Watch out Europe... here comes the new 5.0 (M3 vs 5.0)

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GREAT!!!
Or you could buy a seriously loaded, all bells and whistles, GT500.

The problem with the Mustang in Europe is the size.
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Pretty impressive performance by the Mustang. Clearly Boss 302 will be significantly faster with more power, lighter weight, bigger tires and stiffer suspension.

Still, as a daily driver, M3 is WAY better. Far superior luxury and comfort, and the same speed. It should be for $25k. That's the thing: not a "real" comparison. If you want the luxury and panache, you might cross shop M3 with other cars, but Mustang won't be one of them. If you want max performance/value for your $$, then you'd pick maybe a Mustang GT or a Cobalt SS or a Corvette Z51.

I can't wait for Boss 302.
 
The new 5.0 is impressive, but as Kurt said, the M3 is just WAY better as a daily driver or only car. As a guy who owned Mustangs my whole life until this past December when I bought my 2008 M3, I can tell you there is absolutely no comparison between the two. Performance-wise, they are a wash for the average driver. Comfort and quality, however, makes it night and day. I had a loaded GT, and the interior still wasn't as nice as a stripped down M3. I'd still love to have a 5.0 as a second car in my garage though.

Also, keep in mind the M3's with the DCT are significantly faster than the manuals - same mag tested them at 0-60 in 4.1 and (if I remember correctly) 12.5 @ 113 in the quarter mile.

Sheer performance, it looks fairly clear the GT won the comparison. Unless they factored in comfort, amenities, etc., I'm not quite sure how they decided the M3 won. Many of you will probably disagree with me, but until you get a chance to put some real seat time behind the wheel of an M3, you'll realize there's absolutely no comparison. Then again, how many people would REALLY be cross shopping those two cars...
 
The new 5.0 is impressive, but as Kurt said, the M3 is just WAY better as a daily driver or only car. As a guy who owned Mustangs my whole life until this past December when I bought my 2008 M3, I can tell you there is absolutely no comparison between the two. Performance-wise, they are a wash for the average driver. Comfort and quality, however, makes it night and day. I had a loaded GT, and the interior still wasn't as nice as a stripped down M3. I'd still love to have a 5.0 as a second car in my garage though.

Also, keep in mind the M3's with the DCT are significantly faster than the manuals - same mag tested them at 0-60 in 4.1 and (if I remember correctly) 12.5 @ 113 in the quarter mile.

Sheer performance, it looks fairly clear the GT won the comparison. Unless they factored in comfort, amenities, etc., I'm not quite sure how they decided the M3 won. Many of you will probably disagree with me, but until you get a chance to put some real seat time behind the wheel of an M3, you'll realize there's absolutely no comparison. Then again, how many people would REALLY be cross shopping those two cars...

You are probably right, but I don't care. Even if I could afford it I wouldn't buy an M3. I would still own a mustang, the BMW carries a certain snobbery about itself. For such a humble car to match it at the track is very satisfying to me.
 
ok, I'll bite... what is so much more "luxury" about the M3? Is it leather, trim, materials, electronic equipment (even motor trend hates that isystem that BMW uses).

Or, let's be honest here, is it just the price that makes you THINK it's better?

If the M3 was only 35k, would it still be the "luxury" car that it "is" at 60k?
 
ok, I'll bite... what is so much more "luxury" about the M3? Is it leather, trim, materials, electronic equipment (even motor trend hates that isystem that BMW uses).

Or, let's be honest here, is it just the price that makes you THINK it's better?

If the M3 was only 35k, would it still be the "luxury" car that it "is" at 60k?

The luxury is the trim, materials, and comfort. The seats are just light years ahead of the mustang's in terms of quality and comfort. I picked the car up from Chicago and drove it back to DC. After 12 hours, the seats were still incredibly comfortable and I wasn't fatigued at all. After 3 hours in the seats of my last GT (I know they changed them for 10+, and I've driven V6 Premium rentals for several hours at a time, but not GTs for an extended period), my butt would be hurting like you wouldn't believe. Not to mention the additional ways you can customize the seat to fit you best - adjustable side bolsters, leg supports, etc.

The quality and workmanship and fit and finish between the two cars are just light years apart. The 2010+ is a big step up from the SN95 and even the 2005-2009's, but its still way lower quality. The Mustang still uses way too much plastic and fake materials. It really shows once you have higher quality materials. The feel of the leather is much better too. The stitching on the M3 is impeccable too. All the pieces fit better and are more durable (at least from what I've seen).

