cleveland parts

[D.Hearne]

Exactly WHEN did I say a broken piston WOULD NOT scruff a wall? You said that was the only cause.

I think we're done.

Now WHEN did I say that? HUH? You're about as dumb as a fence post. And when did you say a broken piston would not scuff a wall ? You NEVER , not once, even suggested that was a possibility. All you do is avoid the issue when someone else shows your logic to be wrong. THAT's your problem. SO good, I'm sure pleased you're done. You didn't have anything intelligent to add here anyway.

 

[mikethebike]

Now WHEN did I say that? HUH? You're about as dumb as a fence post. And when did you say a broken piston would not scuff a wall ? You NEVER , not once, even suggested that was a possibility. All you do is avoid the issue when someone else shows your logic to be wrong. THAT's your problem. SO good, I'm sure pleased you're done. You didn't have anything intelligent to add here anyway.

But YOU stated that a short connecting rod causing an acute rod angle (btw this angle is measured at the wrist pin in relationship to the rod when the rod and crank journal are at a 90 degree angle on either a power or intake stroke) would not cause the cylinder wall to scruff. DIDN'T you. Einstein.

P.S.
Kiss my ass.

 

[D.Hearne]

But YOU stated that a short connecting rod causing an acute rod angle (btw this angle is measured at the wrist pin in relationship to the rod when the rod and crank journal are at a 90 degree angle on either a power or intake stroke) would not cause the cylinder wall to scruff. DIDN'T you. Einstein.

P.S.
Kiss my ass.

See, there you go again Putting words in others mouths. When did I say that? HUH, Einstein? Go back and reread what I've posted. Or are you capable of doing something as simple as that? You can't even keep what others posted straight to even attempt to put on an intelligent arguement. No wonder no one has taken your side. You HAVE no side to take.

 

[mikethebike]

See, there you go again Putting words in others mouths. When did I say that? HUH, Einstein? Go back and reread what I've posted. Or are you capable of doing something as simple as that? You can't even keep what others posted straight to even attempt to put on an intelligent arguement. No wonder no one has taken your side. You HAVE no side to take.

You know, if I considered you to have an iota of intelligence I'd be moderately upset by your tirades and personal attacks. But I do not and am not.

 

[rbohm]

You know, if I considered you to have an iota of intelligence I'd be moderately upset by your tirades and personal attacks. But I do not and am not.

mike, act your age not your IQ. if you had any real intelligence you might clear the clouds from your mind, stop the name dropping, and actually read some of the things that DH has written. you might then realize that while he is not david vizard, he does know what he is talking about.

 

[mikethebike]

mike, act your age not your IQ. if you had any real intelligence you might clear the clouds from your mind, stop the name dropping, and actually read some of the things that DH has written. you might then realize that while he is not david vizard, he does know what he is talking about.

NOT when it comes to BOSS-302 street motors. I had TWO of them. I know what was wrong with the engine design. If you notice, I don't talk about automatic transmissions, BB FE motors, or BOSS 429's.....why is this....I NEVER owned one. I'll talk of personal experience with BOSS 302's, Gurney-Weslakes, 396/375 BB Chevy's, H-P 289's, 427 BB Chevy's and a few SB Chevy's because I have actually OWNED them. And while a couple of folks on here may have more BOOK knowledge about some engine that, as a friend of mine said 30 years ago when some snot-nosed kid corrected him about a Shelby Cobra and that was this:

"So the kid memorized a list of facts, that will never change the fact that I owned the 29th Cobra ever built, a 289 Cobra and a 427 Cobra. Remember that when someone starts telling you he knows more about one of the cars you have actually owned when he as never had one. All they are is someone who wants to boost their ego with memorized facts."

 

[D.Hearne]

NOT when it comes to BOSS-302 street motors. I had TWO of them. I know what was wrong with the engine design. If you notice, I don't talk about automatic transmissions, BB FE motors, or BOSS 429's.....why is this....I NEVER owned one. I'll talk of personal experience with BOSS 302's, Gurney-Weslakes, 396/375 BB Chevy's, H-P 289's, 427 BB Chevy's and a few SB Chevy's because I have actually OWNED them. And while a couple of folks on here may have more BOOK knowledge about some engine that, as a friend of mine said 30 years ago when some snot-nosed kid corrected him about a Shelby Cobra and that was this:

"So the kid memorized a list of facts, that will never change the fact that I owned the 29th Cobra ever built, a 289 Cobra and a 427 Cobra. Remember that when someone starts telling you he knows more about one of the cars you have actually owned when he as never had one. All they are is someone who wants to boost their ego with memorized facts."

