After talking with a few companies...

[90mustangfan]

After talking with a few companies...Lil Disapointed

I Finally settled on the all the right parts. I talked with kenne bell, Which Had excellent customer service. They were the best. , then talked with AFR,Crane cams,comp cams, Andersons. I had the best sevice from KB, there great, I cannot believe anyone would say there CS is bad, First hand experience they were very helpful in making my combo along with great advice... And all parts are CA CARB and have EO#'s, so no worries what so ever on passing emissions
rebuilt 302
Afr 165c emission legal,Harden P's,1.6 RR,Hi rev valve springs
Crane cams Powermax 2040 Good mid range-strong top end, works w/blower
GT-40 lower, 42lbs inj, 70mm TB, 90mm Maf, 255lph FP,
Kenne bell std. kit, run 6psi max,boost a spark,boost a pump,
Full 3" exhaust, bbk shorty, mac catted H, mac pro dumps
T56 conversion, CF clutch, pro 5.0 shifter,ALum d/S, 3.73 gear
KB tune, and dyno tune

Heres where the problem lies, When I talked with KB, with this setup , they said 360-370RWHP and AFR said Around 400rwhp....
How good is this combo and what RWHP would you guess? I HAD goal of 430Rwhp...but I feel like its not possible now, Oh and kb said I cant run more than 6psi, due to my weather(100*) and the timing and fuel(91). What do you guys think, Ill have like 11k invested for everthing listed for what only 360rwhp , thats weak IMO. I guess I wont be hanging with the Big dogs after all.

 

[25thmustang]

Shouldn't have gone with a KB. Seems to be hard to make power with the them unless you have a newer 2V or 4V car. Vortech, Procharger, Paxton, or a turbo set up would give you easily 430 or more to the tires!

 

[leroy93lx]

From what i know, which isnt much, the KB starts making boost around 1800 rpms. In comparison to a centrifical that comes on much later. The average horsepower and torque across the board is where the biggest difference is. If your car is mainly street driven the low rpm boost feels damn nice stoplight to stoplight. Dyno numbers are great and all but track times are what most people want to see. If nothing else the KB is awful damn FANCY under the hood!! Thats my 2 cents

 

[wythors]

I've got a friend that has a KB on a basically stock 5.0 that put down 350+ to the rear on a Mustang dyno earlier this year. Naturally aspirated, that combo should be around 350 at the crank. I'd guess that that setup with a KB should be good for at least 385 and maybe 400 to the wheels.

 

[Darkwriter77]

Wow ... $11k at only 360hp? Coulda gone with a single turbo setup for way less, maybe even twin turbo...

Then again, nothing says you can't ditch the KB stuff, invest the cash from that into a turbo kit of some kind, and go from there...?

 

[90mustangfan]

Well From what Ive seen theres no emissions legal turbo kits, some kit you have to remove the smog pump...as for some you can keep all accesories inc smog pump...I know for a fact that the Turbo will put down more power...intercooled, so I can run more boost before detonation, and more efficient. Anyone know of a carb legal turbo setup for ca emissions?
heres a GOOD QUESTION: Will a 420rwhp Vortech fox beat a 380rwhp KB fox, assuming equal driver and equal mods only difference is the Kb and The Vortech, and the vortech car having 40 more rwhp?

I mean cause the Kb is instant power, the vortech is PEAK rpm numbers so?

 

[Darkwriter77]

In the 1/4 mile, between equal drivers, I'd say someone with the extra 40 hp is gonna get the win. You'll be high enough up into the RPM's by the finish line that those extra 40 horses WILL make a difference. In that event, you may as well start investing in either a better suspension to make the most of what you've got, and/or some weight reduction to compensate.

 

[25thmustang]

Well From what Ive seen theres no emissions legal turbo kits, some kit you have to remove the smog pump...as for some you can keep all accesories inc smog pump...I know for a fact that the Turbo will put down more power...intercooled, so I can run more boost before detonation, and more efficient. Anyone know of a carb legal turbo setup for ca emissions?
heres a GOOD QUESTION: Will a 420rwhp Vortech fox beat a 380rwhp KB fox, assuming equal driver and equal mods only difference is the Kb and The Vortech, and the vortech car having 40 more rwhp?

I mean cause the Kb is instant power, the vortech is PEAK rpm numbers so?

Helions 62mm Turbo kit comes 100% complete and has an optional catb from Bassani as well as the bracket (Vortech one) for the smog pump. 100% smog legal, and $5200-5400 to your door. My friends car stock with an Ebrock intake, catback and this kit made 350/420 to the wheels at only 9-10 psi.

The 420 rwhp car should do well as a race keeps the car in the high RPMs where the Vortech will do well. The KB will be better on the street and feel better, but the Vortech car should have a better hp average where it matters in a race.

 

[MGD]

^^^

There is a difference betweeen being smog legal and being carb legal. In CA, any aftermarket parts have to be CARB legal, and the Helion kit isn't on the list as far as I can see. CA also involves a visual inspection as well as any aftermarket performance parts have an EO number. I only found three companies with CA legal turbos, (hellion is not one btw) check the site, anyone modding cars in CA should have this bookmarked:

http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/devices/amquery.php

Just looking at your list, the T56, the cam, MAF, TB, fuel pump might not pass smog unless they are on the list. I'm not a smog tech, but it would suck to spend 11K on a setup and watch it fail smog

 

[poneypower89]

The thing about KB is that they consistently under-rate their stuff in order to stay in the "safe" zone. U could possible spin everything harder along with a more aggressive tune and pull the #'s u want.. however, u will be walking the line. KB doesn't want to take any blame from such a combo so they tell u to keep it safe at the sacrifice of power.

Either way, if you want to make higher peak #'s u really need a centri or a turbo as far as these pushrod engines go.

 

[25thmustang]

Didn't realize he was in CA... Glad I don't live there, I have a hard enough time passing just the sniffer in CT!

 

[90mustangfan]

All the parts I listed in my combo, the crane cam has EO#'s and will pass, the intake is gt40 has EO# and(factory ford)that will pass If not ill us stock lower intake. Trans, wont make a diff, But the fuel pump will pass(should), they wont know the diff, and if it dont pass because of the fuel pump, Im using a KB boost a pump. the 90mm MAF KB said will pass, all factory ford parts will pass, even the visual.

Good Question: Im considering a Vortech, but for a Vortech to make more HP then a KB, Ill have to run 8-9psi, or even 10psi, Isnt that alot of boost for the stock block? I know they are intercooled, and have after coolers, so I can run more boost and more timing. But isnt 10psi alot of stress on the factory block..

Well I was thinking about it to try and keep the cost down, AND what KB recomended. For emission and money factors they suggested
rebuilding the 302 if needed
stock cam
AFR165's or even stock head
stock Lower
KB 5-6psi
and then the supporting mods, fuel pump,90mm maf, 70mm tb...etc.
the then full exhaust. t56 and 3.73

Or I could GO with VORTECH, it will still cost the same in the End, for the track and DD that im using the car for im not sure which is better? IDK...KB vs. Vortech??