads you will eliminate wheel hop. My fix was to get an adjustable pinion snubber its a quick and cheap fix and no more wheel hop.

I've heard of some people using the "police" uppers, which are just factory uppers with stiffer bushings in them. To me, I couldn't see it making that much of a difference, but what do I know anyway? I like the adjustable pinion snubber idea, I've seen them, but have never used them. But, I wonder if it has any other side-effects since it's limiting axle travel by pushing up on the body of the car??? I wonder if it may cause a loss of traction if severe enough???

Because there's more to it than control arms. Wheel hop can also be cured with the right shocks and springs. Every case is different, since every cars springs and shocks have a different degrees of abuse in their history. I've seen separate cars running the same arms, some had hop and some didn't. It just isn't that simple. Every suspension is a package, and there's a lot more to it than any one or two parts. If the package isn't put together right, then there's no guarantees that anything will work right.

I agree with that 100%. Back in the day, it wasn't looked down upon to go get the cheapest pair of shocks you could find because they'd be nice and soft. Of course control arms weren't around like they are now, so it was different. Now with the availability of aftermarket parts, I think I assumed we were talking good known springs and shocks, etc.

What I think I should have said, is that with a good aftermarket suspension you shouldn't need quad shocks. That's my side of the debate.

 

[stangbear427]

I like it when we're on the same page

 

[Bone Racing]

rip the quad shocks out...end of story

 

[v8only]

rip the quad shocks out...end of story

you've got a decent setup. I noticed you had a stock suspension...have you taken your own advice yet? No offense, but your sig is either outdated, or you have no personal experience with this. It's one thing to be an online tech warrior, and another to remove the quad shocks and have your wheels bounce all over the pavement on a 3000k launch, and experience it in person.

there have been some good ideas and points here. My buddy with the wheel hop problem put an airbag in his spring so he could inflate it for the track to help keep his wheels planted. this seems to have worked for him. Some good adjustable uppers to adjust the pinion angle for the races would help, as well as a panhard bar and full complement of the maximum motorsports lineup, unfortunetly my budget (for now) will be a $20 set of quads.