You MAY have owned a Boss 302 (so now it's TWO of em? ) Yea, right. But there's a vast difference in owning them and REMEMBERING what you did or think you did with em thirty years ago. It's apparent here that your memory is suspect in retaining information accurately. And I could care less of what you think of me. I certainly won't be loosing sleep over your "Highness's" thoughts of us Peons.

 

[Hack]

NOT when it comes to BOSS-302 street motors. I had TWO of them. I know what was wrong with the engine design. If you notice, I don't talk about automatic transmissions, BB FE motors, or BOSS 429's.....why is this....I NEVER owned one. I'll talk of personal experience with BOSS 302's, Gurney-Weslakes, 396/375 BB Chevy's, H-P 289's, 427 BB Chevy's and a few SB Chevy's because I have actually OWNED them. And while a couple of folks on here may have more BOOK knowledge about some engine that, as a friend of mine said 30 years ago when some snot-nosed kid corrected him about a Shelby Cobra and that was this:

"So the kid memorized a list of facts, that will never change the fact that I owned the 29th Cobra ever built, a 289 Cobra and a 427 Cobra. Remember that when someone starts telling you he knows more about one of the cars you have actually owned when he as never had one. All they are is someone who wants to boost their ego with memorized facts."

As has been said before, owning something doesn't mean you know anything about it. I trust something that is published in a book a lot more than some loud mouth on the internet.

edit: oh, and some people on here have proven over time that they know what they're talking about. It says something about your knowledge (or lack thereof) that you have chosen to attack people who not only know the most, but are also reasonable people who rarely get in e-fights.

 

[D.Hearne]

His post's remind me of all the nitwits who come up to you at car events and vividly recall their cars they had "back in the day" . "yea, I remember the 62 Galaxie I bought brand new off the show room floor, had a Boss 427 with a Hurst 5 speed, and 5.30 Posi rearend." "Man that thing would fly............ Nothing in 6 states would touch it. " Outrun the cops so many times, I lost count". "Then there was the 68 Lincoln I bought that had a DOHC 390 in it." "Had an Allison 4 speed automatic behind it" "also had a 67 F100 with a Hemi 289 in it"

 

[Gud T.B. Blown]

NOT when it comes to BOSS-302 street motors. I had TWO of them. I know what was wrong with the engine design. If you notice, I don't talk about automatic transmissions, BB FE motors, or BOSS 429's.....why is this....I NEVER owned one. I'll talk of personal experience with BOSS 302's, Gurney-Weslakes, 396/375 BB Chevy's, H-P 289's, 427 BB Chevy's and a few SB Chevy's because I have actually OWNED them. And while a couple of folks on here may have more BOOK knowledge about some engine that, as a friend of mine said 30 years ago when some snot-nosed kid corrected him about a Shelby Cobra and that was this:

"So the kid memorized a list of facts, that will never change the fact that I owned the 29th Cobra ever built, a 289 Cobra and a 427 Cobra. Remember that when someone starts telling you he knows more about one of the cars you have actually owned when he as never had one. All they are is someone who wants to boost their ego with memorized facts."

Owning something does not automatically impart the knowledge of the product to the owner, no matter what it is.
In the past I've owned a variety of cars with a variety of engines but I'm not going to claim expert status on a 383 Dodge or and Olds 455 or a Supercharged 3 cylinder Rotax. I also own 3 computers and I certainly couldn't tell you how the darn machines use electrical current to do what they do on all but the most basic level.

 

[bnickel]

i know small block fords, 351w and 351c and 351m and 400 really well, but i've owned v6 buicks, 4 cylinder fords, 4 cylinder mitsubishis and don't jack **** about them even though i've worked on all of them and even rebuilt them.

and you've already shown your lack of knowledge about the boss 302 heads which are identical to the 351 cleveland heads for the most part other than coolant passages and some other minor differences. and the lower end of the boss 302 is pretty much identical to any other 302 other than 4 bolt mains and screw in freeze plugs oh and the aforementioned hi-po 289 connecting rods. so what's to know about it that owning one gives you such knowledge that it's impossible for anyone who has never owned one to know?

it seems to me that you are the one trying to boost your own ego rather than any of us, because you're so special for having owned a boss 302 and most of the rest of us haven't. i own a 69 mustang GT coupe and as far as i know i'm only the one on the board that does, there are a couple of people who have convertibles but i have the only coupe. i don't go around telling people that they don't know anything about my car because they've never owned one but rather i try to share my knowledge with anyone that needs it or asks for it. so, maybe you should rethink your self centered attitude a bit and get over yourself. :Zip2:

 

[mikethebike]

i know small block fords, 351w and 351c and 351m and 400 really well, but i've owned v6 buicks, 4 cylinder fords, 4 cylinder mitsubishis and don't jack **** about them even though i've worked on all of them and even rebuilt them.

