65 Mustang clutch pedal spring keeps braking from the brake pedal

[65stang289v2]

Hello,

I have a 65 original Mustang hardtop I bought three years ago.
The valvetrain, and drivetrain is all original; all the components are original also.
The car has a 289, 2barrel, with the T10 Borg - Warner 4 speed transmission. I am writing these because these aspects may a source of the problem.

6 months after I bought the car, as I was shifting from from 4th to 3rd, the I heard a 'clang' and the clutch pedal moved to the right; I could not change gears; I managed to get the car home, and later found out that the spring that holds the clutch pedal to the brake pedal had broken off.

I towed the car to my mechanic, who managed to get another spring, and managed to get the spring in between the clutch and brake pedals, to fix the problem. It took him around 1hour to do.

One year later, the same thing happened; as I was driving down the road, I heard a 'clang' and again, same issue.

I had the car towed again to the mechanic, who this time, in order to re-align the spring and brake pedals, was required to pull out the clutch spring (the big heavy spring, located on top of the clutch, that's behind the dash). It took him almost a day to fix.
I asked him why this keeps happening, and told me that the T10s by design (being sidewinders - compared to the latter toploaders) are not very user friendly, as well as the fact that in 65, Ford designed the clutch pedals to be an add on to the brake pedal, meaning that they are not independently held. And the only way the clutch pedals are held in place, is by a steel clip, that under heavy use will break.
So he put in a bigger clip, to make sure it will not break in the near future.

Guess what happened last night? I broke again.

Which leads me to my question:
- I have read and researched of full size 63 and 64 Galaxies with R Code 427s and T10 4 speeds, I have read of Shelby Mustangs with 4 speed T10s, how is it that I somehow keep braking that clip?
- Is this something that is inherently faulty with my original transmission/clutch combo?
- What can I do to make sure this type of thing does not happen again? I want to take my car on a long drive at some point, and am afraid, I'm going to stranded in the middle of nowhere.

Any help on this matter is greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

 

[2+2GT]

I have a 65 original Mustang hardtop I bought three years ago.
The valvetrain, and drivetrain is all original; all the components are original also.
The car has a 289, 2barrel, with the T10 Borg - Warner 4 speed transmission. I am writing these because these aspects may a source of the problem.
Having skipped ahead, no, they don't.

6 months after I bought the car, as I was shifting from from 4th to 3rd, the I heard a 'clang' and the clutch pedal moved to the right; I could not change gears; I managed to get the car home, and later found out that the spring that holds the clutch pedal to the brake pedal had broken off.
If you mean the wire clip 74279 (there are two styles) OK, so far.

I towed the car to my mechanic, who managed to get another spring, and managed to get the spring in between the clutch and brake pedals, to fix the problem. It took him around 1hour to do.
Huh? It does not go between the pedals.

One year later, the same thing happened; as I was driving down the road, I heard a 'clang' and again, same issue.

I had the car towed again to the mechanic, who this time, in order to re-align the spring and brake pedals, was required to pull out the clutch spring (the big heavy spring, located on top of the clutch, that's behind the dash). It took him almost a day to fix.
OK, since the brake pedal is on the clutch pedal shaft, I'm at a loss to know what he "aligned".
As for the assist spring (7534), if it took him all day to remove and install that he has serious competency issues. I could do that in two hours if I was also shooting the breeze with you at the same time.

I asked him why this keeps happening, and told me that the T10s by design (being sidewinders - compared to the latter toploaders)
OK, the pedal components he's talking about are identical on the tiny 2.77 3-speed 200 six cylinder, 3-speed 289 2V, and 289 High Performance with toploader, so he's seriously making it up as he goes along.

are not very user friendly, as well as the fact that in 65, Ford designed the clutch pedals to be an add on to the brake pedal, meaning that they are not independently held.
And this system worked just fine in Shelbys in SCCA racing, and literally millions of Mustangs, Falcons, etc.

And the only way the clutch pedals are held in place, is by a steel clip, that under heavy use will break.
Here is where I break down and say "bull". The pin in my 289HP car is just kinda hanging there.

So he put in a bigger clip, to make sure it will not break in the near future.

