Roush 03-04 Cobra Saleen v. Saleen Extreme

Discussion in 'Special Production' started by Cali 281SC, Dec 22, 2005.

  1. Extreme550

    Extreme550 New Member

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    its people like you that make me hate forum boards. My statement was merely a matter of my own opinion, maybe you missed that part.

    Secondly...im not here to bash the gt500. That car is definately a work of art, just not my style. looking past performance, i went with the saleen due to the styling and rarity of the car! I had a 2001 non supercharged s281 which i modded the **** out of, and trust me...i feel the same way you do about modding a car. Unfortunately, wanting the ZO6, It was still out of my price range do to sticker markup at the time! Besides the fact, i would rather get a car that is 1 in 160 than 1 in 4000. Half the people i run into (on a daily basis) have never even heard of Saleen. so, as i said, not here to bash shelby, just dont care for the car as a whole. as far as street racing, as i said before, friends of mine that are executives at Saleen have raced their 475 SC saleens w/ gt500 and beat them severly on the freeway, but as i also said, they are professional racers that test Saleen Special Vehicles! ZO6...now on to what i REALLY said...yes...the zo6 definately outperforms an E, but it would be a close race. I said it MIGHT outperform the zo6 which is something friends have told me that work for Saleen, but i disagreed with them and they said it is definately a close race because they've had them head to head. the E runs 12.3 stock, zo6 11.8. Compared to a zo6 on the dyno which would be mid 400's makes up some of the difference in weight TO A DEGREE. Yes, that car is EXTREMELY lightweight and if i had the opportunity to get one, i would’ve gotten that over the E anyday! but also given who i know at saleen and what i REALLY paid for the car...brings YOU back up to reality.

    I know you stated that you didnt mean to be so harsh, well i dont either

    I was contemplating getting just a C6, but I didn’t because I prefer to have a back seat and trunk space. Plus I have a bad back, so climbing in and out of a tiny car is not my gig. Trust me….i know exactly where the z06 stands, but with the opportunity I picked up on the E…its way more than I ever asked for. From what I heard around the metro-detroit areas…I wont disclose the name, but I have heard that an 06 E went onto the dyno at a large auto performance shop, they took the governor off, and it pushed 203 mph, but again, that’s only WHAT I HEARD, but I find that easy to believe given the 6-speed trans and the balls the car still as at 120 mph on the freeway.

    Is that a fair reason for feeling the way I do? Again, I apologize for being “harsh” as you said, but just wanted to clear up what I was trying to get across.

    As far as the suspension goes...no ****...i put a full coil-over suspension system on my previous Saleen...so i know a lot more than you think, but i was kind of classifing this car with other production cars...not aftermarket. as far as stock goes...the suspension on the E is pretty good...not the best...but pretty good....MUCH better than the 99-04 model suspension system, and substantially better than the 06 n/a and s/c models!!!...but im not a dumbass.

    since im not here to bash GT500's, how come it seems you came here to "bash" the E??? cause you certainly said more harmful towards my car than i did the gt500!
     
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  2. Extreme550

    Extreme550 New Member

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    no, i am 100% up to par with "reality" thanks. and by "saleen or mustang period" you mean "saleen mustang or mustang period" correct? cause i think we can all agree that the S7 is still arguably the fastest production car to hit the street :lol:

    200+ off the showroom floow...as i said i dont KNOW FOR SURE, but what i HEARD from a large auto performance shop in Livernois, Michigan ;) ... the governor was taken off an E and dynoed in at 203 mph, but i dont know. The car is definately a freeway car!

    As far as im concerned, its not in a different league from MY standpoint simply because its small and has no back seat but as far as the zo6 goes compared to the E...i wish i owned one!

    just wanted to clearify up any misunderstanding!!! because i am well aware of the zo6, but i think that if you put them in a bracket together, you might be surprised at the E hanging in there with a surprisingly close race! but as a downfall which i mentioned already...it takes time to do SOMETHING in the E...someone argued that its not taking time to build boost which i origionally thought, but it has a delay somewhere when you shift. If you punch the gas to the floor, it takes a second or two for the r's to even move...it must be because of the electronic throttle body, but figure that in at every shiftpoint!
     
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  3. 2000xp8

    2000xp8 Mustang Master

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    You are going by the dyno speed of 203mph?
    That's more of a theoretical number, lacks the biggest facter in a high speed run, which is aerodynamic resistance.
    Can 200 be cracked with an 05 plus mustang? More than likely, since the vortech mustang went 192 missing a few odds and ends, but that's real world with a centrifical supercharger.

