Engine rebuild costs???

[1FatPony]

I was wondering how much a full engine rebuild would cost?? both if I did it myself or had someone else do it? For those of you who have rebuilt an engine themselves how much work is involved?? Are there any special tools you need? How long does it take? And I am talking about a stock 289 for a 65 coupe.
Thanks

 

[StephenMarsh]

At the risk of sounding crass - If you're asking those type of questions about what's involved and if you plan to drive this car - have a professional machine shop rebuild your engine. It's not brain surgery, but it's a complex series of very specific steps that must be done in the correct sequence and with a high level of skill, experience and specilized tools and machines. Any one of those things is lacking and you'll get none of the performance that the engine is capable of, if it'll even start at all.

That said - I'll relay my current experience- I just had a short block 289 done (virgin block run 30 over with a roller conversion, flat top's and forged just about everything and it ran $700 + 800 for the roller cam/lifter /rocker set-up

I spent another $1200 on the top of the engine ($700 on rebuilt, ported heads and $500 on the induction) though assuming it's a driver - you'd probably want to just swap out the existing induction and get a valve job and re-use the heads so you're cost there would be more like $300+ depending on how bad the heads are and how deep you get with the valve job.

Then you've got to get the thing in, and it's a good time to have a cherry picker, a close rental shop or about 19 friends. It's also the best time to replace worn wiring and just about everything rubber under the hood- more cash.

In general , all things 2 BBL are a little cheaper than all thing 4 BBL and up as parts go and the options for upgrading parts along the way will blow your mind - more cash

If it's a new thing -I recommend asking machine shop after machine shop until you find someone that builds the type of engine you want at the right cost. Don't have a hot rod shot build you a 2bbl granny banger - they don't have the passion for it- by the same token - if you go to a speed shop-listne to what they have to say. In the same way that engine assembly is a a science of all things fitting together in harmony, once you fire the sucker - all the parts of an engine must work together in just the right way as well and be chosen accordingly.

Hope some of that helps - what I've learned over th years- it's fun to do it yourself-but it's WAY MORE fun to do it RIGHT when it's an option --Steph

 

[allcarfan]

you actually "building" the engine is only going to save you a few hundred dollars...possibly 3 or 4.

You will need to have the engine pulled, disassembled, probably bored and honed. This will cost somewhere in the realm of $600+. Then you may need your heads rebuilt...$200. Intake....$150. Crank turned probably...$50. new rods, and pistons more than likely....$300. Bearings and rings...$200. Gaskets....$200. Freeze plugs...$20. Misc nuts and bolts to replace rusted ones...$25. Timing chain...$50. Assembly...$250-$500

Thats off the top of my head.

 

[StephenMarsh]

New Short Block Pics

Just got the Short block back today, couple pics-Steph

 

[A67StangMaster]

Thats one clean engine what did you have done to it
Stephen?

 

[D.Hearne]

I was wondering how much a full engine rebuild would cost?? both if I did it myself or had someone else do it? For those of you who have rebuilt an engine themselves how much work is involved?? Are there any special tools you need? How long does it take? And I am talking about a stock 289 for a 65 coupe.
Thanks

That's a 64 million dollar question you've asked. It can range from as little as $500 to whatever your wallet can stand. Depends on what you want it to do afterwards and what it needs now ( how much wear & tear it's got now) I rebuilt ( or rather overhauled) the 390 in my 68 Merc for about $500 three years ago. But it needed only two pistons (bores were fine with only 60,000 miles on it), new rings, bearings & gaskets. I upgraded to these parts; A Ford 428PI aluminum intake, new Crane Energizer cam and lifters, new rocker spacers to replace the springs on the rocker shafts, a 428CJ windage tray, and FPA headers and a new Holley 750 cfm carb. There's a good bit of work involved pulling and rebuilding one, but it's not rocket science. You DO have to follow certain rules in reassembling an engine for it to run, but again, it ain't rocket science and it's certainly NOT complicated. There's nothing complicated about a pushrod V8, they're really simple pieces of machinery, once you understand how they're put together and operate.It doesn't take a high level of expertise to build one. Get a couple of engine rebuild manuals, read them thoroughly, study them, cover to cover. Ask questions, lots of questions. There are no dumb questions, but there are lots of dumb answers out there. If you've got a friend thats done it before, make him your BEST friend. As for special tools, there are a few: first one comes to mind is a harmonic balancer puller. Next is a good torque wrench & a ring compresser. A good engine hoist(crane type) and stand also makes things easier. I'm probably missing something here, but I'm sure someone else will chime in with their .02 cents

