Any idea about this noise - Watch this video?

[MaRu_GT]

Hi Guys...
Any idea where is this sound coming from??



I had this problem more than a year now, I start the car and it would run with no issues. After some long drive, the car gets warm (about 195-200) this pitchy sound comes on. When I turn the engine off, the whining gets continuous until it dies after 3-5 seconds of turning off the engine.


Anyone had something similar to that or can troubleshoot with me?

I tried some diagnosis by shutting the car off, taking serp belt off and starting the car again to see if it’s the problem from accessories. I found out that the noise is still there even with belt removed! Also, I changed the pilot and throw-out bearings and the noise is still there!!

I have got 2 mechanics confirmed that this is from the transmission itself (maybe bearing?? Shaft??). Also, they both confirmed that there is no vacuum leak and I did a vacuum test using a gauge and it gave me a normal behavior.
You will notice from the video that the noise increases as I go to passenger side ( correct me if I am wrong!!).

Also, I notice some pining (or tapping) … am I right ? or something going wrong with serp belt??.. I changed engine oil (motorcraft) and replaced the belt.. and recently noticed this tapping sound after this change in addition to my main problem, the pitchy sound.

I am really confused ..this mess of sounds getting me really crazy!! the last thing I wanna hear is that I have to change the transmission ! your help guys please!

 

[MaRu_GT]

For your info.. these are my MODs:

302 CID BOSS BLOCK (9.0:1 comp ratio) with GT-40X Alum Heads and B-Cam (Crane/FRPP Roller rocker 1.7 ), 24# FRPP inj, 190LPH FP, PRO-M 75mm MAF, Accufab 70mm TB, Cobra 93 intake, BBK CAI, MSD coil-cap-rotor-wires, HEDMAN headers, Magnaflow x-pipes and catback, 3.73 R&P, Eaton Diff, Alum driveshaft, King Cobra clutch, FRPP flywheel, March UD pulley set, PM 130 Alt, Fluidyne Alum radiator, high volume Alum water pump, Flex-A-Lite Black Magic Extreme 15" e-fan “Puller”, 2 Perma-Cool e-fans “Pusher”

 

[2000xp8]

Does it do it when you put your foot on the clutch?

Get a stethoscope or a long screwdriver and put it to your ear (metal to car, handle to ear). Just be careful. Trust me, when you hit the item making the sound, you will know it.

 

[MaRu_GT]

Does it do it when you put your foot on the clutch?

Get a stethoscope or a long screwdriver and put it to your ear (metal to car, handle to ear). Just be careful. Trust me, when you hit the item making the sound, you will know it.

When I press the clutch, most of the time I hear the tone changes (and few times it goes away), when i release the pedal it comes back to first tone.. that's why in the begining i thought it's the clutch's bearings.. but the fact that the sound comes for seconds when I stop the engine which means not any of them.. anyway i changed the bearings few weeks ago.. and the noise is still there when the car gets warm....

what parts of car should i check out with this method you suggest??

 

[2000xp8]

The sound and syntoms you describe make it sound like the Throw out bearing.
Remember, when you shut down the engine, if the car is in neutral or you have the clutch depressed (which you always have to do one of) parts inside the trans can still spin freely.

Do you know if you have a steel bearing retainer? I don't think any factory transmissions came with one, but it's a must during a clutch swap since the aluminum one wears out.

Forget the screwdriver idea, get yourself an automotive stethescope wear it like you are a doctor and just put the metal end to anything metal on the car, you will be amazed at the how much sound is transmitted through metal surfaces.

 

[MaRu_GT]

The sound and syntoms you describe make it sound like the Throw out bearing.
Remember, when you shut down the engine, if the car is in neutral or you have the clutch depressed (which you always have to do one of) parts inside the trans can still spin freely.

Do you know if you have a steel bearing retainer? I don't think any factory transmissions came with one, but it's a must during a clutch swap since the aluminum one wears out.

Forget the screwdriver idea, get yourself an automotive stethescope wear it like you are a doctor and just put the metal end to anything metal on the car, you will be amazed at the how much sound is transmitted through metal surfaces.

I changed the throw-out bearing recently (FRPP).. also I did replaced the stock retainer with FRPP steel. I agree if I shut the engine off then some parts inside the transy can still spin freely (maybe a bearing in the transy itself) but never heard that TO bearing of clutch does the same!!!

any online websites sell one of those stethescopes???

 

[2000xp8]

http://www.harborfreight.com/mechanics-stethoscope-41966.html

 

[Missyandrob2005]

Not a weird vacuum leak is it? Try spraying something around the intake while its running and see if the motor picks up a little. Seems like it could be a vacuum thing since you say it happens for a few seconds AFTER you shut off the motor.

 

[MaRu_GT]

http://www.harborfreight.com/mechanics-stethoscope-41966.html

Thanks

 

[MaRu_GT]

Not a weird vacuum leak is it? Try spraying something around the intake while its running and see if the motor picks up a little. Seems like it could be a vacuum thing since you say it happens for a few seconds AFTER you shut off the motor.

