- Aug 30, 2006
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OK so ive almost got the engine back together and am searching for some shorty headers that will fit the usual problem areas. I just saw the thorley shortys and they say they will clear??Any one have any ideas
Help.need headers for 302-C6 in 77
- Thread starter The Observer
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Dano78
Founding Member
I highly doubt these headers will fit. They list them to fit the early mustang, Falcon, Maverick, etc... and the typical heders that fit these cars, definately will NOT fit a Mustang II. The Ii is extremely tight in the engine bay, and I don't think they really realize the differences between a II and the other mustangs. So I'd safely say, No, the Thorley headers won't work.
Running a C6 is really going to cause you alot more problems compared to a C4, as that C6 is quite a bit wider than a C4. Most II specific headers, designed for use with a C4 fit really tight andextremely close to the C4's oil pan. The Headmans are about the onoly one I'm aware of that provide any kind of space in the collector area that might be able to clear the extra width of the C6's trans pan. I can't be sure about Hooker's header, but I'm willing to bet that it will fit tightly to the trans aswell.
Headman and hooker both make a 'Super Comp' style header that will exit as a chassis header. The hooker requires cutting holes into the inner fenders to pass 2 tubes on each side outside the framerails on each bank. While the Headmans, all 4 tubes on each bank come out in front of and cross underneath the main crossmember. I think the headmans may or ma not require a motor mounting plate to be able to use them. If that's the case, forget about the powersteering and the alternator then.
The standard Competition headmans might be your best bet to start with but I'm sure you'll have to rework them a bit to clear that fat C6.
Bottom line- there isn't a single manufacturer out there that makes a 'shorty' style Header to fit the Mustang II V8 that I'm aware of.
Running a C6 is really going to cause you alot more problems compared to a C4, as that C6 is quite a bit wider than a C4. Most II specific headers, designed for use with a C4 fit really tight andextremely close to the C4's oil pan. The Headmans are about the onoly one I'm aware of that provide any kind of space in the collector area that might be able to clear the extra width of the C6's trans pan. I can't be sure about Hooker's header, but I'm willing to bet that it will fit tightly to the trans aswell.
Headman and hooker both make a 'Super Comp' style header that will exit as a chassis header. The hooker requires cutting holes into the inner fenders to pass 2 tubes on each side outside the framerails on each bank. While the Headmans, all 4 tubes on each bank come out in front of and cross underneath the main crossmember. I think the headmans may or ma not require a motor mounting plate to be able to use them. If that's the case, forget about the powersteering and the alternator then.
The standard Competition headmans might be your best bet to start with but I'm sure you'll have to rework them a bit to clear that fat C6.
Bottom line- there isn't a single manufacturer out there that makes a 'shorty' style Header to fit the Mustang II V8 that I'm aware of.
- Aug 30, 2006
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Yeah sure would bee nice to have a pile of headers to fit them...LOL. Im not opposed to cutting the fender wells at this point!! Theres no way in hell im putting stock manifolds on after doing so much work!! Is there a link for those headers? Thanks alot!! That C6 is gonna rip holes in the pavement.....
To be honest there isn't a 302 based motor made that a properly built C4 transmission wouldn't be able to handle. I'm all about being different. (Or I would have a Mustang II). But a c6 is being different and make things harder on yourself. With nothing really to gain but weight (the C6 is much heavier than a C4 and the obvious header problems). The Hedman requipe the use of at least a front motor plate, removal of the Powersteering, and the factory mounts. Like was mentioned before all the header pipes go forward and under the main crossmember and into a flat collector. If this is a race car you will probably be ok but for a street car you are probably going to have ground clearence issues.
I'm in the process myself of installing an AOD with the already installed 351, and I've reserved myself to the fact that off the shelf headers aren't availible and I bought the parts to make them. As soon as the trans is installed I'm breaking out my box of pipe pieces, the chopsaw, and the mig... And making a try-y style header for the car.
Good luck man,
Tim
I'm in the process myself of installing an AOD with the already installed 351, and I've reserved myself to the fact that off the shelf headers aren't availible and I bought the parts to make them. As soon as the trans is installed I'm breaking out my box of pipe pieces, the chopsaw, and the mig... And making a try-y style header for the car.
