Because every LS1 starts off streetable.... 347s are not commonly produced
That is a strong point.
The 575 hp AFR article is about a 347 that uses the Ford AFR205... The combo you show is a chevy guy with AFR205 heads... Very similar numbers. What's streetability? usually that's determined only by cam and tune
I am assuming that is on an engine dyno with no accessory loss or transmission loss. However, I am sure it puts out good power in a streetable package.
I am sure you realize the AFR "Mongoose" 205's are not the same as the AFR SBF 205's.
Yeah, my thoughts on streetability basically are accessories driven by the crank (that I enjoy), camshaft (vac., powerband), and tune helps for sure.
Carbs don't inflate numbers. They just don't run out of airflow like smaller long-runner efi intakes do at higher rpm. There's not much point to try run a long-runner to 7000+ rpm. It won't make power there. Put a Vic Jr, TFS R, Systemax II, or Supervictor on there and you'll see the exact same thing you do with carbs... less low end and more high end. Carbs do not offer a hp advantage over the properly sized fuel injected intake. That's an entirely different argument, however.
What I said came out incorrectly. I have seen a few test where a carbed car will have a higher dyno number at peak, as compared to a fuel injected car. Your right, that is a whole 'nother argument. Something, I have not looked into much at all.
I'm sorry, the AFR tests offer the only objective evidence I can provide. I don't see too many tests that are as thorough as the one shown by your chevy guy.
You are correct, his test is pretty extensive. I have also seen a share of the ls6 346's dynoing 520 rwhp in nice streetable packages. I just have not seen those without revving to 8k on a 347. Just a personal observation, not fact
You're right, to an extent. The old factory pushrod ford has nothing on the newer technology employed in the LS1.
But lets face it, there's nothing too technologically complex about an engine. You have a cylinder enclosed on both ends by a piston and a combustion chamber with 2 valves. All of the new after market products have similar chevy and ford versions. When you strip away the top-end of the engine it eliminates the performance advantage. Now all you're doing in both camps is putting on aftermarket parts that are nearly identical. I think you generally see combos making more power in the LS1 camp only because billy-bob and his brother can afford to put together a 347 combo with stock 351 heads. That combo just ain't gonna turn the numbers that big spenders will turn with better components.
4 stroke, 2 valve engines are fairly simple for a basic understanding as you stated.
I am sure you realize that I am not comparing "billy-bob" to "the donald," because that would not be fair
I try to compare apples to apples, whether "red delicious" or "granny apple green"...they are still both an apple.
Spare me the time it would take to go back and disect your list of LS1 advantages. Go back and look at them and consider what is still an advantage when you give the SBF all aftermarket top-end components with a cam.
And for what it's worth, I personally don't buy the concept that square stroke vs. bore is better for performance. I'd rather build a 4.125" bore 347 stroker than a 4.030" bore 347 stroker. The latter may make more torque, but I bet I'd get more average power out of mine. Would probably be able to rev my motor higher, too - consider piston speed. What are you left with in terms of LS1 advantages?
I don't see any. And, FWIW, I hope it doesn't seem like I'm coming down on you. I really enjoy our discussions. I've learned quite a bit about the LS1s from you in this thread, and I already own one! ('97 C5 vette)
Chris
Actually, if you look back, I never said the square engine would make more power. I just stated it was more square. The taller deck helps it out in getting the longer .22" of stroke.
Yeah, I like the big bore idea in an N/A engine. They make a bit more power, a little higher up.
I actually forgot you own the '97
I am not taking anything personal. You are very level headed and love to learn and teach as I see. I could learn a few things from you...
