Advice With This Possible 331 Build

[from6to8]

What's going on guys. Yes I might go ahead and build a 331 and the builder is going to get the parts himself vs getting a stroker kit. I am thinking about using my TF heads
Edel per rpm 2 intake
He will do a custom cam
I have 24lber's ( would I need to go up to 30's or....)
Have shorty headers and might just stick with those
Basani X pipe
2 chamber flowmasters
75 mm MAF
70 mm TB
255 lb hr feul pump
Thoughts on using my heads and intake vs say getting the AFR 165s for what I want to do with the car which is a non track car, just streetable. I'm convinced and after talking to him and reading up, the 165's will suffice for me and vs the 185's I would be happier with the 165's if not my heads. Now if it isn't night and day from my heads to the 165's, I would rather just save that money and use mine.
Any other tidbits of info let me know

 

[FoxMustangLvr]

Aren't the TFS 170cc twisted wedge heads just as good if slightly better than AFR 165s? Doesn't seem worth the headache and expense to swap them as I don't see it being an upgrade. Wouldn't the AFR 185s be a better upgrade for a 331 over the 165s?

Why not upgrade to full length 1 5/8" headers?

 

[Chuckman]

Stick with the tfs heads you have, going to an afr165 would be a downgrade, a 185 would be virtually a straight trade. A 200cc+ would be an upgrade, but the tfs heads should be fine with what you have planned. Make sure to get the tfs specific pistons though, wont cost any more than inline stuff, and will allow for a healthier cam.

You'll probably want the 30lb injectors, and as mentioned a longtube header would be more optimal, but you can always do those latter if cost is an issue.

 

[A5literMan]

^^^^ what they said if you are just using it on the street 30# inj would be my choice. You could probably get away with the 24's and play with the fuel pressure a little but I'd error on the save side. LT's vs shortys are worth easily 10-25 hp and tq. Definetly keep the TFS heads over the Afr 165's.

 

[from6to8]

Stick with the tfs heads you have, going to an afr165 would be a downgrade, a 185 would be virtually a straight trade. A 200cc+ would be an upgrade, but the tfs heads should be fine with what you have planned. Make sure to get the tfs specific pistons though, wont cost any more than inline stuff, and will allow for a healthier cam.

You'll probably want the 30lb injectors, and as mentioned a longtube header would be more optimal, but you can always do those latter if cost is an issue.

ok sounds good. What fitment issues will be with the longtubes or I thought I read somewhere before about certain headers it was harder to change the plugs with some?

my exhaust would have to modified too right? I have a Basani X

 

[A5literMan]

Get the Bassani long tubes. Very nice headers but are expensive. All LT's are more challenging to get in than shortys but most aren't a big deal. Mac are the worse. If you really aren't concerned with maximum power stay with the shortys.

ok sounds good. What fitment issues will be with the longtubes or I thought I read somewhere before about certain headers it was harder to change the plugs with some?

my exhaust would have to modified too right? I have a Basani X

 

[A5literMan]

And you would need a new mid pipe or modify that one if switching.

 

[madspeed]

Longtubes are much easier to install by inserting from the bottom

 

[from6to8]

Get the Bassani long tubes. Very nice headers but are expensive. All LT's are more challenging to get in than shortys but most aren't a big deal. Mac are the worse. If you really aren't concerned with maximum power stay with the shortys.

yeah definitely not trying to break the bank and would definitely be nice to know how much more the LT's would provide in numbers over the shorties and can base my decision on that

 

[bentley429isBAC]

Needs bigger heads, TB, Maf, injectors and long tubes.

 

[from6to8]

Needs bigger heads, TB, Maf, injectors and long tubes.

what size tb

 

[bentley429isBAC]

90.

 

[A5literMan]

OP you can basically run all your present parts if you want. It will drive fine...Make descent everyday power...etc etc. If you want to maximize the build(still more street than drag race) and don't mind buying more/different parts then here are some suggestions

80+mm pro m or equivalent mas,75mm accu fab tb,Holley systeMax intake,tfs 11r 190-205cc head or AFR's,30-42# inj,LT headers,a custom hyd roller cam for a 331-347 w/operating range from 25-6000rpm,a good tune,etc. Around 10:1 cr., good gaskets,rings,bearings,arp bolts,aftermarket oil pan(moroso,canton,etc). Would/should make 350-400rwhp and a strong torque curve.

 

[from6to8]

OP you can basically run all your present parts if you want. It will drive fine...Make descent everyday power...etc etc. If you want to maximize the build(still more street than drag race) and don't mind buying more/different parts then here are some suggestions

80+mm pro m or equivalent mas,75mm accu fab tb,Holley systeMax intake,tfs 11r 190-205cc head or AFR's,30-42# inj,LT headers,a custom hyd roller cam for a 331-347 w/operating range from 25-6000rpm,a good tune,etc. Around 10:1 cr., good gaskets,rings,bearings,arp bolts,aftermarket oil pan(moroso,canton,etc). Would/should make 350-400rwhp and a strong torque curve.

I would think my Edel rpm 2 and that Holley would be about the same ???????