Guess what happened last night? It broke again.
Duh. I think we know by now he doesn't know beans about this pedal setup. I'll bet you a dollar he didn't even install the two 7A630 bushings, and they are pretty important.

Which leads me to my question:
- I have read and researched of full size 63 and 64 Galaxies with R Code 427s and T10 4 speeds, I have read of Shelby Mustangs with 4 speed T10s, how is it that I somehow keep braking that clip?
Your pedals are screwed up. There should be almost zero stress on the retaining clip.

- Is this something that is inherently faulty with my original transmission/clutch combo?
Not unless you think all Shelby Mustangs were defective.

As I said, the pedals have nothing to do with the transmission.

- What can I do to make sure this type of thing does not happen again? I want to take my car on a long drive at some point, and am afraid, I'm going to stranded in the middle of nowhere.
Most likely someone before you drove the car until the pedal bushings (2471) were totally worn out, and then kept going until the white metal eyelets that hold them into the pedal bracket were ruined, too. You can buy steel replacements for these, which can be installed with the bracket in the car, or at worst by removing it. There are also kits which use steel roller bearings instead of the nylon bushings. You will likely need to repair or replace the steel clutch pedal shaft, too, since operating it with bad bushings has damaged it.

Your mechanic will probably tell you removing and installing the assist spring (7534) is difficult and dangerous. If he does, run away, and don't go back. I can tell you how to do it so easy a child could do it.

My favorite Mustang dealer stocks all these small parts, they could even provide a pedal bracket if yours is hopelessly damaged.

 

[hipo_p51]

all the info below is good stuff, but a little overboard. not to say you would be unable to rebuild your clutch/brake pedal support or you would consider your crazy mechanic to do the job. i quick a painless way would to buy a set all built up with all the latest parts from ebay or something. you can just bolt it in and away you go. this would solve the problem quick. if you do this yourself you will learn a lot about your mustang. rebuild you old stuff and sell on ebay or have as a spare. just my .02 cents. good luck.

I have a 65 original Mustang hardtop I bought three years ago.
The valvetrain, and drivetrain is all original; all the components are original also.
The car has a 289, 2barrel, with the T10 Borg - Warner 4 speed transmission. I am writing these because these aspects may a source of the problem.
Having skipped ahead, no, they don't.

6 months after I bought the car, as I was shifting from from 4th to 3rd, the I heard a 'clang' and the clutch pedal moved to the right; I could not change gears; I managed to get the car home, and later found out that the spring that holds the clutch pedal to the brake pedal had broken off.
If you mean the wire clip 74279 (there are two styles) OK, so far.

I towed the car to my mechanic, who managed to get another spring, and managed to get the spring in between the clutch and brake pedals, to fix the problem. It took him around 1hour to do.
Huh? It does not go between the pedals.

One year later, the same thing happened; as I was driving down the road, I heard a 'clang' and again, same issue.

I had the car towed again to the mechanic, who this time, in order to re-align the spring and brake pedals, was required to pull out the clutch spring (the big heavy spring, located on top of the clutch, that's behind the dash). It took him almost a day to fix.
OK, since the brake pedal is on the clutch pedal shaft, I'm at a loss to know what he "aligned".
As for the assist spring (7534), if it took him all day to remove and install that he has serious competency issues. I could do that in two hours if I was also shooting the breeze with you at the same time.

I asked him why this keeps happening, and told me that the T10s by design (being sidewinders - compared to the latter toploaders)
OK, the pedal components he's talking about are identical on the tiny 2.77 3-speed 200 six cylinder, 3-speed 289 2V, and 289 High Performance with toploader, so he's seriously making it up as he goes along.

are not very user friendly, as well as the fact that in 65, Ford designed the clutch pedals to be an add on to the brake pedal, meaning that they are not independently held.
And this system worked just fine in Shelbys in SCCA racing, and literally millions of Mustangs, Falcons, etc.

And the only way the clutch pedals are held in place, is by a steel clip, that under heavy use will break.
Here is where I break down and say "bull". The pin in my 289HP car is just kinda hanging there.

So he put in a bigger clip, to make sure it will not break in the near future.

