Shoddy cables or possibly the clutch/tranny/etc?

[Swede958]

I'm just about fed up with this... I've been fighting with this for the past week on my 91LX 5.0
I've done some searches but could quite find the answers I was looking for.
About 1.5yr ago I put in a Fiore FWA and Quad... at the time, the stock cable was fine. 6 months later, it breaks.

Bought a vatozone one just to get me going, worked fine for a year. Now, it was fraying, so I got another. Ended up breaking 3 in a week. (I know, poor quality, but didn't cost me anything to swap them). So, before shelling out the 60-120 for a MM or stock one, I decided to see if I could reengineer one.

Went to a cable house and had them cut a piece of 1/8" 7x12 cable (seven strands, each strand has 12 pieces) and he crimped on his own stoppers and I reused the hardware from one of the busted cables. Supposed to be good quality, high strength, and he said it'd stretch maybe .5" at it's maximum load rating (supposedly like 1100lbs).

Well... put it in. Seemed ok, but then the tranny became impossible to get into gear. I'd get a couple of pedal pushes in, and then it won't go into gear. I keep having to back out the FWA over and over again to get any response with the clutch. I know it stretched some, so I'm gonna go ahead and order the MM cable.

My question... could it be anything other than the cables? Anything else at all? The clutch seems fine, a little lag accelerating in 5th from real low RPMs but seems to pull fine everywhere else.

What else could it be? Just in case?

 

[v8only]

you've misrouted your cable. this is why it keeps stretching and snapping.

route it so that it pokes under the dr side motor mount, then route it under the car to the clutch fork.

 

[Swede958]

Under (nearer the center of the K memeber) or through the gap in the mount? I had routed it through as per the article in the stickied tech thread

 

[v8only]

not sure which article you're referring to, but read mine, it's the best...

http://www.thompsontransmission.com/techarticles/clutchcableadjustment.html

 

[Swede958]

That's what I mean, forgot it was your article. That's how i had it routed since going through these cables. "Under" the motor mount between the K-member attachment points like in the picture and under the shaft for the R&P.

 

[v8only]

at what point are your cables snapping at??? What is the point of failure??
do you have a super stiff clutch pedal??

since it's routed properly, check to be sure the headers aren't melting the cable...if it's super stiff, the pressure plate could be on it's way out....

if the cable is snapping at the quadrant end, the cable could be rubbing against the adjuster...crawl under the dash, and be sure the cable has a clear line of site from the quadrant and through the hole without touching anything.

 

[Swede958]

The first time I put a new cable on, it was on different than you recommended. That one lasted a year. The pedal was kinda stiff.

That cable frayed down to 2 strands on the quadrant and I replaced it and routed it like you recommended. MUCH MUCH lighter pedal, felt almost like my friend's Honda/Nissan hydraulic clutch.
Since then...
#1.plastic stop on transmission side broke off, the part that braces the transmission end against the ear of the transmission
#2. cable stretched. Just about took all of the threads of adjustment out of my Fiore adjuster.
#3. cable stretched. Again, just adjuster within a couple threads of being maxed out.
#4. (re-engineered) Housing was shorter than others, cable was sized to compensate as well as taking out roughly 1.5" to account for stretch and to place end-state of FWA around middle of threads. This is the one that just seems to keep stretching. I'll set it at zero lash, hop in and press the pedal down a few times, it feels a little stiffer than all the others (i believe because of the shorter overall length) but will run through the gears fine. But, after a few pedal presses it becomes impossible to get into gear with the car running.

It's really starting to tick me off and I'm afraid that even if I get a new cable (MM or OEM) it will stretch that one out too. Leaving me back at square 1. How much pressure should it take to move the clutch fork? No idea what kind of clutch it is but knowing the previous owner it wouldn't be much more than a King Cobra.

The re-engineering cable was just a bit too short to hook onto the fork so i had to lever the fork forward .5" to slip it on. With no pressure on it, the fork touches the pressure plate about midway in the slot on the bell housing. Is that normal or should it be nearer the rear of the tranny?

 

[89302guthrie]

i have the same problem as you. I have gone through a handful of cables. i replaced the stock clutch with a king cobra, then bought a ford replacement when the pedal became stiff enough to snap cables. my routing is the same as the tech article, clutch is new, cable is new, new fire wall adjuster, throwout bearing new also. the fork seems to be fine and none of the parts bind on their own.

 

[Darkwriter77]

Could additionally be that you're experiencing bind on the input shaft bearing retainer (the thing that the throwout bearing slides back and forth upon). If you're running a stock aluminum piece there, you'll wanna replace it with a steel unit. But that involves dropping the tranny, and replacing the clutch isn't that much more work from that point, either.

I'd say give the MM cable a go. If you put it in, double-check that you have it routed correctly (re-use the bracket from your stock cable that holds it away from the headers). If it STILL feels stiff, DO NOT drive around on it much, if at all possible, as something else is causing your binding issues. Plan on dropping the tranny for certain at that point, and investing in a new clutch kit (and hopefully a steel bearing retainer, as well) - around $250 in parts, depending on where you get 'em and what you get. (Personally, I'd recommend a King Cobra clutch kit.) Also, be sure to grease up the bearing retainer and clutch fork ball when re-installing.

 

[Swede958]

Yeah, I think it's starting to sound like a clutch. THe tranny does have a steel bearing retainer.

That's what gets me through... once i rerouted the cable under the motor mount the clutch felt awesome until the cable broke/stretched

 

[Swede958]

Alright, snapped some pics under the car.

Here is where the clutch fork sits when the TOB contacts the pressure plate

And here is the interior view when it contacts the pressure plate

And here is the interior view when the clutch fork is pulled all the way to the rear.

I know there's some rust there... but does this look like the PP is gone?

 

[Darkwriter77]

Nothing looks amiss as far as I can tell. No unusual wear spots or broken bits that I can see.

Again, go ahead and order the MM cable. Sounds like you need a new cable, regardless. Just route it as you did with the most recent one (where it felt better) and you should be fine. The parts store non-adjustable cables are flimsy turds - I had one stretch out and snap all but two of the strands when I last had one, after only 9 months. I wound up putting the old stock OEM Ford cable back in that I'd been keeping as a spare, and even though the shielding is cracked up and such from the cable being probably 10 years old, it's still smoother and still holding up.

Again, if it works fine for ya' with a new, quality cable, then you're set; if you still feel it hanging up or binding, THEN start saving for a new clutch kit and plan on dropping the tranny soon.