Longtube Headers?
- Thread starter 1995stangman
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Before we start another argument about which intermediary is better, I think someone should just like one of the other 5 threads right here.
Kurt
Kurt
yeah i was thinking about getting the x pipe but i didn't care for the raspy note that the x pipe has. i do realize that the x pipe flows and gives like an extra 3 or 4hp. but i would prefer to just go o/r h pipe cause i like the sound better.
I think the general concensus came to be that there is no measurable hp difference between an H pipe, X pipe or Prochamber. I have a Prochamber because it in theory produces the most hp, and that is consistent with the dyno tests I've seen. I understand that people disagree, and I'm ok with that. I also like the quiet less raspy sound of it.
Kurt
Kurt
95riosnake
Member
I used to have a BBK off road H and it was the worst fitting part I have ever seen. When it came time to pick some long tubes I steered clear and went with Mac, I couldn't be happier. They fit like a glove, and I've never had a leak (I personally prefer the individual header flange opposed to one-piece). I also had mine jet hot coated which I think is a good thing to do if you can swing it. A couple minutes after parking the car you can touch the primary and it's just warm.
That answers my question of why the h-pipe, sound quality is an important factor in purchasing new exhaust. I didn't realize the x-pipe is so much raspier than an h-pipe.
Kurt, where can I find more info on the Prochamber? I've never heard of that one. Guess I'm gonna have to do some more research on this before purchasing...
Kerry
Mac sells the Prochamber. Despite any argument about the power it makes, I really like the sound. It's a very smooth unraspy sound. Deep and subtle. Here is the link. I have found their parts about $10 cheaper through ebay. You can find their headers on this same website.
Mac Performance - performance accessories for cars, trucks, and motorcycles
Here is the link to my car. Keep in mind I have a pretty big camshaft in this car, but you get the idea. It's also one of the first times I started it up with the new engine, so the computer has no idea what's going on. This is with BBK longtubes, a Mac catless Prochamber, and Mac tailpipes.
http://s114.photobucket.com/albums/...eous Videos/?action=view¤t=DSCN0032.mp4
Kurt
Mac Performance - performance accessories for cars, trucks, and motorcycles
Here is the link to my car. Keep in mind I have a pretty big camshaft in this car, but you get the idea. It's also one of the first times I started it up with the new engine, so the computer has no idea what's going on. This is with BBK longtubes, a Mac catless Prochamber, and Mac tailpipes.
http://s114.photobucket.com/albums/...eous Videos/?action=view¤t=DSCN0032.mp4
Kurt
harrellv10
Member
Opinions/suggestions anyone?
I read a great article (I'll try to find it and post the link) about short vs. long tube, and X vs. H pipes, and other great scientific stuff about exhaust systems and myths, all tested and supported via a multitude of dyno tests and comparisons. I think it was called "The long and shorty of it" or something.
Anyway, I am thinking about sort of the same thing you are, so maybe we can bounce ideas off of each other. I have some JBA big-tube shorties, 2.5" off-road X, and Flowmasters, then all the way out the back. Everybody has Flowmaster or Magnaflow, so I want to be a little different and go with some Borlas. My research shows that the Borlas will out flow the Flowmasters and the Magnaflows by about 5 HP or so, and I love the sound! But, it's just not deep and menacing enough for me.
I'm thinking of switching my Track Heat intake for an R-Series (runner style, not box) and then switching exhaust system to something like this:
-1 5/8" ceramic LTs, 3" collectors
-3" X-pipe
-Borla Turbo XLs (3" single inlets, 2.5" dual outlets)
-1 outlet per side goes over the axle and out the back w/Borla tips
-1 outlet per side turns out and dumps before the rear tire
-Side outlets would be slightly restricted (70% out the back, 30% side)???
The reasons for the quad exit are that 3" pipes will not fit over the rear axle with my lowered car and 315 tires, and it's different! I really wonder how this would sound?
And, I am debating on whether or not to run some hi-flow cats just to smooth out the sound and eliminate the raspiness and refine it a little. Shouldn't hurt flow much, and should still perform well enough given that the car has a retarded 610 flywheel HP.
What do the experts think?
I read a great article (I'll try to find it and post the link) about short vs. long tube, and X vs. H pipes, and other great scientific stuff about exhaust systems and myths, all tested and supported via a multitude of dyno tests and comparisons. I think it was called "The long and shorty of it" or something.
Anyway, I am thinking about sort of the same thing you are, so maybe we can bounce ideas off of each other. I have some JBA big-tube shorties, 2.5" off-road X, and Flowmasters, then all the way out the back. Everybody has Flowmaster or Magnaflow, so I want to be a little different and go with some Borlas. My research shows that the Borlas will out flow the Flowmasters and the Magnaflows by about 5 HP or so, and I love the sound! But, it's just not deep and menacing enough for me.
I'm thinking of switching my Track Heat intake for an R-Series (runner style, not box) and then switching exhaust system to something like this:
-1 5/8" ceramic LTs, 3" collectors
-3" X-pipe
-Borla Turbo XLs (3" single inlets, 2.5" dual outlets)
-1 outlet per side goes over the axle and out the back w/Borla tips
-1 outlet per side turns out and dumps before the rear tire
-Side outlets would be slightly restricted (70% out the back, 30% side)???
The reasons for the quad exit are that 3" pipes will not fit over the rear axle with my lowered car and 315 tires, and it's different! I really wonder how this would sound?
And, I am debating on whether or not to run some hi-flow cats just to smooth out the sound and eliminate the raspiness and refine it a little. Shouldn't hurt flow much, and should still perform well enough given that the car has a retarded 610 flywheel HP.
