Finally, here's my combo... guess my RWHP and track times (Results now posted)

5spd GT- I knew you'd like the results as soon as I posted them. :D I hope to swap the TB to a 75mm or larger one and see what happens. I can't help but to think that it'll pick up a decent amount. My vacuum at WOT goes from -0.08psi at 2000rpms to over -1.1psi at 6000rpms, and I'm measuring this vacuum directly behind the TB. I saw in the corral thread I linked to above that a guy picked up nearly 12rwhp switching from a 70mm to a 75mm TB on his 347 stroker. As for tricks, none were done that I am aware of other than internally balancing the rotating assembly. It took nearly two slugs of mallory to do it, but I think when building an engine of this type it needs to be done. I also upgraded the rod bolts to ARP2000 units. I'm wondering if my oil pump is actually costing me any power as I see over 50psi at idle and nearly 75lbs in the upper RPM's! I too am now wondering what a cam designed for this application would do. Hmmm....

Oh Yeah, I loved the results:nice:

With boost that thing is going to skoot...you need to be able to take out those KB and Whipple'd 4V's:D , in which a 302 stroker is going to be hard to do and keep it a true street car. I think boost is the right direction, since you have the block and internals to handle it! I know you will get the good headgasket and tune with it all.

The oil pump could be causing a little power loss, as you know:) Atleast you can say you have good pump pressure...

Yeah I remember Rick telling me that 331's and 347 dyno very similar.

I'd like a link to that TB thread, I didn't see it. You very well could gain something with the stroked combination you have and the power you make. Yeah, I have stated that if a real gain (back to back testing) is going to be shown on a throttle body, it will be in the topend of the spectrum:nice: Your vacuum numbers point to some restriction. I guess you will find out if it is the TB or not:nice: Are you still running the throttle body adapter that comes on the 94/95 (fox swap gets rid of it). If I recall, RedSnk? with his 347 found that to be the restriction more so that the throttle body. He couldn't get it to flow pas 525cfm or something like that.

I'd like the track comparison, I run 10.56 at 99.31 mph (8.27 @ 87.31 mph in the 1/8th) in my car at a 'red-neck' track. You seem to pick up nicely in the top-end!

Grn - I predict 380rwhp - You ran 108 mph right with the 304? rwhp, and now you ran 115mph, so add 70-80. Get to a dyno.
 
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Congradulations Paul! those are some really excellent numbers for that combo. i know i'm too late to guess, and i don't know much about how power numbers relate to track times, but as i was reading through, i was thinking like 350hp and slightly less torque at 340. needless to say i'm impressed with what came out of it.
 
Grn - I predict 380rwhp - You ran 108 mph right with the 304? rwhp, and now you ran 115mph, so add 70-80. Get to a dyno.

The 115 was not fully tuned, wrong gears and shifting a few hundred rpm too low. I was crossing the traps appx 1,000 rpm's too low! :notnice: Maybe one day i'll dyno, but I really don't care about numbers. I'm more of a cruiser which is why I haven't been back to the track in 2 years. Only thing the car needs is a 3" mid pipe but i'm done with spending money on it.
 
I'm sure there will be some debates about TB sizes after this thread. I absolutely believe that it is a restriction at this point, and I truly hope to get back on the dyno with a fox TB conversion to see once and for all if there is truth to all of the hype.
i believe it is probably a restriction for you too where you are now. what i was trying to say was that i think your case indicates that a 65mm throttle body may not necessarily be the main problem for other people who also have 331s that make closer to 330 at the wheels.

again, awesome results!
 
i believe it is probably a restriction for you too where you are now. what i was trying to say was that i think your case indicates that a 65mm throttle body may not necessarily be the main problem for other people who also have 331s that make closer to 330 at the wheels.

again, awesome results!

I agree 110%.

It is often blamed by a couple on here, well just one really, hehe, that a throttle body is to blame for low power in really any combination given.

I like your spin on the deal, it can help but isn't a big deal really, once you have stepped in the aftermarket world:nice:

Now I want a 331 to see what can be had with a 5.4L:bang:
 
The 115 was not fully tuned, wrong gears and shifting a few hundred rpm too low. I was crossing the traps appx 1,000 rpm's too low! :notnice: Maybe one day i'll dyno, but I really don't care about numbers. I'm more of a cruiser which is why I haven't been back to the track in 2 years. Only thing the car needs is a 3" mid pipe but i'm done with spending money on it.

The gears do no matter on the dyno. I'm sure your TW combination wasn't being shifted 100% correctly either with 3.73's.

Your track is quite far away is it not? Seems like that would be the main concern.
 
Paul

I extrapolated numerical values from the 36 degree chart :)

Having said that ... I could be off 1 or 2 points here and there :shrug:

Never the less ... here are the two combos side by side :D

Grady

pr302_331.jpg
 
Paul how is your car in terms of being a every day driver? Could you "handle" it if u didnt have the spider, freestyle, or focus to drive around daily? The reason i ask is cause of the fairly recent threads about anything above 1rwhp/cubic inch is not streetable N/A.......