Then there are all the features and amenities. Several of these the Mustang has in option packages, some it doesn't, but likely will. Most of these things are really little and silly and are the type of thing most people will say "Oh, I don't care about that." Well I said that too, but now that I've had them, I won't get a car without them. You don't realize how great it is to never have to take your keys out of your pocket to get in your car and drive away. The convenience of automatic headlights, auto windshield wipers, and auto climate control is just phenomenal. It has auto-dimming rear view and side view mirrors. It has adjustable suspension settings, adjustable throttle mappings, and adjustable levels of traction/stability control - all of which can be easily changed on the fly. The parking sensors are amazing, and the seat memory is great. Being able to switch driving modes (from normal driving to M-Drive) from a touch of a steering wheel button is great too. The iDrive system has been greatly improved since the magazines first criticized it, and they all admit that now. It took me no time to figure it out, but maybe it is because I'm 25 and I've grown up using all kinds of electronics and computers. I also love that I can drive the car at 80 mph without feeling like I need earplugs. I know some people won't like that, but it's great to have a car that is quiet and well behaved until you tell it to do otherwise.

Then there are other little things - no cost maintenance. I don't pay for oil changes, brakes, or even windshield wipers. The quality of service at the dealers is night and day. The bumper-to-bumper warranty is longer. The resale value is MUCH better.

I'm sure there are other things I forgot. Another thing the M3 has over the Mustang is the ability to get 4 doors if you want/need it. I got the sedan, but I would've gotten the coupe just the same. There's also the question about looks - ask 100 people and you'll get 100 different answers, but I just think the M3 looks much more badass, stock vs. stock.

I do miss the grumble of the Mustang's V8, but at the same time, the sound of a M3's V8 at high RPM's rivals the Ferrari or Aston Martin if you ask me.

Someone mentioned the "stigma" of owning a BMW. If you care about that, then yeah, some people do think all BMW owners are d-bags. At the same time, some people think all Mustang owners are rednecks (although that applies more to Camaro owners, I guess) or juvenile street racers. As with all stereotypes, some people will fit the bill perfect, others won't. Personally, I'll never care what anyone else things about the car I drive. As long as I like the car, I'm happy.

In the end, people will assess the price difference and the extras you get with one car or another and make the decision that works best for them. No one's decision is wrong - it's all perceived value. That's why the open market system works. For many people on here, they'll see no additional value between the 5.0 and the M3, and that is fine. For me, I did - although I also wasn't buying a brand new one. But the cost of my used one wasn't a whole lot more than a brand new fully loaded 5.0 - and the M3 had just as much warranty and more features. Plus, when I go to sell it, I'll retain a much higher % of the value comparatively.

My comments shouldn't be misinterpreted - I'm not trying to knock down the Mustang by any means. I even said if you are looking for straight performance, the Mustang is a much better deal. Price independent, however, I can't see how you can really think the Mustang is a better car overall. Whether it is a better value overall depends on how much value you place on all the things I mentioned above. There's really no correct answer.
 
How much seat time have you had in a 2011 5.0 GT?

I've had plenty of seat time in a 2010 and a 2008 GT500. The performance is a wash for the most part between the 5.0 and M3, and I think everyone is pretty much on agreement on that. It is the intangibles around the driving experience for which you need seat time. Remember the mags even said the M3 feels a lot faster and more confident.
 
The luxury is the trim, materials, and comfort.

My comments shouldn't be misinterpreted - I'm not trying to knock down the Mustang by any means. I even said if you are looking for straight performance, the Mustang is a much better deal. Price independent, however, I can't see how you can really think the Mustang is a better car overall. Whether it is a better value overall depends on how much value you place on all the things I mentioned above. There's really no correct answer.

I hear ya dude. A co-worker of mine has a BMW, (330 I think), and it's a great car. It's a little faster than my 07, but it definitely handles and brakes way better than mine does. I would say the quality of interior pieces on his Beemer are better than mine also. But it should, his car cost about $30,000 more than mine did.

But I'm a bang-for-the-buck kind of guy, and that's why I like the Mustang. Sure there are better cars out there, but I think the Mustang is a great car for the money. Is my buddies car 3x as good as mine because it cost 3x as much? Not to me. I also agree with you about knocking "frivolous" features until you try them. I used to think heated seats were stupid. But the first winter day that I turned mine on on the way to work, I was like, "This is awesome!"

Both cars have their place. I will say that I seem to see more people driving Beemers doing D-Bag stuff on the road than I do Mustangs. I think it kind of goes with the territory. People that drive Mercedes and Beemers kind of have an attitude about them.
 
Regarding comfort of Bimmers: the "Comfort Access" option is the one that lets you open the locked door, start the car and all without taking your key out. It also allows two sets of seat/mirror/radio presets to automatically set. So if you have your seat/mirrors/radio presets different than your spouse or other driver does, then when you approach the car with your key, the all those systems adjust to your settings; then when the other key is used, it adjusts to those settings.

As for Bimmer owners being jerks, they ARE a bit different. They LOVE their cars, and many times for reasons not easily valued or articulated. Folks can't understand why the love for a car that performs on paper no better than another less expensive or different brand. Bimmers engender loyalty on a high level.