What do the experts think?
harrellv10
Member
....
Oh, and 1995stangman, I didn't mean to steal your thread, just realized that I didn't even comment on your issue. It always comes down to personal preference, but if money is tight then it definitely make sense to only do things once....ie- get something now that will still work with what you are going to upgrade to later. As far as what performs better or sounds better, I'm not even going down that road, but I will say that there are plenty of sound clips on the internet to listen to that will help you decide. Google and youtube are powerful research tools, hehe!
Oh, and 1995stangman, I didn't mean to steal your thread, just realized that I didn't even comment on your issue. It always comes down to personal preference, but if money is tight then it definitely make sense to only do things once....ie- get something now that will still work with what you are going to upgrade to later. As far as what performs better or sounds better, I'm not even going down that road, but I will say that there are plenty of sound clips on the internet to listen to that will help you decide. Google and youtube are powerful research tools, hehe!
harrellv10
Member
Sound clip...
I'll post a sound clip of mine for you later this week to give you an idea what just one possible combination sounds like. My current setup and dyno numbers are in my signature.
I'll post a sound clip of mine for you later this week to give you an idea what just one possible combination sounds like. My current setup and dyno numbers are in my signature.
Sounds kind of complicated. Probably don't need a 3" exhaust with 610 fwhp. Can't see your sig cuz this damn droid browser omits it. I agree that the Borla's will probably flow the best. It doesn't mean much to compare it to a flowmaster. Flowmasters are chambered mufflers and really don't flow well at all anyway.
Kurt
Kurt
harrellv10
Member
Header and H/X pipe comparison
Here is a link to one of the articles I was reading.
Long tube headers vs. short tube headers.
Here is a link to one of the articles I was reading.
Long tube headers vs. short tube headers.
1995HO
New Member
I got some long tubes i love them switching gear is just amazeing in a auto it would be alright id say
harrellv10
Member
1 3/4" shorties, or 1 5/8" LTs?
OK, so I personally prefer LT headers, but currently am using JBA 1 3/4" ceramic shorties on my S/C 347 (610 FWHP@ 6300 RPMs). Those flow into a 2.5" O/R X-pipe, currently Flowmasters, and over the axle and out the back. Loudness is just about right, but deepness is not quite as satisfying as I would like, and it's a little bit raspy and there is a backfire when I shift at wide-open throttle. I have read that the backfire is most likely a result of having no back pressure. So I want to try a new exhaust set up. I am looking for some feedback from anyone who as an experience with something similar, or might know how this would affect my power curve:
How would switching from the 1 3/4" shorties to a 1 5/8" LT affect my power curve? Would a 2.5" MAC prochamber smoot out the raspiness? I already know that I will be ditching the Flows for a pair of Borla turbo muffs. My goal is to keep the high rev capability, maybe beef up the low end torque a little, deepen the exhaust tone, and smooth out the rasp and backfire...
What about 3" exhaust with hi-flow cats?
It's a street car that gets driven about once a week or so. Emissions laws do not apply in Arkansas.
Anybody?
OK, so I personally prefer LT headers, but currently am using JBA 1 3/4" ceramic shorties on my S/C 347 (610 FWHP@ 6300 RPMs). Those flow into a 2.5" O/R X-pipe, currently Flowmasters, and over the axle and out the back. Loudness is just about right, but deepness is not quite as satisfying as I would like, and it's a little bit raspy and there is a backfire when I shift at wide-open throttle. I have read that the backfire is most likely a result of having no back pressure. So I want to try a new exhaust set up. I am looking for some feedback from anyone who as an experience with something similar, or might know how this would affect my power curve:
How would switching from the 1 3/4" shorties to a 1 5/8" LT affect my power curve? Would a 2.5" MAC prochamber smoot out the raspiness? I already know that I will be ditching the Flows for a pair of Borla turbo muffs. My goal is to keep the high rev capability, maybe beef up the low end torque a little, deepen the exhaust tone, and smooth out the rasp and backfire...
What about 3" exhaust with hi-flow cats?
It's a street car that gets driven about once a week or so. Emissions laws do not apply in Arkansas.
Anybody?
The longtubes would help. The prochamber would probably help with the raspiness. As for the back firing, the Flow masters should be putting plenty of back pressure on the system. That aounds more like a tuning issue. I think it's dumping fuel in there at some point.
Kurt
Kurt
harrellv10
Member
Sounds like an excuse to go back to the dyno!
Hmmm, well I've pretty much made up my mind to switch intakes and at least one or two components of my exhaust system, so it will need a new dyno tune session anyway, so I'll have my tuner work on elimiating the backfire then. I think I'll go with LTs, 2.5" prochamber, and borlas. Anybody know if MAC LT's will clear a T-56 bellhousing? And should I use 1 5/8" or 1 3/4" LTs? I really don't want to sacrifice and bottom end, as my car is a little light anywhere below 2500 RPM and is mostly just a grocery-getter, so I kind of think the 1 5/8" would be the right choice...
Hmmm, well I've pretty much made up my mind to switch intakes and at least one or two components of my exhaust system, so it will need a new dyno tune session anyway, so I'll have my tuner work on elimiating the backfire then. I think I'll go with LTs, 2.5" prochamber, and borlas. Anybody know if MAC LT's will clear a T-56 bellhousing? And should I use 1 5/8" or 1 3/4" LTs? I really don't want to sacrifice and bottom end, as my car is a little light anywhere below 2500 RPM and is mostly just a grocery-getter, so I kind of think the 1 5/8" would be the right choice...
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