Electrical Grounding Kits

[Mustang5L5]

Taking this off the G35 forum where i frequent. If any of you guys are on any import boards, one of the most common mods you'll see are these grounding kits. Basically it's a snake-mess of wires on the engine designed to improve grounding. These kits are the source of heated debates as to if they work or not. Some even claim to have dyno slips proving 5HP gains because of it. If you are wondering what I am talking about..here ya go

Anyway, i know stangnet has more technically knowledgable people here, so i figure i open this concept up to discussion here. If someone cares to explain how a wire from the intake manifold to the timing cover increased HP...i'm all ears.

Anyway, for a more serious discussion, how would this apply to our mustangs. They are much more simple electrically, but i'd think they would benefit from some ground improvements (nothing like the photo however)


If you are into audio, you are familiar to what is known as the Big 3. This involves heavy gauge wire from Engine block to Battery neg, alternator positive to batt positive and chassis to batt neg.

Most stangers with a 3G alt already have a heavy duty alt wire running to the pos solenoid. And i would hope some have replaced those frayed negative batt cables with good clean new cables and clean grounding spots on the engine block.

That leaves chassis ground, from which I can see if just a tiny 10 or 8ga wire next to the battery and a braided aluminum engine strap ground. Can these be improved at all? Can you remove the braided engine ground (to reduce grounding loop possibilities) and use a nice 4ga or 2ga copper cable with a solid engine and chassis connection?

I'm sure making sure the neg to block ground is good and solid might make a difference. One might be tempted to try to measure resistance from all 8 spark plugs to the neg battery terminal before and after a new neg cable to see if any improvements are made.

Is these anything beyond this that would make an improvement to suggest a rats nest of grounds like the above would give even a moderate gain? And if there are gains to be had, wouldn't that indicate poor oem grounding conditions and the need to address cleaning all electrical and chassis grounds?

Most electrical sensors on the engine (except for the temp sensor and spark plugs) feature an independant ground that is tied into the chassis wiring, so i would assume chassis grounding to be key.

 

[Bills89GT]

I learned grounding is important first hand when I was putting my stang together. I had a bad ground at the computer that was messing with me for a few hours. Other than that I can't see how grounding can increase hp. and by the looks of that picture you make up for any increased hp with unnecessary weight! I'd rather take that copper to scrap yard and put the money towards a real mod

kinda reminds me of the "chips" they sell on ebay claiming "dyno proven 100 MPG and 1000Hp!"

 

[jrichker]

Short version of the long post that I have posted many times...

As with all wiring ,clean shiny connections are a must have condition. Make sure that all the wiring is in first class shape: no corrosion, frayed insulation or broken strands of wire. Put some dielectric grease on the connections, preferreably after assembly. The grease between the metal parts could act as a resistance.

2.) The secondary power ground is between the back of the intake manifold and the driver's side firewall. It is often missing or loose. It supplies ground for the alternator, A/C compressor clutch and other electrical accessories such as the gauges. Any car that has a 3G or high output current alternator needs a 4 gauge ground wire running from the block to the chassis ground where the battery pigtail ground connects. The 3G has a 130 amp capacity, so you wire the power side with 4 gauge wire. It stands to reason that the ground side handles just a much current, so it needs to be 4 gauge too.

The picture shows the common ground point for the battery & alternator. Put your 4 gauge ground wire from the engine block to this point and you have all the engine /alternator ground you need.

Picture courtesy timewarped1972

3.) The computer has its own dedicated power ground that comes off the ground pigtail on the battery ground wire. Due to it's proximity to the battery, it may become corroded by acid fumes from the battery. It is a black cylinder about 2 1/2" long by 1" diameter with a black/lt green wire. You'll find it up next to the starter solenoid where the wire goes into the wiring harness

 

[NIKwoaC]

Some even claim to have dyno slips proving 5HP gains because of it.

Are good electrical grounds worth a few points of compression ratio? Do they raise your volumetric efficiency? Do they increase your stroke?

The answer is no, and the 5HP claims are typical ricer attitude. Good electrical grounds do nothing but ensure proper operation of your electronics, specifically EFI sensors/ECM and your ignition system. If any sort of a gain was seen from adding all these ground wires, I would venture to say that it was because before the fact, the original grounds were worn, corroded, or just not up to snuff, and you'd only be gaining BACK what the car is SUPPOSED to be making. So, in that case, it would be like claiming that replacing a faulty injector made your car faster. Of course it did, because when it had the faulty injector, it wasn't running RIGHT to begin with!

 

[skunk21]

Just like any other snake oil product out there they are going to find believers. does the " tornado" come to mind. This topic was talked about many years ago on the contour forum I'm on and I would have to do some digging on the old board to find a dyno run done with products that didn't live up to the claims. it was a really good thread done back in '01. The tornado was put to the test and didn't do anything at all, They ran a filter system sold by BAT that had an inverted cone in the center and lost HP, the ran a ground kit w/o gains and did the resistor mod and lost hp also + some other stuff. maybe ( a slight one) in the right application (what ever that may be) it may work, but I'm putting this in the snake oil category.