Full disclosure: I bought my wife a 335i in 2008, and we DO love it. We also did the European Delivery option where you order in the US, fly to Munich, pick up YOUR car, drive it around Europe, drop it off in any of a dozen cities across Europe (Paris for us), and then they ship it back to you in the States. The delivery was fantastic. Exclusive Owner's Lounge full of free food/drink with huge windows overlooking the City, leather couches everywhere, internet kiosks set up, it's all really cool. Instead of shipping to our local dealer, we did "Performance Center" delivery. They detail and prepare the car for you, then give you a car just like yours to drive on their track for a day of high performance driving, then send you home in your own car. It's a really cool/fun program.

As someone else said, the dealer experience is fantastic even when you're back. First of all, EVERYTHING is covered for 4yrs/50k miles. Wipers, fluids, brake pads/rotors/fluid - everything but fuel. They wash it every time we bring it in, and will give you a loaner when more than an hour or two will be required to do the maintenance. At the one year point, they replaced the whole cabin air filter and brake fluid so that along with oil change and washing - it took a few hours.

Still, I'll admit to liking the Mustang. I probably wouldn't buy a GT with the Boss on the way, but I'm considering 135i, Boss 302 and Certified used M3. I was planning on fall 2010 purchase, but now I'm waiting until summer/fall 2011. If I go 135, I'll do Euro Delivery again for certain, and go during Oktoberfest. If it's Boss, then I'll just start working a deal when they come out, and when the price is right, I'll do it. Same with M3.

The appeal of the Bimmers in this particular comparison is that I can fry the brakes on the track and just take it back to the dealer and tell them to fix it. They'll give me a loaner and send me on my way without hassle. The brakes on any of these cars, but 135 and regular Mustang GT even with Brembos would have no shot at even five fade-free laps and either would probably be lucky to get that far without warping the rotors. M3 2-piece rotors are less likely to warp, but they'll fade too before long. Same with transmission clutch - one reason I'd get the Dual-Clutch setup on either Bimmer: MUCH more heat tolerant, and will auto-disable high stress shifting as temps rise to prevent damage.

The Boss clearly doesn't fit in the mix with the other two. It's likely faster than either, but WAY more rough/cheap interior and little luxury at all. Not sure the slight track speed difference is worth giving up all the comfort.

But I LOVE the Boss exclusivity, history and that speed! That engine and Torsen particularly draw me. Just when I thought I had talked myself out of Mustang GT! Fantastic that an American car company is kicking butt like this! I've crossed Camaro off my list. 2011 Mustang performance is just too much better to consider Camaro any longer.
 
So the BMW has a better interior, is more comfortable,has more amenities, and is more luxurious then the Mustang, so what? The Mustang is not a luxury car it is a performance car, and the fact is for 25k less Ford built a car that performs as good or better then the M3 in every performance category. And they did it with a solid rear which makes it even more amazing.
 
So the BMW has a better interior, is more comfortable,has more amenities, and is more luxurious then the Mustang, so what?

"So", it makes driving it every day VERY comfortable. If you've not owned a modern luxury car, it's hard to "get" how nice it is to be so insulated and coddled and comfortable. I know I didn't get it until our Bimmer. It could be because I'm an old guy, but if I can go just as fast, and also be super comfy, why WOULDN'T I want that? The answer in this case is price, but that doesn't diminish the desirability of the Bimmer; if anything it enhances that aspect. We all want what we can't have: the OTHER girl, the bigger house, the car that's fast AND comfy . . . you know - the grass is always greener.

The Mustang is not a luxury car it is a performance car,

No one is disputing that. Simply a comparison because the cars were compared by MT and they selected the BMW - clearly because it's a WAY nicer car, not because the performance was almost identical.

and the fact is for 25k less Ford built a car that performs as good or better then the M3 in every performance category. And they did it with a solid rear which makes it even more amazing.

Absolutely true. I'm thrilled that Ford has put out such a fantastic performance bargain, which is exactly what Mustang should be. Great job, building a great car.

I'd like to see the Boss in this comparison, or vs a 911 C2S in the spring. Wanna see some German-lover heads explode!? :)
 
My '99 bimmer is years ahead of my 2011 5.0 as far as suspension fit and finish inside and general "feeling". Sometimes you are in a bimmer mood and sometimes one is in a Mustang mood. Hands down the M3 is better than the 5.0, it just depends on what mood you are in when you step into the garage in the AM.
 
i guess i'm weird in that i think 60K is a lot to spend on a sports coupe. its funny, i used to want cars that were 30-40K and now that i can actually afford them i just want the little V6 mustang.

the fit and finish of the interior of european cars is ahead of the premium mustangs BUT it is not a landslide victory at ALL guys. the new cars are soooooooooooooooooooooooooooo pimp on the inside. ford has gone to great lengths to tweak all of the problem areas that we've complained about for years. for a 30K price diff it better be more comfy and classy but at the end of the day its just a car. i'd rather have half the car note 100% of the performance and 75% the interior quality for 50% the price.