Engine Block machine work - whats the minimum to have done?

[66 4D 289]

So if one was to go to the trouble of a complete tear down of the engine for a rebuild, as far as machine work to the block is concerned, what would be the things you would do over others. Assuming the car will never see strip/track time and will be an occasional weekend cruiser...weather permitting..... is there anything from the list below that isn't really necessary when it comes to having a full rebuild done?


Pressure/crack tested
acid dipped/hot tanked? (needs a good clean...looks really nasty )
Bores cleaned/honed for new pistons(forged) – bore .030 over or leave standard?
Align hone or align bore block/main caps for new bearings
Decks checked for squareness – mill if needed.
Crank polished
Con rods hardened - arp rod bolts added
New cam bearings
Balance bottom end to compensate for lighter pistons – crank shaft, rods and flex plate?


Is there anything that should be on the list that isn't? Just looking for some feed back from those that have gone down this path...which is probably many of you The list was kinda compiled after reading a few SBF engine rebuilding books. Kind of a newbie to this and don't really want to miss anything out that should be done. I'd rather not spend the money on a procedure if it isn't really necessary either. Engine is a 289 in case you're wondering

Thanks.

 

[zookeeper]

You about covered it, but then again I personally think THE most important factor is to find the right machine shop. My local shop (the only one) has burned me one too many times, so my car got a crate motor this time around. Be very careful when talking to a prospective machinist and make very sure they know your goals and budget.

 

[truck90278]

Based on your anticipated useage of the vehicle and your statement of "minimum:

Probably could do without align boring the main caps.

Hot tank the block, clean out all passages, new cam bearings are required

More than likely, your cylinder wall taper will require going oversize on the bore, therefore, boring and honing is required.

For street use, forged pistons are not necessary

Balancing is good for a nice smooth running engine and engine longevity

Polishing crank - most reground cranks (with matching bearings) will come polished) nice to do if not done.

Con Rods - have shot peened for stress relief (not hardened) and rebuilt - assures bore is round on both ends and there is no twist to the rod. Installation of good rod bolts is good

Decking the block may be needed if there is warpage in the block deck surface - doesn't hurt to do however.

It really comes down to how nice you want it and HOW MUCH MONEY you want to spend. If your plans include performance driving (racing or playing) the more you do, the more dependable it will be.

I built the engine in my '64 chevy truck 11 years ago, used cast pistons, ground and polished crand (.010 under) , .030 overbore, balanced, no decking. It has been going strong for all 11 years, never a problem. Kept compression reasonable with mild cam.

My daughters mustang engine was built 20 years ago and recently required new rings Barings, gaskets and seals due to leaks. When engine was rebuilt, bored .030, balanced, decked, polished crank etc. Never a problem except eventually had leaks.

 

[woodsnake]

A big cost in machine work is HEADS.
Shop around, you can get new parts now for the cost of refurbishing old ones!

Also, and I can't stress this enough, talk to as many people as you can about machine shops. FInd a good one, get your plan in WRITING!

I had a HUGE learning curve when I built my 289. Partly my fault? You bet. Mostly his? As far as I'm concerned, YUP.

You don't break roller rockers because of "bad gas". Coil bind, not fuel breaks parts.

So, talk to as many folks as you can FIRST, have a plan, and a budget.

 

[66 4D 289]

Thanks for the replies guys. Much appreciated.
I guess a lot of it depends on the condition of the block and what kind of life it's had. I'm kinda going into this assuming the P.O's haven't done anything to the engine aside from an oil and filter change
I think I'm limited to who I can use in my town for a machine shop as there aint that many, but the main one has been around for quite some time and they seem to have a pretty good reputation. A lot of the speedway fraternity use them and they've got some pretty high horse power engines that take a bit of abuse.
I've been doing plenty of reading and research about what to do, what parts to use and what combos will work well.
I'm planning to get it all on paper and then take it too them and have them price it out for me and ask them as many questions as I can in the process about what's needed and what's not. You dont know unless you ask right

The crate motor idea was on my list for a while but I kinda filled my pants when I saw some of the prices Besides I think I'd get a bit of a kick having a go at rebuilding it myself.