 

[srtthis]

the 5hp came from the sticker he added not the grounding. and unless me adding another 2 gauge wire hanging off my motor will have me pick up another 10th or so im not going to bother

 

[RacEoHolic330]

Gounding is EXTREMELY important on EFI cars, especially unibody EFI cars. Bad grounds can affect the voltages that the sensors send back to the ECU, which can affect performance and driveability. Like nikwoac mentioned, a newer car should already be properly grounded from the factory and rust shouldn't be much of a problem, so having 50 ground wires in the engine bay is a clever marketing gimic to sell overpriced copper to kids. Our cars are older and many have had numerous owners who may not always have made the best wiring choices with their cars, so bringing the grounds back up to par is important.

I personally believe that every grounded part on the car should have a direct route back to the battery through copper wire, not the unibody frame. This means installing terminal strips that are essentially connected directly to the battery via a length of wire. I have a trunk mounted battery, so I have a 1/0 ground from the battery ran to the front of the car. It's bolted to a stainless bolt welded to the frame of the car. From this bolt, another 1/0 ground goes to the engine block. I also have #6 wires that go from the block to the heads and then to the intake manifold. There are two wires from the ECU that are grounded to the intake manifold, so that needs a healthy route back to the battery. Also from the bolt on the chassis I have a #4 wire that goes to a terminal block that nearly every ground from the car is grounded to. There is also an additional 1/0 ground from the battery in the trunk that is connected to another bolt welded to the frame in the rear of the car. Another terminal strip in the back grounds some stuff that I have in the back of the car.

You can never have too many grounds, but there is logic (and engineering) behind grounding efficiently. FWIW, after I replaced all the grounds on the car, it idled smoother and started up with less turns of the starter. Grounds are your friend...the more the merrier.

 

[Mustang5L5]

You can never have too many grounds, but there is logic (and engineering) behind grounding efficiently. .

Yup, it's called avoiding "ground loops" which are caused by randomly grounding points to different random grounds that are not at the same potential.

 

[RacEoHolic330]

Yup, it's called avoiding "ground loops" which are caused by randomly grounding points to different random grounds that are not at the same potential.

Yea, kinda like how that intake manifold you posted is grounded

 

[Mustang5L5]

Yeah....to the timing cover lol

 

[Noobz347]

I'm I won't get any HP out of it, but I'd probably get rid of some of that engine noise from the CB that I use for road trips.

Maybe they're facing their 79 inch woofers toward the rear of the car?

 

[Mustang5L5]

but I'd probably get rid of some of that engine noise from the CB that I use for road trips.

Creating ground loops might actually contribute to noise, rather than eliminate it.

Shielding would eliminate it

 

[Noobz347]

Shielding current supply lines and coiled wire wire help to reduce some of it. Shielding the ground wires, I don't think would make a difference either way.... well, unless you're running a single ground that's carrying so much current that the magnetic field around it is picking up noise.

Capaciters are often used to condition the power feed to eliminate that field flux and condition the wave noise generated by all the electrical accessories... I don't think that adding a ground, even bare wire, would cause additional line noise under normal circumstances... maybe if you were driving directly under heavy power lines?

 

[Noobz347]

Just found this on another website... makes sense and leads me to believe that an increase in the number of solid grounds at multiple locations is going to help 'spread out' that whine you get by by trying to consolidate your grounds into just one or two points.

Alternator Whine

Alternator whine is the granddaddy of car stereo noise. The most common and the most annoying. Alternator whine will be heard as a high pitched whine that will rise and fall with the engine speed. Most of the time this is caused by a poorly chosen ground for a piece of equipment. It is usually cured by grounding the equipment directly to bare metal on the chassis rather than an available factory ground bolt as is often used to save time. You'll also need to make sure your charging system is in top condition and that your connections between the battery and components are secure as well as the integrity of the factory ground strap, an often overlooked component. You might also consider switching your RCA cables to a twisted pair model. Twisted pair cables will usually be less prone to noise than their coaxial counterparts.


Accessory Pop

Accessory pop is associated with one particular electrical event in the vehicle. This can be switching on your turn signal, headlights, brakes, windshield wipers or even the rear window defrost. These high current drawing accessories are causing a voltage spike that is traveling into your car audio equipment with the result being heard as a sharp pop. Adding a small bi-polar capacitor (0.47 uF) between the accessory's power wire and ground will often absorb these surges. You may need to place the capacitor on the load or the power side of the switch (maybe both). See the diagram below to see how this is done. Note that the diagram is slightly different if the accessory has a relay in the circuit.

Accessory Pop Absorption Circuit



Proper Grounding

Most non-equipment related problems in car audio are the result of poorly chosen ground points. Always check the integrity of every connection including the battery, head unit, amplifiers and signal processors. Any part of the audio system can bring noise into the system. In general your connections need to be secure (grounds should be to the chassis), the charging system should be in top condition and all factory connections (battery posts, ground strap, alternator connections) should be secure. You may need to increase the size of your factory ground if you install a very large stereo system. It should also be noted that the negative battery post is usually a terrible place to ground car audio equipment. All of the ripple (noise) from the alternator and other items in the vehicle travel to this point. If you choose it as a ground point then you are inviting all of these elements into your sound system.

 

[Mintsick]

This is all the rage on the maxima forum I visit from time to time, I agree solid and clean grounds where they should be are a great idea but that rat's nest of wiring is useless.

 

[90lxvert13]

This is pop among the subaru crowd aswell. I put a kit on my Impreza and it runs much smoother and is less choppy while shifting.