Guess what happened last night? It broke again.
Duh. I think we know by now he doesn't know beans about this pedal setup. I'll bet you a dollar he didn't even install the two 7A630 bushings, and they are pretty important.

Which leads me to my question:
- I have read and researched of full size 63 and 64 Galaxies with R Code 427s and T10 4 speeds, I have read of Shelby Mustangs with 4 speed T10s, how is it that I somehow keep braking that clip?
Your pedals are screwed up. There should be almost zero stress on the retaining clip.

- Is this something that is inherently faulty with my original transmission/clutch combo?
Not unless you think all Shelby Mustangs were defective.

As I said, the pedals have nothing to do with the transmission.

- What can I do to make sure this type of thing does not happen again? I want to take my car on a long drive at some point, and am afraid, I'm going to stranded in the middle of nowhere.
Most likely someone before you drove the car until the pedal bushings (2471) were totally worn out, and then kept going until the white metal eyelets that hold them into the pedal bracket were ruined, too. You can buy steel replacements for these, which can be installed with the bracket in the car, or at worst by removing it. There are also kits which use steel roller bearings instead of the nylon bushings. You will likely need to repair or replace the steel clutch pedal shaft, too, since operating it with bad bushings has damaged it.

Your mechanic will probably tell you removing and installing the assist spring (7534) is difficult and dangerous. If he does, run away, and don't go back. I can tell you how to do it so easy a child could do it.

My favorite Mustang dealer stocks all these small parts, they could even provide a pedal bracket if yours is hopelessly damaged.

 

[2+2GT]

all the info below is good stuff, but a little overboard. not to say you would be unable to rebuild your clutch/brake pedal support or you would consider your crazy mechanic to do the job. i quick a painless way would to buy a set all built up with all the latest parts from ebay or something. you can just bolt it in and away you go. this would solve the problem quick. if you do this yourself you will learn a lot about your mustang. rebuild you old stuff and sell on ebay or have as a spare. just my .02 cents. good luck.

To replace the pedal assembly requires removal of the master cylinder, steering column, and in a 64-66, the steering gearbox. Not exactly a shortcut.

 

[65 fastback]

I removed my pedal hanger without removal of the master cylinder, steering column or steering gearbox. It was not the easiest job I have done on my car, but it's manageable. Loosen the steering column under the dash, unbolt the MC (leaving it in place and intact) and you can manuver the pedals and hanger assembly out independently.

Tim

 

[2+2GT]

I removed my pedal hanger without removal of the master cylinder, steering column or steering gearbox. It was not the easiest job I have done on my car, but it's manageable. Loosen the steering column under the dash, unbolt the MC (leaving it in place and intact) and you can manuever the pedals and hanger assembly out independently.

Tim

Even if it works as you describe, it's still more work than slipping in a new set of bushings and going for a drive, even if the white metal eyes have to be replaced, too. Just MHO.

 

[dennis112]

If you do remove the clutch/brake assembly, do it right with real bearings:

Ball Bearing Clutch Pedal Support - FordMuscle.com Forums

 

[2+2GT]

If you do remove the clutch/brake assembly, do it right with real bearings:

If I ever damaged my bracket, I'd do the roller bearings, but since I've put 400,000 on my car with the OE style nylon (yeah, I replaced 'em twice) and the car is no longer in daily use, it'll probably never happen. Amazing what a little white lithium in the right place can do.

 

[valley firearms]

clutch pedal assy

As was said earlier, there are no springs holding the clutch pedal to the brake pedal. Maybe you are calling the spring washer or the retainer clip the spring? If your's is bad, I have two clutch pedal assemblies for sale. If you need one let me know. In the pics the plastic shoe (7A630) is on the hanger and not on the pedal as it should be.

Mike
[email protected]

 

[2+2GT]

In the pics the plastic shoe (7A630) is on the hanger and not on the pedal as it should be.

Hm? 7A630 goes at both ends of the spring, I thought the diagram showed that pretty clearly. Your photo seems to lack the one at the pedal end, too. The one at the spring end is the more important of the two, to eliminate squeaks and prevent the spring from cutting into the pedal arm.

 

[valley firearms]

yep, you are right. I'm missing one. I bet I have a few in my parts.