Why high power V8's are better.

[AndrewZ]

I have owned both turbo cars,most recently(90 300zx Twin turbo,516 rwhp and 436 rwtq,over 50k invested) and a slew of v-8 muscle..From my 90 5.0 LX convertable to my 2000 SS LS-1 vert,and my 02 ZO6..All great cars for different reasons..I LOVE turbo cars as well as V-8 muscle..For you guys that have never owned a high horsepower turbo car,you really need to own one to understand..

I would pull up to guys with thier sc'd mustang or vette and go to it..They would immediatly pull a car,car and a half on me and think they had it won.Then the turbos would spool and by the time I was midway through 2nd I was even,and through the top of third I would have two to three cars easy..

Then tier was the time I got DESTROYED by a Viper gts with a super charger..AIn a whole other legue.

Point is, I appreciate ALL bad ass cars..I give all car guys respect,because they are just like me and love cars..If they are narrow minded and retarded,that is a whole other story..

So considering I love both turbos and v-8's, the next logical step is to combine the two..I plan on doing a twin turbo V-8 in the near future..Then it will be a harmonious combo,producing over 700 rwhp with driveability and plenty of torque..

As long as a car is done in a tastefull manner,it's all good..

 

[QCStang]

Wouldn't a single turbo be a better idea on a V8? From what I understand about twin turbos (I'm a newbie in this area) it is to get to the powerband faster. With a V8, you are already there in the low end. Wouldn't a large single turbo for mid-high powerband be a better idea?

I would think, for the new 'Stang, a Kenne Bell twin screw supercharger would be a far better, more reliable and a more workable solution. Power right through the powerband.

 

[AndrewZ]

Twin Turbos

The reason I would choose twins instead of a large single setup is because of the spool up time..I am looking for a turbo setup that is great for the street and has minimal turbo lag..If I went with a large single I would get awesome top end and a lot less hassle as far as manifolds and running intercooler piping goes..But I am not after a freeway monster,drag car, or top end car..

A turbo or turbos will out perform and outlast a supercharger everytime..A supercharger would be better of of idle but once you get up in the rpms they begin to run out of steam..While a turbo on the other hand is a little slower to spool,but once they hit you can pull all the way to redline and just keep picking up hp..That is why I would choose 2 medium sized turbos over 1 large anyday..With a v-8 you already have the torque to get the car rolling then the turbos can pick up at about 2500 rpm so hold on..

With the exhaust gas a v-8 put out, (with good manifolds etc) you could probably have a good 2 meduim sized ball bearing turbo setup fully spooled by 2400-3200 rpm (or less)..While a single turbo would probably not get full spool until near 3700-4500 rpm..

Basically a single turbo car would be idealy suited for the drag strip. While a twin setup would be much more forgiving and responsive on the street..And since I am not looking for a 1000hp+ monster,smaller twins would do me perfectly..

I have a friend that has a 98 Cobra with a twin setup and he just put down 1000+rwhp..That car in absolutly INSANE. He took it to some place in Arizona to have the motor work done..It ran a 9.7 with him dogging it out of the hole..All I want is a 600-700hp car..That is still overkill for most all street use..That is another good thing about turbos,you never know they are there until you want them..

The cost of a turbo setup is more than a supercharger for sure,but you get what you pay for..

There is a good article in the latest muscle mustang fast ford comparing turbos and superchargers,pick it up,it is a very good read..

 

[rhumbline]

I think what gets somewhat missed in this discussion and appraisal of power curves is that the STi is not meant nor intended to be a drag car at all, even though it comports itself quite well in that arena.

Rather, its focus is a much broader performance and dynamic envelope of a rally type car, one that emphasizes handling, braking, balance, and agility as much as simple straight line speed.

Thus, while the small flat four might not give quite the ideal torque curve for a drag strip or stoplight racing, that motor does allow much lighter weight, a very low CG and is hooked up to a very sophisticated AWD system that can put far more actual horses to the ground over a far wider range of driving environments and situations than a typical V8 rwd car ever could.

So when discussing speed and the effectiveness of a motor in producing it, one has to look beyond a myopic consideration of the highly idealized realm of a ruler-straight and billiards-table smooth drag strip as the primary means of assessing the STi. How does the motor/drivetrain integrate and contribute to the whole performance/dynamic package?

Put a 500 hp STi against a 500hp V8 Stang on a tight, winding, lumpy mountain road and the Stang's V8 rwd powertrain will suddenly become its achille's heel. It's all a matter of the proper perspective, really, and assessing each car against its aims and purpose.

 

[texaco]

i test drove a turbo stealth one time (stock) and they have no bottom end which is really lame,
but when it hits its power in the higher revs its like you are in a slingshot.
those kind of cars with the steep powerbands are fun to drive.
they feel similar to a two stroke dirtbike in power curve characteristics. which is lots of fun.

for the next cobra or cobra r , if ford destoked a hurricane to be high revving and cammed it to have a more pronounced power curve it would be really wicked. a stock stang with a 9000rpm redline would be amazing and would sound friggin nuts.

 

[Stinger]

Here is a little better 4 cylinder turbo dyno graph...this is a 2.3L Ford Turbo that runs 10.88 in the 1/4 btw...You have to admit those are some flat HP and TQ curves...

This is a bone stock 2.3 Turbo shortblock that was pulled from a JY with over 150k miles on it...and has made over 100 drag strip passes as well as countless highway miles...pulling down 30mpg.

 

[rah rah]

That dyno is very similar to the 2.4 liter SRT-4's. It's a perfect example of a "big" 4 cylinder, short redline, and an early peaking volumetric efficiency power curve.

 

[drummer]

Also dont leave out those perky 6 cyl. cars

 

[Bobbys97R]

Less talk more racing. Where are all you guys at? oh and race a sti vs 03/04 cobra not the 05 GT

 

[StangDiego]

Wasn't it Carroll Shelby who said: "Horsepower sells cars, but torque wins races"?

And wasn't it Rodney King who said: "Can't we all just get along"?

The instant torque and rumble of a big V-8 (or a little 8 in the Ferrari 360 at WOT ) is intoxicating, and I will always be loyal to it. But there is something about that sound that a little turboed 4 makes when it is using its blow-off valve that makes me happy.

 

[grtpmkn]

BS on your low 13's my brother has the 300hp 05 sti and he gets 13.3's
Oh and to the faster japanese cars... find one for 25k that can beat a mustang GT that is new and sold in america... lets see 25k+wrx which is slower or for 32k you can get a sti or a 04 cobra, sti still slower

Doesn't sound like BS to me. My $24,995 WRX with $1400 worth of simple, safe mods (read: not turning the boost way up) is running 13.40's @ 99-100mph. And that is with a fairly soft launch (1.90-2.00 60' times). It'll beat the sh1t out of my '96 GT 'vert.

 

[BlackArtemis]

I curise around at 3500+ in my Ex's subby RS while 1800-2k for my stang. If mypowerband is at 3500 than that is similar to running at 3500 and hitting powerband at 5400 rpm.