    And guys like me balance out the internet, too much i'll kiss your ass if you kiss mine goes on.

    You've got one of the few, get out to the drap strip and road course on your 20's and get some times. I hear all this talk from E owners, but nobody ever does anything.

    What's worse is for 2 grand you can get the jdm 475rwhp kit and get the equivalent E power for a s281 sc car.
     
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  4. elburrito99

    elburrito99 New Member

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    So THAT just happened. Wow, quite a read.

    Extreme550 -- welcome to the forum. I'm a big fan of Saleens, and the E is pretty much a dream car for me. So, yeah, I'm lusting after your ride. Please post some pix when you get a chance.

    For sheer performance, I think it's been well proven that the Z06 is right up there with supercars that cost 3-4x as much.

    Has anyone seen actual test results for an '06-'07 E??? Ultimately, I think sheer physics would allow the Z06 to get around a track faster (since it's lighter, shorter, lower, etc.). Until we actually see these two cars up against each other, we're all just supposin'...

    Btw, imo, the Z06's looks are its weak point. Of course, just before I bought my S281 SC last fall, I did walk into a Chevy dealer to inquire about a Z06. Thankfully, I didn't pull the trigger. I've owned Mustangs for 17 straight years, so I'm not about to cross the line now.
     
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  5. Extreme550

    Extreme550 New Member

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    WOW, thank you! finally some backbone to what i've been saying! lol. I guess what i've been told is right "you have to be a saleen enthusiest to understand saleen" as Steve and his "5 E's" so eloquently put it! :lol:

    I did the same exact thing...think of the ZO6, but im so happy i didnt get it!

    Agreed with you... has anyone REALLY seen what the E can do? underestimation seems to be the key difference, and if i lived near you and got to know you a little bit, i would love for you to take my car for a test drive because as i found out first hand...the SC is a pretty nice well performing car...the E is a whole new animal!

    I would definately like to see the z06 and E go head to head, and not beat, but just surprise all those chevy fans.

    PS - im new here...where would you like me to post the pics? im not sure where to post them
     
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  6. saleen556

    saleen556 New Member

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    I wasn't pointing a finger at you. Some people think that just because they spend 50K-100k on a car that they can't be beat. There are plenty of 5.0 mustangs out there that can hand my car or a new E there ASS. I was referring to a mustang when I was commenting on the Z06 performance off the showroom floor. The S7 is far from a mustang.
     
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  7. marcus95

    marcus95 Active Member

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    +1.



    Joe,



    Come on now. You know E owners will lay down in the street for their own cars.:D

    The most hilarious thing about this whole entire thread is that the topic is obviously asking about the 03/04 Cobra and 02-04 E.

    Hey new guy. Next time just start a new thread introducing yourself. Most of the guys here are a tight group and most importantly pretty level headed. We don't have any ****ing contests here at all compared to other mustang forums.

    I'm sure you love your new car. Start a new thread and post some pics. What bumper number did you purchase?

    I'll only make one comment. To set the record straight I have driven both cars on the track. While 05-06 E car rwhp numbers are similar to the C6 ZO6, the two cars could not be any more different.
    The new E makes plenty of power and is a trackable car for a few laps up to 130 mph or so but after that it's apples and oranges. The new E is a fast mustang, especially in a straight line but not in the same class as the C6 ZO6. The 70lb wagon wheels w/tires at each corner don't help.

    Brad, no one here will deny the new E car is not the pinnacle of Saleen's mustang development for the street. I know it's tough not to be really excited about your new ride. I am a former ( already ) 06 S/C owner so I have been around the block. Most everyone here knows who I am. I think it would be great if you start a new thread and tell us again about all of your favorite points of your new car compared to your 2001 N/A car. Another car I have owned. Like I said earlier post some pics of your new beast. Nothing like carbon fiber bolted to the front and rear of the new mustang.:nice:
    Welcome to the forums.
     
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  8. Cali 281SC

    Cali 281SC New Member

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    It is hilarious, Marcus. I laughed when I saw the post because I posted it many moons ago before the new E and the GT500 even existed on the streets. I posted it because I wanted to upgrade to a Cobra Saleen vert (I still havent found one!). Looks like the post is off track at this point.

    Extreme550, welcome to the board and congrats on the E purchase. Beautiful cars. You will find many owners on this board have owned both the Saleens and Cobras (including me). I haven't driven the new E, but I did drive an 02 E which was an entirely different animal than my 02 sc, without question.

    Once we get to the point where we are having a balls out showdown over specs on z06's, Saleens, Cobras and every other high performance car under the sun, we gotta have some intervention (special thanks to Marcus for mediating).