Good luck man,
Tim
- Aug 30, 2006
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Well i bought the car off my old man and he already had put $1500 in the tranny he says thats why we are using it....3500 stahl conv,shift kit... Id sure hate to have to deal with building a c4 and swapping it but yeah i agree i am just adding difficulty to myself!! I love self abuse!LOL. I may look into it though...I do have a friend that will build custom headers for $1500 !! I did have the headmans that go under the crossmember and yep they didnt fit with the c6.
- Aug 30, 2006
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Dano78
Founding Member
Not sure what 'numbers' you're looking for.
I've seen C4s built to handle 1000+ horsepower. The C4 tranny is definately an impressive unit now that the aftermarket has corrected all of its weak links. No doubt the C6 is an awesome tranny but with the weight savings and compact size of the C4 is is extremely hard to beat. A friend of mine bought a used but stock rebuilt C4 from me a few years ago. He stuffed a reverse valvebody in it and did nothing else. Ended up putting 2 seasons worh of 9 sec. passes on it in his Fox mustang. Pulled it out and sold it to another guy, appearantly still working just as good. So yeaht he C4 is really a great tranny.
Here's a link to headers offered at Summit Racing-
Headers - summitracing.com
I also noticed that JBA is offereing II headers. I'd really like to know more about them. Considering that they also fit LTD, Granada, etc.. leaves me suspect to them even fitting.
I've seen C4s built to handle 1000+ horsepower. The C4 tranny is definately an impressive unit now that the aftermarket has corrected all of its weak links. No doubt the C6 is an awesome tranny but with the weight savings and compact size of the C4 is is extremely hard to beat. A friend of mine bought a used but stock rebuilt C4 from me a few years ago. He stuffed a reverse valvebody in it and did nothing else. Ended up putting 2 seasons worh of 9 sec. passes on it in his Fox mustang. Pulled it out and sold it to another guy, appearantly still working just as good. So yeaht he C4 is really a great tranny.
Here's a link to headers offered at Summit Racing-
Headers - summitracing.com
I also noticed that JBA is offereing II headers. I'd really like to know more about them. Considering that they also fit LTD, Granada, etc.. leaves me suspect to them even fitting.
- Aug 30, 2006
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Hey..Thanks for all your help brother! At this point in t$me i think im gonna run the c6 and put cobra manifolds(100lbs) on until i can either build a c4 and correct headers or get custom ones built, Probly around the same $$? Ill hide them under a 6" scoop! LOL. Motor mounts are the next issue of course....mine have about a 1 1/2 inch gap one one side or the other on both. I mean from the engine mount ears to the frame mount [ [ ]]
- Aug 30, 2006
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Vegas Stang
New Member
- Feb 27, 2008
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Headers do not exist for this combo in a Mustang II, I doubt there is room for custom made headers either. Putting a C6 in a Mustang II is much more trouble than it's worth and will serve no benefiet.
Sell the C6 and install a good C4 with a shift kit. Believe me you won't be sorry.
Sell the C6 and install a good C4 with a shift kit. Believe me you won't be sorry.
Dano78
Founding Member
Yeah you're running the wrong mounts. Not surprised as it will be next to impossible to find a new set of originals. There was an individual selling a rebuild kit for the originals (as wellas already rebuilt ones or will rebuild your cores) over on the .net site.
Not sure if you mean that the long bolts will go in but have a forward/backward gap between the ears and the stand or that the engine mount ears are not lining up with the holes on the frame stands. The V8 IIs do have specific frame stands... at least one of them (driver I think).
There was suppose to be a mount that sat the engine at the same height but left a gap between the frame mount and the ear(s) of the motor mount with the long bolts installed. If the mounts fit fine, just see if you can make a spacer to fill that gap and then you'll be fine. Maybe get some guys on here to give you measurements of the relation of the oil pan to the chassis to help determine if the mounts are fitting correctly. I'd be more than happy to, but the II is buried outside.
- Aug 30, 2006
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Yeah im going to fab some spacers....there is forward back room in the mounts but im gonna weld em in where i want them and add spacers. Except for the play the motor sits perfect, The c6 is right on the fire wall....Depending on $$ i may try and find a c4 already done?? Spent a few hours drilling out ball joints!! FCK that im gettin new ones! Control arms...
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