Cleveland headed windsor

[351wcoupe]

Just wondering if anybody here has done this swap?
What info have you guys found?
I have all of my part numbers except for the head gasket number.

 

[gearheadboy]

Do a web search for CLEAVOR if you haven't already. The intake is the hard part. It'll be a screamer! best of both worlds.

 

[gearheadboy]

Hey I bumped into this page full of useful info on that subject and others. It really has alot of info for you. http://www.angelfire.com/ar/dw42/sbf.htm

 

[351wcoupe]

Thats a ton of reading but what I've read looks good.

Here's the one that I found.
Head swap

 

[351wcoupe]

Anyody know what pushrods to use?

 

[dustang90]

There were motors with those heads from the factory, they are called 351 modified. Alot of trucks had those. But you will have to do machining to get the antifreeze passages to work to put cleveland heads on a windsor motor

 

[SmockDoiley]

I did it, and its a blast. Its not really hard and its pretty cheap too. The info I found some great info on some sites but I'm on my work comp right now so I'll post them when I get home. The intake isnt that hard and you have 2 choices. www.pricemotorsports.com which has adapters to mount any intake you can think of to a clevor headed windsor, or this other site, again I need to get the name, but they have the original B&A intakes brand new. They run about $450 and they have both the Track and Street Boss intakes. That site shows you how to modify the heads but basically the larger water hole on the surface of the heads needs to get drilled out so you have fit a freeze plug in it. Then you drill a hole on the intake side so that water will run through the intake instead of back into the head since Clevelands dont originally have a provision to push water through the intake like Windsors. There are some new steam holes that need to be drilled out too, and as for the pushrods just use a checker to see what you need since you should do that with any head change project. Hope this helps out. If your doing a 302-351 use the 2V heads, but use 4V's for the windsor strokers with a 392 or 408. I have 4V heads on a 427 stroker and it works great because the engine is large enough to use those runners.

 

[DblAdigger]

Wrong!

There were motors with those heads from the factory, they are called 351 modified. Alot of trucks had those. But you will have to do machining to get the antifreeze passages to work to put cleveland heads on a windsor motor

351M/400 engines are NOT Windsor blocks. They belong to the Cleveland family with the extended front of the block, flat steel timing covers, and verticaly oriented fuel pump bolts.

 

[jrichker]

What headers will fit the 351c 2v heads? Will the 302 headers work, or is this a speciality item like the intake manifold adapters?

 

[SmockDoiley]

there are some companies in the back of the 5.0 mags that make custom headers or you can see if there are shorty cleveland headers and if so if they may clear everything in your mustang. If they make shorty headers for Clevelands which I doubt they'd probably clear everything.

 

[351wcoupe]

I did it, and its a blast. Its not really hard and its pretty cheap too. The info I found some great info on some sites but I'm on my work comp right now so I'll post them when I get home. The intake isnt that hard and you have 2 choices. www.pricemotorsports.com which has adapters to mount any intake you can think of to a clevor headed windsor, or this other site, again I need to get the name, but they have the original B&A intakes brand new. They run about $450 and they have both the Track and Street Boss intakes. That site shows you how to modify the heads but basically the larger water hole on the surface of the heads needs to get drilled out so you have fit a freeze plug in it. Then you drill a hole on the intake side so that water will run through the intake instead of back into the head since Clevelands dont originally have a provision to push water through the intake like Windsors. There are some new steam holes that need to be drilled out too, and as for the pushrods just use a checker to see what you need since you should do that with any head change project. Hope this helps out. If your doing a 302-351 use the 2V heads, but use 4V's for the windsor strokers with a 392 or 408. I have 4V heads on a 427 stroker and it works great because the engine is large enough to use those runners.

I found the pricemotorsports page last night too and I'll probably go that route and get adaptors because I have a bunch windsor intakes.
Here's what I have: 4 351M, 1 400M, 1 set 4v cleveland heads, 4 tall deck windsors. I can't buy but I have access to 302 Boss heads for reference.

So far I have plugged the water jackets and bolted them to a junk 351w.
I found that the pre-74 "tall deck" 351w 72-73(i think) has the same crank specs as the 400 (except stroke ) If I could use the 400 crank It should be at 408ci but would rods would I use? The only pistons I could find are the KB 110 and kb 117. These are for stock specs bottom ends and hypereutectic. Does anybody else make them forged and for a 408?

Thanks guys I think its going to happen now.

 

[351wcoupe]

Also what RPM range are the 2V vs the 4V?

 

[SmockDoiley]

Using a 400M crank, and Chrysler rods you'd have a 427. With the 400M, you need to mill the snout so its the same as the windsor cranks. As for pistons, there are companies that do make pistons for this swap. Unless you are going to use a power adder, the hypers will work fine. Think of 2V's and 4V's like AFR165/185's or 225's. Using 4V's on a 408 will help make it streetable because the size of the engine compared to a 302. Power will most likely be 2500-7000. 2V's on a 408 will run nice but wont make as much power. You'll probably start to die out at 6000rpms. This is just a rough but should give you a rough idea.

 

[351wcoupe]

Using a 400M crank, and Chrysler rods you'd have a 427. With the 400M, you need to mill the snout so its the same as the windsor cranks. As for pistons, there are companies that do make pistons for this swap. Unless you are going to use a power adder, the hypers will work fine. Think of 2V's and 4V's like AFR165/185's or 225's. Using 4V's on a 408 will help make it streetable because the size of the engine compared to a 302. Power will most likely be 2500-7000. 2V's on a 408 will run nice but wont make as much power. You'll probably start to die out at 6000rpms. This is just a rough but should give you a rough idea.

my dyno programmed agreed with you pretty close. I don't plan on driving this on the street but I didn't think I would need the 4V heads. What chrysler rods work I have a bunch o big and small chrysler engines here too.
What do you mean when you say mill the snout?
do you have any part numbers or prices on swap pistons?

 

[351wcoupe]

my dyno programmed agreed with you pretty close. I don't plan on driving this on the street but I didn't think I would need the 4V heads. What chrysler rods work I have a bunch o big and small chrysler engines here too.
What do you mean when you say mill the snout?
do you have any part numbers or prices on swap pistons?

ttt

 

[siege]

hmm...anybody got any flow numbers for these heads? seems like they might be a good/cheaper alternative to a lot of the aluminum heads out there (especially for a budget 331 maybe? )

 

[351wcoupe]

hmm...anybody got any flow numbers for these heads? seems like they might be a good/cheaper alternative to a lot of the aluminum heads out there (especially for a budget 331 maybe? )

This ones great

http://home.isoa.net/~mharrisj/fordhead.html