    Bottom line, most of us just love cars. All of those cars mentioned are great. I would like to have all three in my garage.
     
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  9. Extreme550

    Extreme550 New Member

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    Fair enough. I would like to say that i think everyone is totally misunderstanding me and my situation here in this thread. It is all wrong and from what im hearing is not even my intention in this thread, so yes...let me start fresh by introducing myself in a new thread...properly!

    I think you are all taking this all the wrong way. no one said anything about owning a 70K car meaning you own the streets.

    concuring with you cali...what i just said in my last post i think it was... lets see the numbers ...but i added that i think people might be surprised to see what the "so it seems" underestimated E will do! thats my opinion and im sticking to it.

    laying in the street for our cars? well if by that you mean die hard saleen enthusiest's ... you're damn straight, but by that meaning we think our cars are the fastest thing to hit the face of the earth....no! Simply put...me along with MANY other saleen owners feel their cars are underestimated in forums like this one!

    I will continue with the rest of my speech in my new thread under the Saleen category...check it out!

    :lock:
     
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  10. Tommy98016

    Tommy98016 New Member

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    I don’t think there are any other sites where you will find a more loyal bunch of saleen people then here. IMO the people here are just more realistic in what there car can do.
     
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  11. Extreme550

    Extreme550 New Member

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    i think im being pretty realistic, i said you'd have to put them heads up. i dont really even know how my car would perform and quite honestly, Tommy, i dont really care beecause i bought a show car not a drag car.

    One thing about me on the streets of detroit....im a very modest racer and consider myself a loser in any race until i beat my opponent, unlike MOST.

    i think i am pretty loyal w/ saleen and i dont really know the actual specs of the E...thats why i posted the other thread asking for any E experiences. All i said (and stop confusing it with errogance) was "I think you all might be surprised at what an E can do" thats all i said. i never said it would whomp a zo6, cause it wont...in fact i KNOW it would lose the race...what i said was it might be close if you put them heads up.

    so please dont mistake me for calling my car the "fastest/best" because i dont have any idea how it will perform, i havnt even really gotten to drive it much yet and quite frankly, its going to take at least a good year to get used to all my new power. Im a pretty good driver, but i doubt i can win any close races until i get used to the HUGE difference between my old car and this one.
     
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  12. 98 Saleen Cobra

    98 Saleen Cobra New Member

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    I'm kinda confused about this whole thread so far Extreme550 in one comment you said that you would have loved to have a z06, but in the next you said that you are happy that you never bought a z06.
     
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  13. Extreme550

    Extreme550 New Member

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    lol, sorry for being confusing. I would love to have a zo6 but im glad i went with saleen because im think i might have gotten sick of the vette when ive always been a diehard saleen fan. I never got sick of my last saleen so i dont know what that's like...:shrug: i confuse myself sometimes lol, but i think you understand what i mean.

    I think i meant im happy i didnt buy a C6 not zo6 because the zo6 is out of my league $ wise. like i said i was debating between 07 S/C saleen and 07 C6...got hooked up with the E and now im glad i didnt get the C6, i would have gotten tired of it.
     
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  14. 01saleenkid144

    01saleenkid144 New Member

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    back to topic, Im glad I saw this thread because currently I am looking for a 03-04 WHITE e-car for my girlfriend. I had always thought that an e-car was a saleen cobra. I never knew there was a difference and I read as much as I can on saleens. Now that I know, what are the differences between the 2 cars?? I believe they share the same 4v motor right?? I think I read here, the e-car uses a bigger blower, which I was planning on upgrading to a kb down the road. So would I be better off just getting the saleen cobra and upgrading that?? ANY info would be great. Thanks!!
     
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  15. Cali 281SC

    Cali 281SC New Member

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    Hey Saleenkid.

    At last, the true meaning of the post is realized.

    As far as the 03-04 Saleen's go, both cars do not have a 4v motor. Saleen does not have a 4v car in 03 and 04 with the exception of the Saleen Cobras. All 03-04 Saleens (N/A, SC and E) start with the standard 2v gt motor (the e has internal upgrades, see below). The new (05 plus) Saleens use the 3v platform on all models. I have heard very little about plans to sell a GT500 Shelby Saleen (but how freakin awesome would that be?!?!?, sign me up brother!) Anyways, back to reality:

    An 03-04 Extreme Saleen has a built motor with forged internals, twin screw blower, center pipes, multiple-vents on the hood, six speed tranny and 420 of the good ol' horsie-radish. You get all the other Saleen upgrades like body kit, suspension, brakes, wheels, etc... You see one or two on ebay & autotrader pretty regularly if you dont mind traveling to buy the car.