 

[D.Hearne]

At the risk of sounding crass - If you're asking those type of questions about what's involved and if you plan to drive this car - have a professional machine shop rebuild your engine. It's not brain surgery, but it's a complex series of very specific steps that must be done in the correct sequence and with a high level of skill, experience and specilized tools and machines. Any one of those things is lacking and you'll get none of the performance that the engine is capable of, if it'll even start at all.

though assuming it's a driver - you'd probably want to just swap out the existing induction and get a valve job and re-use the heads so you're cost there would be more like $300+ depending on how bad the heads are and how deep you get with the valve job.

In general , all things 2 BBL are a little cheaper than all thing 4 BBL and up as parts go and the options for upgrading parts along the way will blow your mind - more cash

If it's a new thing -I recommend asking machine shop after machine shop until you find someone that builds the type of engine you want at the right cost. Don't have a hot rod shot build you a 2bbl granny banger - they don't have the passion for it- by the same token - if you go to a speed shop-listne to what they have to say. In the same way that engine assembly is a a science of all things fitting together in harmony, once you fire the sucker - all the parts of an engine must work together in just the right way as well and be chosen accordingly.

Hope some of that helps - what I've learned over th years- it's fun to do it yourself-but it's WAY MORE fun to do it RIGHT when it's an option --Steph

To borrow your own quote: At the risk of sounding crass.....................I think you've overly complicated things here. Like a bureaucrat. If everyone took your advice, no one would attempt to undertake what many of us have done, thousands of times, most sucessfully, but many not(but that's how many of us learned), in doing our own rebuilds. It's not that complicated and it doesn't take highly trained, specialized techs to do it. Yea, you want a good machinist to do the machine work, but even his work isn't rocket science, just takes patience and attention to detail.

 

[StephenMarsh]

Thats one clean engine what did you have done to it
Stephen?

Thanks - this is the engine I described eariler in the post - I didn't build it - what I know about it:

C5AE-6015E (7B27 casting, car was bought march 17, 67 - not a bad match!) block, fluxed, inspected decked and bored 20 over (intended to go 30 - didn't need it) - engine, crank and caps were great (pure luck, I bought the long block assembly for $50)
crank turned, Silv-o-lite Hypereutectic flat top pistons with moly rings, rods adjusted accordingly
H-vol oil pump with moly drive shaft, ford racing windage tray
Comp roller cam, comp roller lifters, comp magnum roller rockers, comp pushrods, comp dual spings, basically all comp valve train
World windsor jr. 180 heads, ported, cleaned and surfaced
4 BBL ford intake, date correct, AUTOLITE 4100 1.08 venturi, date correct w/ custom (pony carbs) choke

new everything that bolts on pretty much, brackets, pulleys, belts, fittings, hoses, timing chain cover, all AMK factory kits style bolt kits used except ARP forged internals
Finished long block and top of engine will be K code black with chrome VC and hi po air cleaner w/ K & N element
2 1/4" aluminized exhaust, hi-po headers, h-pipe
The rest of the driveline (currently being pushed by my 2 bbl beater 289)

Rebuilt C-4 and rebuilt 8" 3.25 4 spider traction lok rear

As to the rest of the car - I wanted to go for a mostly stock look and a GTA replica as the theme.

Interior has been fully restored with all black on black comfortweave buckets and rear, carpet, lower center console, dash and trim, dask clock, factory A/C, 140 GT speedo, all new or re-done chrome, door panels seat backs, everything

Every seal and plug on the body has been replaced for the most part as has all the exterior chrome and trim, badges, light bezels, fixtures and such (i'm pretty anal)

Also re-did the complete brake system, cooling system and the wiring harness (with the exception of the under-dash harness and A/C wiring), new washer system

Basically a whole new car - it will look like a GTA with a k-code 289 (to the layman at least - no flames please) but should actually be throwing down more to the rear wheels

I'm looking forward to getting this thing in (next Friday!!) - Have had about 90% of the engine sitting in my spare bedroom for almost a year now.