and you've already shown your lack of knowledge about the boss 302 heads which are identical to the 351 cleveland heads for the most part other than coolant passages and some other minor differences. and the lower end of the boss 302 is pretty much identical to any other 302 other than 4 bolt mains and screw in freeze plugs oh and the aforementioned hi-po 289 connecting rods. so what's to know about it that owning one gives you such knowledge that it's impossible for anyone who has never owned one to know?

it seems to me that you are the one trying to boost your own ego rather than any of us, because you're so special for having owned a boss 302 and most of the rest of us haven't. i own a 69 mustang GT coupe and as far as i know i'm only the one on the board that does, there are a couple of people who have convertibles but i have the only coupe. i don't go around telling people that they don't know anything about my car because they've never owned one but rather i try to share my knowledge with anyone that needs it or asks for it. so, maybe you should rethink your self centered attitude a bit and get over yourself. :Zip2:

I think what is going on here is I am willing to admit the truth about those motors and that is that they were DEFFECTIVE in design. otherwise Ford would not have put the first production electronic rev-limiter on the damn things and all you "Ford can do no wrong" types cannot stand the truth.
I owned a 1970 and bought a 69 motor to go through and install when I broke the 70's motor. Funny how my 271hp289 would rev 7000+ and not need a rebuild for more than 60,000 miles but at around 35,000 the 302 broke 7 pistons. I would NEVER own another without the 5.4" rods. Find a copy of SS%DI and read about their 318" BOSS drag car that ruined cylinder walls.
Her's the truth about street Fords in the 1960's....THEY COULD NOT KEEP-UP WITH THE CHEVY'S AND MOPARS.....not until a former Chevy division president named Bunky Kundsen came over and created the 428 CJ, BOSS 302 and BOSS 429. Didn't like hearing THAT, did you. And please, answer this...exactly WHERE is Ford in Pro-Stock nowadays?
Don't get me wrong, I really like my little 289 65 coupe...but I do know and admit the truth. And the truth will be that if GM builds the new Camaro it will cost the same or less than the Mustang and outperform it in all catorgories. Always has..always will.

 

[mikethebike]

You MAY have owned a Boss 302 (so now it's TWO of em? ) Yea, right. But there's a vast difference in owning them and REMEMBERING what you did or think you did with em thirty years ago. It's apparent here that your memory is suspect in retaining information accurately. And I could care less of what you think of me. I certainly won't be loosing sleep over your "Highness's" thoughts of us Peons.

PLEASE, read my previous post.....the one about how great Fords ran aganist Chevy's and who created BOSS Mustangs and CJ's. That should make your day.

 

[rbohm]

mike, like the others have said, you need to get over yourself. you are not aj foyt or richard petty, but you do seem to be a legend in your own mind. i dont claim to know everything, and i never will. i also dont claim to be an authority on everything. if there is something i dont know about, and i have an interest in it, i will study that subject, and i will go to the experts with any questions i have. some of the guys here can tell you that i havent always given the best of advice at times, and neither has DH, or some of the others, always given their best. when it is pointed out to us, we will check the information given to us and recognize our errors, we learn something new, and move on, or we agree to disagree. read some of the threads where historic and i have disagreed on the best suspension set ups for the street or the track. DH and i have debated a few times also. my suggestion to you is, leave the attitude at the door, double and triple check your information, stop the name dropping, and play nice with the rest of us, or end up getting ignored by everyone. right now i rather seriously doubt you are what you say you are. you sound like a frustrated 14 year old who is trying to impress people with your own "book knowledge", and cant stand being told by your elders that you are wrong about something. i hope you listen to what i have said here, and take it to heart. it is always good to have another enthusiast on the boards who can either learn or teach. both are useful, but a bad attitude is not useful.

 

[D.Hearne]

PLEASE, read my previous post.....the one about how great Fords ran aganist Chevy's and who created BOSS Mustangs and CJ's. That should make your day.

I read it and there's nothing there..................I'm sorry, did you say something? I think rbohm nailed who you really are. Now be a nice boy and go play with your Dad's HotWheels cars.

 

[rbohm]

I read it and there's nothing there..................I'm sorry, did you say something? I think rbohm nailed who you really are. Now be a nice boy and go play with your Dad's HotWheels cars.

 

[CochinoFilipino]

WOW. If you take away the personal attacks and E-drama this thread has some pretty good discussion.

 

[ratio411]

PLEASE, read my previous post.....the one about how great Fords ran aganist Chevy's and who created BOSS Mustangs and CJ's. That should make your day.