    A real 03-04 Saleen Cobra is a Cobra mustang (with the twin-cam 32v motor you referenced) shipped from an SVT dealer to Saleen, dressed up with the Saleen kit, suspension, pipes, wheels and badges. Car keeps the IRS, blower, cobra seats (much rather have the recaros IMO), cobra hood and snake badges on the fenders (i have heard stories where Saleen tried to fit the E and SC hood without success, which is why they stick with the Cobra heat extractor hood. I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong).

    The rumor (probably very little rumor and all truth) is that Saleen dealers were getting pressure not to push the 03-04 Saleen Cobras because the cars were cheaper than the E cars (approx $45 sticker for a Saleen Cobra versus approx $65 for an E) and by some accounts, matching and/or outperforming the E cars. This statement always starts a war amongst the E car and Saleen Cobra owners, so let's not do that again.

    Both cars kick major f!*kin ass in my opinion.

    Saleen Cobras are a rare breed indeed. I have been looking for one for over a year and have had very few leads (found a couple coupes, not interested). Usually they are all modded out with KB blowers and all that, like what you are talking about.

    Anyways, hope some of that helps. One of the members made a website a while back with all the production numbers and colors of the cars ever made. I lost the link. Pretty cool if anyone can remember what it was.

    Good luck in your search, buddy.
     
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  16. Tommy98016

    Tommy98016 New Member

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    nice post cali


    Saleen Cobra production numbers for 03-04

    2003
    6 coupes - 2 Redfire, 2 Black, 1 White, 1 Rainbow
    5 convertibles - 1 Satin Silver, 1 Sonic Blue, 1 Black, 1 Zinc Yellow, 1 Lizstick Red (Saleen Custom Color)

    2004
    8 coupes - 3 Black, 2 Mystichrome, 1 White, 1 Redfire, 1 Competition Orange
    10 convertibles - 4 Screaming Yellows, 2 Black, 1 White, 1 Torch Red, 1 Silver Metallic, 1 Mystichrome
     
    #56
  17. Cali 281SC

    Cali 281SC New Member

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    Thanks Tommy


    Yo Saleenkid:

    Here is a white 2001 Saleen Cobra Vert for 24k:

    http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2410338

    He has his classified ad posted on mustangforums.com

    As you can see, the pre 03 Saleen Cobras were outfitted with the standard SC Saleen hood because there was no issue with the blower ontop.

    And here is an 03 white E for sale:

    http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2003...oryZ6236QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

    so there ya go, white Saleen Cobra and white E for sale in one post. Damn, I'm good.
     
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  18. 01saleenkid144

    01saleenkid144 New Member

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    Thanks for the info. I didnt realize the e-car was a forged 2v. I bought mine 3 years ago and have loved it ever since. Ive put a competition show stereo in it and put a procharger p1sc-2 with all the supporting mods. As we speak a new motor is being built for it(forged bottom end, fox lake stg2 heads, blower cams, p51 intake, shorty headers, meth injection, new clutch). Hoping to get close to 600rwhp out of it. We'll see. My gf has decided she now wants one. She currently drives a 99 m3 with 19" maya wheels, intake, chip, cat-back exhaust, and a competition show stereo. Its a really nice car, but we looked into turbo'ing it, and its just sooo much money and the results just arent there. She'd be spending more than i did for like 420-450 rwhp. So I told her to find an e-car(thinking it used the 32-valve motor) and throw a kenne bell on it and she would immediately have more hp than me. But, of course it has to be a white one. Now, seeing the production numbers, it will be nearly impossible to find one. :bang: Oh well, Ill keep my eyes peeled. Thanks for the info again!!
     
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  19. conway2004

    conway2004 New Member

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    These guys are right both cars really are beasts. I was deciding between a 1999 S351, saleen E car, or a saleen cobra. I had been looking forever!! I finally bought a 2004 saleen cobra mystichrome coupe a couple months back. Iam absolutely in love with the car, even though haven't had it out on the road but 1 time!!! Either way you go Iam sure you will be happy. Good luck on your search and let me know if you need anything.

    Brandon
     
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  20. marcus95

    marcus95 Active Member

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    Having owned one of each, I have to agree with you Brandon. There's nothing like the torque of the 351 but to have a real Saleen that is also a Terminator is probabaly the finest combo I can think of.
    That's unless someone has enough dough and not enough brains to send a new GT500 to Saleen and only if Saleen will build an SGT500 ???? Would that be the correct name for a GT500 Saleen? It may be over 4,000 lbs and heavier than my Mercedes 4 door but what a car that would be.
     
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