Will post more pictures when it's in--Steph

 

[StephenMarsh]

To borrow your own quote: At the risk of sounding crass.....................I think you've overly complicated things here. Like a bureaucrat. If everyone took your advice, no one would attempt to undertake what many of us have done, thousands of times, most sucessfully, but many not(but that's how many of us learned), in doing our own rebuilds. It's not that complicated and it doesn't take highly trained, specialized techs to do it. Yea, you want a good machinist to do the machine work, but even his work isn't rocket science, just takes patience and attention to detail.

You have a valid point, to each their own, but you have a valid point

 

[bnickel]

i rebuilt my first engine when i was 16, i did have a mechanic friend of my dad's oversee the process just to make sure i did everything right. my advice is to pay very close attention to detail. buy a good torque wrench and thread chaser tap set. and buy the best quality parts you can afford. for instance, on a stock rebuild cast pistons will be fine but i would suggest upgrading to hypereutectic as they are not that much than cast pistons. for a stock street engine DO NOT get a high volume oil pump all it will really do is cost you hp and fuel economy and possibly empty your oil pan faster than the oil can drain back into the pan. DO get a HD oil pump driveshaft. invest in a good engine rebuild manual specific to the style of engine you are building, fo small block ford i'd use the "How To Rebuild Your Small Block Ford" by Tom Monroe. I would also ask around to see what machine shop in your area has the best reputation, even if it is one that specializes in high performance engines. again use the best quality parts and machine work you can afford.

a good stock rebuild that you assemble yourself with new pistons, rings, bearings and gasket set and a stock valve job on the heads will generally run anywhere from $500-$600 to about $800-$1,000. if you have the machine shop assemble it for you add another $250-$500. keep in mind this is for an otherwise stock rebuild. if you start adding high performance parts like cam and lifters, 3 or 5 angle valve jobs, higher compression pistons, etc. etc. the price will go up accordingly.

my current engine was a basic overhaul. i had the block vatted, the crank turned, the pistons resized and new stock rod bolts added, had the block honed (didn't need bored, the worst cylinder only had 4 thousandths of wear), had new cam bearings and freeze plugs installed. i bought a fel-pro engine overhaul gasket set and had the heads re-done with a 3 angle valve job and i also added a speed pro cam and lifters and new stock replacement valve springs. i spent about $600 total on all of that and then spent about 3 times that for all the extra stuff i wanted as well. hedman shorty headers, road demon 625 carb, new water pump, new alternator, starter, starter solenoid, starter cables, voltage regulator, rebuilt radiator. added a new power steering pump, correct air cleaner assembly and hi-po lid, stripped and repainted the engine compartment. all new hoses and belts,chrome thermostat housing, chrome radiator cap, new master cylinder and chrome master cylinder cap, chrome dipstick, new engine feed wiring harness, new engine compartment decal kit, all new ac hoses, new reciever/dryer, new ac expansion valve, new heater control valve, new correct stock style hose clamps. mallory unilite converion kit and had distributor recurved at the local speed shop. new cap, rotor, plugs and acell super stock plug wires (black) and new power steering hoses. new battery, new battery heat shield, new export brace, new fender bolts, an original over the counter ford (shelby) aluminum intake and a quite a bit of other stuff as well.

so keep in mind all the little stuff adds up. i didn't have to replace everything that i did but i wanted everything to work right and i wanted it all to look as fresh as the engine itself. you can see the mostly finished but very dusty result here http://www.1969stang.com/gallery/bnickel69gt/my_car_engine_3?full=1 is also still have to buy a new main underhood wiring harness because it does actually need that and a few other little things. i also still need to install the remainder of the ac stuff, the shelby intake and i need a motorcraft battery topper/cover and a whole bunch of other stuff i have in the garage as well.

 

[mustangdave]

Wow, I think these quotes are really low. I was quoted $900 for machine work alone on a block to be hot tanked, align-honed, and bored .030 over with a cheapo rebuild on the heads (knurling instead of new bronze valve guides, just replacing what had to be replaced). This also included deck squaring.

 

[bnickel]

Wow, I think these quotes are really low. I was quoted $900 for machine work alone on a block to be hot tanked, align-honed, and bored .030 over with a cheapo rebuild on the heads (knurling instead of new bronze valve guides, just replacing what had to be replaced). This also included deck squaring.

that's because of the line hone and decking. those both require quite a bit of time to set up and perform the actual machining process. neither of those is absolutely necessary on a stock rebuild unless you change main bearing caps and have a warped deck. i would consider both of those pretty common on a performance build though.