I thought that my & mechanic's inspection for leak could be enough, but you are right I might need to spray and check.. How would i tell if i am spraying on leaking parts?

 

[Missyandrob2005]

The engine speed will rev up slightly and the noise should stop until whatever you sprayed gets sucked in. Couple of times what I thought was a bearing noise ended up being a leaky intake gasket usually in the back.

 

[MaRu_GT]

The engine speed will rev up slightly and the noise should stop until whatever you sprayed gets sucked in. Couple of times what I thought was a bearing noise ended up being a leaky intake gasket usually in the back.

Thanks for the tip man.. I should try that when I am back home and next to the car!!

 

[stang&2Birds]

Yup, it's a bearing/friction_surface somewhere making that noise. I had to close my eyes while listing to the bearing.

It could be:
1) Idler pulley
2) Smog pump
3) AC clutch
4) Alternator
5) Throw-out bearing

Simple test:
Does it make the noise when the car is cold?
If so, then for a MAX OF ~5MINs, remove the serpentine belt and see if the noise is still there.

If the noise is still there, then I'd look at the throw-out bearing/tranny closer.

If the noise not there, then I'd look at 1->4 closer.
Also, then you can free wheel the parts by hand and see if the Idler pulley, AC pulley, or alternator feel rough. Spray wd-40 in all of them (back of the Idler pulley to get the bearing), and see if the problem goes away. If it does, then you know it was likely one of those three. When the noise comes back, then repeat the spray and listen one at a time.


Good Luck!

 

[FastDriver]

OP said he did that already and replaced the TO bearing.

And OP, I think you're hiding a positive displacement blower on there somewhere.

 

[old_blue]

New or not, could still be the throw out bearing. Any pre-load on the TO bearing?

 

[MaRu_GT]

Yup, it's a bearing/friction_surface somewhere making that noise. I had to close my eyes while listing to the bearing.

It could be:
1) Idler pulley
2) Smog pump
3) AC clutch
4) Alternator
5) Throw-out bearing

Simple test:
Does it make the noise when the car is cold?
If so, then for a MAX OF ~5MINs, remove the serpentine belt and see if the noise is still there.

If the noise is still there, then I'd look at the throw-out bearing/tranny closer.

If the noise not there, then I'd look at 1->4 closer.
Also, then you can free wheel the parts by hand and see if the Idler pulley, AC pulley, or alternator feel rough. Spray wd-40 in all of them (back of the Idler pulley to get the bearing), and see if the problem goes away. If it does, then you know it was likely one of those three. When the noise comes back, then repeat the spray and listen one at a time.


Good Luck!

No, this happens only when the car is warm enough. I did that simple test: I waited until the noise comes on, then removed the serp belt, the noise is still there! which makes me forget about 1-4 check list, am I right ? Now because the noise is stil there when I shut the engine off (for few seconds until it dies), makes me really think it's not TO bearing.

 

[MaRu_GT]

OP said he did that already and replaced the TO bearing.

And OP, I think you're hiding a positive displacement blower on there somewhere.

Sorry !!! but what does that " I think you're hiding a positive displacement blower on there somewhere" suppose to be!!!

 

[MaRu_GT]

New or not, could still be the throw out bearing. Any pre-load on the TO bearing?

Well, I am not sure what you are asking about..
Anyway.. the Transy is stock T-5 .. and clutch is king cobra (FRPP) with pilot/TO bearings FRPP and stell retainer FRPP.

 

[old_blue]

Well, I am not sure what you are asking about..
Anyway.. the Transy is stock T-5 .. and clutch is king cobra (FRPP) with pilot/TO bearings FRPP and stell retainer FRPP.

This goes back to the T/O bearing. Basically many will whine and Fords answer to this was to put a little preload on the bearing by adjusting the cable or the firewall adjuster. Essentially it is like pushing your foot on the clutch pedal a little. I think I saw this above, but turn your car on and when the whining starts push the clutch in (slowly) and see if it goes away. If it does, you just need a little pre-load on the T/O bearing. If not, then good luck.

 

[stang&2Birds]

Now because the noise is stil there when I shut the engine off (for few seconds until it dies), makes me really think it's not TO bearing.

Could still be the TO. As long as the engine is spinning, the TO bearing can make noise.

It could be a bad TO.
Or, maybe it was damaged when it was put in.
Or, maybe there are other problems in the clutch/assembly.
Etc.

I agree that it's somewhere in the tranny, and not in the 1-4 list that I did.

Like old_blue said, there are many tolerances in the Fox platform. Some people have stuff more towards one end or the other. That's why some people get away with foolish mods, while others have problems with even basic proper mods. It's possible that your setup (/parts) has (/have) tolerances that result in noise, and hence the fix that old_blue suggested.

It's also possible that a new different TO with have tolerances in the other direction, and hence no noise in your setup.

Sorry I can't be any more specific. Hopefully, old_blue's suggestion will work. If not, it seems like the tranny is coming out again. Maybe others can suggest what else to check when/if the tranny comes out.