 

[JonK]

To balance the rotating assembly (pistons/rods/crank/flexplate) you'll need the harmonic balancer also, if you're not reusing the original get the new one to be balanced with the assembly (most are ~$60).
Once they check your block you'll know what size pistons you need to go with. I sat down with my builder and discussed what I expected out of the engine and my planned use. I had him order all of the parts, that way if he got the wrong size anything he had to reorder and he never was waiting on me to supply parts.
You should replace the cam, there are plenty out there that will give you better gas mileage and a little more HP to boot.
Jon

 

[66 4D 289]

You should replace the cam, there are plenty out there that will give you better gas mileage and a little more HP to boot.
Jon

Thats kinda where it started with a cam, carb and intake change but now it's ballooned into a full rebuild

I was gonna go ahead and just get the .030 over sized pistons anyway as they're the same price as the stock size. I guess thats off set though by having to bore out the cylinders. Is it worth waiting til is torn down before I get the pistons or just go ahead and order them?

Cheers

 

[zookeeper]

If a crate motor seems expensive, you're shopping for the wrong motor. Mine was $2695 to the door and featured all new, all brand-name parts, such as Comp Cams complete cam, lifters, springs, pushrods and Magnum rockers, KB pistons, high-volume Melling pump, Clevite bearings, Fel-Pro gaskets, a new Edelbrock intake and mildly worked 351W heads with new valves and guideplates, is balanced, and came with a 12-month warrantee. I priced the parts indivudually and without machine work the price was over $3K, so I don't know how they do it, but it makes great power, sounds good and doesn't leak a drop. PM me if you want their number, you won't be sorry.

 

[JonK]

I spent $2600 for parts/labor/machine work to have my motor stroked from 289 to 333 so that's new everything also and they assembled it, degreed the cam, set timing and valves, port matched the intake to heads, etc., ready to drop in.
Not cheap but I wanted to use my original block and if you're reusing your rotating assembly short of pistons/rings should be ~$1500 for a motor you can trust.

I would wait until they machine the block to find out what size pistons to order just in case, it only takes 2 days to get most things delivered from Summit, etc. and as mentioned above Forged is overkill for what you will be doing with the car unless you just really want them (there not a lot more $ but it sounds like you're doing a budget build).
Jon

 

[66 4D 289]

I spent $2600 for parts/labor/machine work to have my motor stroked from 289 to 333 so that's new everything also and they assembled it, degreed the cam, set timing and valves, port matched the intake to heads, etc., ready to drop in. Not cheap but I wanted to use my original block and if you're reusing your rotating assembly short of pistons/rings should be ~$1500 for a motor you can trust.

I would wait until they machine the block to find out what size pistons to order just in case, it only takes 2 days to get most things delivered from Summit, etc. and as mentioned above Forged is overkill for what you will be doing with the car unless you just really want them (there not a lot more $ but it sounds like you're doing a budget build).
Jon

Yeah It can get up there. I added up my parts list last night and it came pretty close to that price and that was without the machine work to the block or the heads. I'm planning on converting to roller rockers and getting rid of the rail style as I wanted to upgrade from the stock cam. If I'm going to all the trouble and cost is it worth getting a more aggressive cam than the Comp cams high energy 268H? Would I be better getting the xtreme energy one with a higher lift? Any recommendations appreciated. Not looking for to aggressive. Something suitable for the occasional weekend warrior/ mainly cruiser
The info Zookeeper PM'ed was pretty helpful and is definately worth considering. I'll be looking into that some more. I guess though once you get the remaining components to make the engine a runner to cost does get up a little but who says you have to buy those parts new. Would save a lot of work though

Thanks again for the help and info. Much appreciated

 

[JonK]

I went with the CC XE262 cam for my stroker as it'll see 90% DD and I didn't want to go too aggresive and the XE268 is where the cams begin to go over .500 lift and gets more lopey, less vac, etc. I listened to a friends 268 first and felt it was too lopey for me. I am installing power brakes and A/C so the lower vacuum was an issue for me. I downloaded CompCams FREE program CamQuest and played with the variables to see which cams were suggested then discussed them with my builder.

I also installed roller rockers, picked up most of my parts as I found them for a good price either on Craigslist, fleabay or corral.net parts section. I probably picked up half of my parts new or slightly used over the past year as I came across them.
Jon

 

[oz]

For what's it's worth, I bought my .030" over SpeedPro hyperutectic (sp) pistons with coated skirts - complete with rings on ebay for about $100. I got a set of rebuilt, shot peened rods from PAW. Not too expensive and plenty strong for a 'warmed over' 289.