Man sounds nice. I am compiling my list now but I don't want to go with 205's as the engine builder I have talked extensively to and met back in jan tolf me for what I want to do with the car, as he has learned me over that span also lol, he said what I have or at the lowest 165 cc's as he has tested with similiar setups to mine pulled hard as heck up to 6500 or 6800 he said. He said he has teste similiar setups with the 165's and the 205s. He acknowledged that the 205's are more capable yes, but I guess for me I will probably average in the 2500 power band most of the time and playing around with it ofcourse getting all into it. He said the 165s per say down low would definitely overall as tested be more to my liking. I won't buy the 165's though and would just use my TF heads or if I can sell them, get probably the newer version as I bought mine slightly used back in 05.

Would the newer TF heads similiar to mine be nite and day? I guess I need to go to the website or call the techs next week and see what they tell me????

 

[Chuckman]

The regular wedge heads havent changed in a few years, and are available in 170cc (most common), 185cc, 205cc, and 225cc. The new 11r heads re-angle the valves a little bit, and are 190 and 205cc iirc, though they seem to be replacing the whole older line. Are they better? Yes. Would it be worth the coin to do a straight cc to cc trade? Probably not. Plenty of guys make decent power with the same heads you have on 347s, so id stick with them for a while if this is indeed a budget build. Your intake will be fine too, and tb will work fine as well.

Obviously, you can go bigger, just depends on budget, which I was assuming was low since you were asking about reusing stuff, but I dont see anywhere that mentions budget in this. If money really isnt an issue, a 200cc class head, and a super victor efi or tfsr/box intake would work well together.

Also, if you haven't bought the rotating assembly yet, go 347 over the 331, price will be about the same, and modern 347s don't have the oil burning issues some of the older ones can have.

 

[A5literMan]

165's are for mild 302 builds. Like I said the 170's will work fine. Forgot you had an Eddy intake. That is a great intake for what you want. My recommendations for bigger parts are if you want the higher hp numbers others have built. I think you don't want that kinda set up. Power difference isn't that big a deal for a street car anyway and not worth the extra cash. The difference is probably less than 50 hp. Just an FYI the new tfs 11r heads are way better than the older versions.

 

[from6to8]

The regular wedge heads havent changed in a few years, and are available in 170cc (most common), 185cc, 205cc, and 225cc. The new 11r heads re-angle the valves a little bit, and are 190 and 205cc iirc, though they seem to be replacing the whole older line. Are they better? Yes. Would it be worth the coin to do a straight cc to cc trade? Probably not. Plenty of guys make decent power with the same heads you have on 347s, so id stick with them for a while if this is indeed a budget build. Your intake will be fine too, and tb will work fine as well.

Obviously, you can go bigger, just depends on budget, which I was assuming was low since you were asking about reusing stuff, but I dont see anywhere that mentions budget in this. If money really isnt an issue, a 200cc class head, and a super victor efi or tfsr/box intake would work well together.

Also, if you haven't bought the rotating assembly yet, go 347 over the 331, price will be about the same, and modern 347s don't have the oil burning issues some of the older ones can have.

just now seeing you guys replies, don't think i saw an email alert ;(
not really that budget is an issue, but I'm just one that strongly believes to use what I have if there's nothing wrong with it and if theres not going to be much difference in it or buying something new that might be bigger but not necessarily better so in that regard I want to be smart about it and saving money is always a good thing for anyone

not sure about the 347 but will talk to my builder and see from his experiences and knowing me over 6 months, what he thinks will make me happier.......


it would be beneficial for me to possibly get new heads and instead of me shipping mine to him, I will let him get them or me buy and have them shipped to him so he can put everything together and at most when I get the engine I just have to put the intake on and maybe front accesories. In that case I can still drive the car on weekends and when get the engine back the car won't be down for more than a month at most.

i wonder how hard will it be to sell my heads on ebay or craigslist or the forums and about how much can i expect to get? A new set of springs was just put on, i believe K motion or Pac

 

[A5literMan]

just now seeing you guys replies, don't think i saw an email alert ;(
not really that budget is an issue, but I'm just one that strongly believes to use what I have if there's nothing wrong with it and if theres not going to be much difference in it or buying something new that might be bigger but not necessarily better so in that regard I want to be smart about it and saving money is always a good thing for anyone

not sure about the 347 but will talk to my builder and see from his experiences and knowing me over 6 months, what he thinks will make me happier.......


it would be beneficial for me to possibly get new heads and instead of me shipping mine to him, I will let him get them or me buy and have them shipped to him so he can put everything together and at most when I get the engine I just have to put the intake on and maybe front accesories. In that case I can still drive the car on weekends and when get the engine back the car won't be down for more than a month at most.

i wonder how hard will it be to sell my heads on ebay or craigslist or the forums and about how much can i expect to get? A new set of springs was just put on, i believe K motion or Pac

Used tfs heads run around 750$ some get a little more some a little less. If you are just wanting a nice street cruiser I'd stick with the heads you have.

 

[from6to8]

Used tfs heads run around 750$ some get a little more some a little less. If you are just wanting a nice street cruiser I'd stick with the heads you have.

yea i just have to decide rather i wana take mines off and ship or what.

i'd like him to do everything so that's less for me to tackle. I dont have an engine stand or anything and dont need i need to invest in one. I won't be messing with it like that