Bunkie didn't "create" anything.
He was a marketing guy and got things done on an executive level, sure...
However, the engines were designed by talented engineers with input from some team players in Ford's racing circles.
The "Boss" name was coined by Shinoda as a marketing tool... Taken straight from hippy lingo of the time.
And yes, Shinoda was like Bunkie in that he also made the rounds in Detroit...
They both whored themselves to several different manufacturers over the years.
Whoever paid best at the given time.
They were sharp guys, so why not?


Edit:
Btw, I have met MANY Boss 302 owners over the years.
You sound very typical for the crowd I have met.
Like the guy that was selling his "original" 1979 Granada 4 door with a factory installed Boss 302... First 2v Boss I had ever seen!
He claimed that the order sheet had the option box way at the bottom and no one noticed. That's why they are so rare.

Or the guy with the factory equipped "Boss 302" F100... His exact words when I told him it wasn't a Boss: "Look! It's a got a 4 barrel... It's a Boss!"

I could go on and on.

Then there are folks I have met that had the real thing.
They were only interested in ego and made no attempt to truely know the engine. They usually had more money (or daddy's money) than brains and someone else did the wrenching.

 

[180 Out]

Her's the truth about street Fords in the 1960's....THEY COULD NOT KEEP-UP WITH THE CHEVY'S AND MOPARS.....not until a former Chevy division president named Bunky Kundsen came over and created the 428 CJ, BOSS 302 and BOSS 429. Didn't like hearing THAT, did you. And please, answer this...exactly WHERE is Ford in Pro-Stock nowadays?
Don't get me wrong, I really like my little 289 65 coupe...but I do know and admit the truth. And the truth will be that if GM builds the new Camaro it will cost the same or less than the Mustang and outperform it in all catorgories. Always has..always will.

I always think this kind of thing must strike the young-uns as verrrry strange: old geezers arguing over who ruled the roost in this category or that, forty five freakin years ago! I mean, I had this same conversation in 7th grade, but that was in 1966!.

OK, so you want to talk history, let's do. Let's make a list:

First affordable mass-produced car: Ford Model T. This car truly changed America, and therefore the world.

First mass-produced V8: '32 Ford.

First to put styling, color selection, and frivolity before substance, performance and value: GM, starting in the '20's when it hired Harley Earl, but really taking off with the '59 model year. Detroit at its peak, and also the beginning of the end, both at the same time.

First mass-produced overhead valve V8: GM, with the 1949 Olds and Caddy, and more significantly the '55 small block Chevy.

Worst American car of the post-war era: two-way tie: the '60 Corvair (maybe the greatest disregard for the customer's safety of any car ever built) and the '61 Tempest (with the Corvair transaxle, the cut-in-half V8, and the rope drive to try to mask the vibrations); truly a terrible, terrible device. Then there are all the horrible '70s' cars from Mopar. Ford doesn't even have a horse in this race.

Worst American powerplant of the post-war era: three-way tie: the aforementioned '61 Pontiac 4-cyl, the '71 all-aluminum Vega sohc, and the '78 Olds diesel. None of these engines had any prospect whatsoever of delivering good service to the customer. Honorable mention: the early '69 Boss 302 (happy now?) and the '81 Cadillac 8-6-4.

Post war production engine so bad-a$$ it had to legislated out of existence by every sanctioning body it ran in: the Chrysler 426 hemi; runner up: the Ford Cleveland.

Production engine that in its era dominated sports car racing world-wide: Ford 289, whether in the Shelby Cobra, the Shelby GT350 or the Ford GT (where it won at LeMans, gave way to the 427 Mk II, then came back to win again after the 427 was banned).

Prototype engine that did the same, in Formula 1 and CART: Ford Cosworth DFV and DFX.

The only pony car you can still buy; that is, the only one that's the top performer in the only category that counts: Ford Mustang.

Pony cars destined to make a splash with retro returns, only to fade into the past for a second time: Dodge Challenger (if they even build it) and Chevy Crapmaro; see also the late Pontiac GTO.

Best bang for buck today, small block division: Chevy 383.

Best bang for buck today, big block division: Ford 460.

Well, you get the idea.

And while we're pondering where is Ford in Pro Stock these days -- and who isn't? -- we might also ask where is the "stock" in Pro Stock these days? As in, who cares?

Hey, and did anyone notice that Chevy with its new Nextel Cup motor has finally put the distributor in the right end and dropped the twin intake, twin exhaust port design -- i.e., they made a copy of the 1962 Ford "Fairlane" V8? After 45 years, they finally got it right.

 

[D.Hearne]

I think you got one thing wrong up there. The Bad ass engine legislated out of existence wasn't the Mopar Hemi, but the Ford SOHC 427. And only then cause Nascar didn't want to give the "Wine & Cheese" racers from Europe a foot in the door with their high tech small displacement V8's (that got their butts handed to them with a big nasty passenger car pushrod V8 at Lemans )