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Discussion in '2005 - 2009 Specific Tech' started by 02roush, Jul 27, 2004.
Geez wheres the love? Too much hostility
You're right, time for a group hug
Id like to buy the world some coke.
Wow, you're thick man
We've been over:
1) the fact that these types of surveys don't allow any pictures to be taken. This is just common sense.
2) the fact that many people have mentioned that they are paid in cash to participate in these surveys. I have participated in a couple comsumer surveys and both times I was paid in cash.
And nobody cares whether you beleive this is true or not, so you're better off keeping that to yourself bud
1) why not, the car has already been photographed from top to bottom, and the other cars are already in production. I find it hard to beleive not one person managed to snap shot from their camera phone and not one person OUTSIDE this survey managed to snap a picture from their camera phone while these cars were being tested, yeah right, rather convienient.
2. Bullshiet, no legitimate research firm would keep thousands of dollars of cash on hand. they cut checks. It would be rather convienient they offered cash, huh?
3) I don't care that you think nobody cares. there is just no evidence or facts present that support this supposed survey. One would think, one should know better how easy it is to impersonate events or people on the internet.
As a Jerry Mcquire turned lawyer would say "Show me the evidence!"
"so you're better off keeping that to yourself bud"
and why would I? you gonna beat me up, lol. Your threats belittle you, please...
AS I SAY AGAIN, PROVE IT!
Seriously, what's up with the fan boys here? It's a solid rear axle, which is just not going to work as well as a IRS... what do they expect?
Was the car you drove optioned-out? Or was it a base model? Are we talking leather, auto, etc etc? I think you said Shaker 1000, right?
Thanks for your opinions! It was a good read.
a buddy of mine temped at a marketing company that catered to the big car makers.
camera's are not allowed at these events. for the heck of it, he signed me up for a couple.
Why would he snap a pic with a camera phone? there are pics all over of it anyway. and, i'm sure he thought of whiny jealous people like you.
Man, you're making yourself look like an ass. Several people have confirmed that they've done this survey or one similar to this and were paid to do it. You should really know what your facts about things before you call bs. I know from experience that these tests DO happen. Have you ever done one? I didn't think so. Here's an idea. Why don't you show us evidence that these tests DIDN'T happen since you are so sure it's BS because someone didn't take pics (which is not allowed by rules anyway).
I see your points. But I have heard or being paid for marketing type surveys and such, and maybe Ford wasnt performing this for production reasons, bur marketing/advertising reasons.
Im going to be purchasing a car in the next few months, and my two finalists are the Mustang and the Rx 8. I was looking at the 350z, buts its to impractical for me, and the G35 coupe is a little out of my price range.
About the teal, maybe it was the legend lime?
Who knows it if or not. Who cares really, its not going to affect if anyone here buys one or not. We wouldnt be on this forum if we all didnt love it already.
I am not disputing the fact that they pay for these surveys. I was merely pointing out the torublesome spots in his story. And at this point I don't really care what someone else thinks about the car. He said it handled like his stage one. This means that it is better than what the past car has had. He and I both agree about the 350Z with it's visibility issues. I agree it is not going to affect that many people on this forum. I know it won't make a difference to me one bit.
The study consisted of 8 people, $150 bucks each, total $1200. How is that "thousandS of dollars of cash on hand"? That's nothing, no big deal. Most small businesses have that much hanging out in the petty cash drawer. Alot of people carry that much in their wallet on a regular basis. They do cash in order to maintain anonymity. As said before, car nuts would FLOOD these marketing research companies with harassing phone calls and emails trying to get "on a list" to be part of one of these groups, if they knew who they were and where they were. These companies really don't want anybody to know who they are. A check would have an issuers name on it. So they pay cash, totally non-traceable.
And no, they wouldn't allow cameras. Why? Because why should they? They don't OWE you the opportunity to photodocument their study. You're there to evaluate the cars, not to take a bunch of shots of new Mustangs next to competetive iron, where you could potentially go on the web and post them along with the claim "the new Mustang sucks. I drove it, and here's the proof....and the new Z kicks it's butt"... (that's not what Roushman said, but it could potentially happen). If I were a business contracted by Ford to do a study, I'd keep the cameras out, and Ford probably requires it. It's pure common sense. I guess some people may be rabid shutter-bugs, but I myself wouldn't be foaming at the mouth to take a bunch of pictures, and if it had been me participating in one of these tests, I wouldn't have had the slightest inclination to bother bringing in a camera, or sneaking one in. It's not that big of a deal, just flogging some cars that will be all over the roads in a few months anyways. Interesting information now that we've gotten a full accounting of what at first had the earmarking's of a B.S. thread, but not exactly the second coming of Christ. I personally apologize to Roushman for giving him such a hard time. He just didn't have much credibility right out of the gate, but once he took the time to get to the details, it sounds as if he did what he did and saw what he saw and made an easy 150. Was his objective analysis or chassis dynamics experience on-par with what we might get from Michael Schumacher?? Unfortunately no, but I can wait for the pros at the magazines to give me their opinions, and eventually I'll just test drive the thing myself..
Hey guys, if you look at my thread about spotting an '05 in the same area 02Roush was in, are stories might coincide.
So you honestly think they would go out of their way to buy 5 test cars at about 25 grand a pop, pay these individuals 150 each and only get the opinions of 8 individuals? This kind of test would have to be performed at least 10 times to get any remotely valid statistical and qualatative data.
Three factors are essential for good experimental design:
First, proper controls must be incorporated into each experiment. A control group receives the same treatment as the experimental group except that the factor being tested is applied to the experimental group only, not to the control.
Second, experiments must be repeated enough times to allow comparisons between experimental and control groups. It is through such repetition that data can be compared statistically and a high degree of accuracy obtained.
Third, experiments must be designed to avoid bias. A researcher must strive to prevent personal opinion about a hypothesis from influencing how tests are made and must also be award of the bias that any technique or instrument may introduce in the outcome of an experiment.
I don't mean to **** anyone off, I just find these supposed tests pointless especially when we are so close to seeing them in production. That's why I am asking for any sort of documentation validating this research. Is that so much to ask?
Ford doesn't have to buy the Mustangs (obviously), and it's very common for Ford to have competetive cars already in their ownership already, that they used during R&D for comparison and for benchmarking. John Coletti had Ford buy a couple Ferrari 360 Modena's for benchmarking when developing the GT40. In short, they already OWN the cars before they loan them to the marketing research firm that's doing these tests.
Furthermore, nobody said that the 8-person focus group that Roushguy participated in was the ONLY group they did. They may have been doing this for weeks. Most banks are open 6 days a week (last I checked), and even having $5,000 cash in the hotel safe is no big whoop. Go to Carlisle or Fall Charlotte swap meets and you'll be in the midst of thousand's of people with that much cash or more stuffed in their wallets or their shirt pockets. If you're a mugger, consider that one hell of a good tip....
These tests probably have zero to do with the fine-tuning or last-minute development of the Mustang, and EVERYTHING to do with marketing planning. Seeing how people are reacting to different cars in that price range, seeing if there's a relationship between the age/sex/height/etc and the way they rate the cars. An exercise to measure the Mustangs product and price appeal compared to other competitors. It's probably a test that was ordering by J. Walter Thompson (Ford's ad agency) to help them develop long range marketing projects and to know which cars they really need to target in their marketing to attempt to grab cross-over customers from those cars.
How pointless this all may be is your prerogative. Demanding some type of "proof" is a bit unreasonable, as it's not like he's going to have a "receipt", and not everybody takes a camera everywhere they go. I don't, car pictures are boring as hell after the 1st viewing, and all the car photos I've taken in my life ever do is get looked at once and then crammed into shoeboxes to forever clutter my closets. I think once we got more of the story, and the details, and another guy on this forum having a sighting in the same area and time (probably a different focus group continuing the same study), it's good enough for me. The info isn't much to sink your teeth into, but it's better than bench racing or trying to speculate what the first special edition will be..... which is all we seem to ever have going on here.
digging the hole deeper, huh?
I've been watching this post since it's inception. I'm inclined to believe the story. I'm also envious. GOOD FOR YOU!
I just got my fastback from paint, wheels & tires, so I'm going to hang on to it for another year or 2. Plenty of time for the stangs to come out drop in price (INCENTIVES or just less demand) and maybe even the release of a boss 302, Mach1 or some other SE.
Good god folks...
... I'm a guy. I don't know the difference between teal, lime green, aqua, and navy. If you do, hand in your official guy membership card.
Getting paid $150 for participating in a 3 hour focus group is not unusual. I work in IT and have participated in a few in and out of my field and compensated similarly.
Given the questioning this guy was given (comparing it to similar cars and how they were priced) I will bet you they are trying to finalize the price of the car. Think about this, if they release the GT at last years price (+3-4 % would be what? 23-24g?) and they could have sold an equal or similar number for 30K, then they are leaving 6-7 grand on the table per car. Lets see... spend a 10 grand on a marketing study or leave $700,000 on the table. What would you choose?
Frankly I hope the guy told ford that the GT was **** compared to the o ther cars and they were out of the GT's league. That way ford wont think they can price the car at the price those others are going for.
You may be right about researching the price. In actuality, they probably had a laundry list of "questions" they wanted to get answers to by doing this study. But price & marketing pretty much go hand-in-hand...
Since you are able to name those colors: teal, lime green aqua & navy, you are the one who should be turning in your "official guy membership card.