Regardless....thats some great results man! Glad to see the success u're having :nice:
 
Paul how is your car in terms of being a every day driver? Could you "handle" it if u didnt have the spider, freestyle, or focus to drive around daily? The reason i ask is cause of the fairly recent threads about anything above 1rwhp/cubic inch is not streetable N/A.......

Regardless....thats some great results man! Glad to see the success u're having :nice:

Streetable is in the eye of the beholder.

It isn't that there is a limit of no more than 1rwhp per cube, but the further it gets from that, the further you get to a general streetability. I think you can get 1.1-1.2 with out to much issue:nice: Just like killercanary's.
 
Yea i know it varies from person to person, but i also think a good judgement is being forced to drive the car every day as compared to having a main "every day" car.

I agree:nice:

I used to deal with my car for a while, and was very picky on streetability. Suddenly, when I got me another car, streetability took a big dive in my book for what I can tolerate, because I do not HAVE to drive it everyday. So I always try to keep that in mind when someone has a fox or sn-95 as a one and only daily driver. I have always told people, there is a difference between a daily driver and a street car. A big difference at that:)
 
gcomfx.com- What makes you want an evac system? I know they have their benefits, but are you doing it for power production or do you already have a blow by issue? Keep us posted on your results! If you launch that car on the spray and sticky tires, I bet you can get your 60's into the 1.6 range if not better.

94-302-vert- Me too, especially seeing how much my old combo picked up with extensive track testing. I'm still surprised that its gone as fast as it has with only two trips to the track.

Grn92LX- I wish I knew how much 1psi of vacuum was worth in terms of power production. I really think I'm going to make the move to a larger fox TB. My buddy is having a dyno day at the end of October and I'd like to have it done by then. If I can't, my cousin said I can run his 75mm 94-95 TB setup from his KB car on mine to see if it makes a difference. That yellow car on the corral is trapping over 120, he is actually one of the two that I had found. Take a look at the 94-95 1/4 mile times list in the sticky at the top of the 94-95 tech section at the times and MPH from the strokers listed there, that is very much the norm from what i found, and I looked around for MONTHS! As for gear ratio, I know you'd pick up MPH with the right gear. I got lucky in that I didn't change my gears and I'm now trapping a higher MPH. If my powerband hadn't shifted up like it did I may very well have been overgeared. I cross at ~6150 on my nittos DR's and a little over 6000rpms with my ET streets on which is just about perfect for 1/4 mile blast.

5spd GT- I can't imagine this thing with some boost. As for the head gaskets, I've already got that covered. Here's a pic I wasn't able to show before because I didn't want to give the compression away:
77336.jpg

These are Fel Pro MLS gaskets. I'm not actually running them yet as I'm saving them until I get the final heads that will be on the car when the boost hits its. I'm running Fel pro 1011-2(?) on the car now. Here's a link to the thread that had the TB info, look at post #25:
http://www.corral.net/forums/showthread.php?t=840509
I am still running the 94-95 TB setup, inlet and all. I too have heard all the reports about the elbow being the biggest restriction and that's the only reason I want to switch to the fox setup. Switching to the fox setup means I'll need to fabricate a new inlet for it when I put the power adder on, but I don't think that will be too hard.

ProKiller- Thanks man!

BlackVert- I agree, a TB isn't the only problem with their setups if they are down as much as some of them are.

Grady- Thanks so much for that comparison! WOW is all I can say, that's appears a lot better than I had ever hoped it'd be... it makes me think there is more in it at the track now though! :) I really thought the graphs would be kind of opposite than it is, meaning I thought the bottom end would be huge and the top end would be more in line with one another as I thought for sure the thing would be choked up top with all of the little parts I put on it.

Nate, this thing is absolutely without a doubt streetable. The only thing right now that I don't like is my gas mileage, but that is something I can control with more tuning via the AEM. If I had to daily drive it I would, but it is kind of on the loud side which would get old after a while. The car doesn't overheat (which I was worried about with the dart block), and as I showed Troy (yeahloh95) this weekend I can put the car into 5th gear at like 35mph and punch it and it doesn't hick-up, jerk, buck or anything of the sort. It just starts to go. I lugged it all the way down to 1100rpms and punched the throttle in 5th and it just starts to go... not very fast mind you, but it does start to accelerate with no quirks. I'm going to try to get video of this as most cars with a cam jerk and buck. I don't believe the whole >1rwhp/ci isn't streetable deal, my car has shown me time and again that its simply not true with the right parts.
 
An evac system is to help keep the oil IN the engine. Any extra HP benefits would just be that.... extra benefits. My builder changed the rings at the last minute because he knew I would be spraying the car. I had a reputation for going through a LOT of nitrous in my area. :D I really wish he hadn't changed it though. My goal was to not use the bottle as much.

It looks like I may try the CHEAP method first with the ones that hook into the exhaust. I'm trying to find someone that hooked it up to the H-pipe though. I'm not going to weld any bungs on my ceramic coated headers.

The back up plan is the expensive electric route. I just spent the time to remove my old smog pump, not to keen on the idea of putting another one on the car.

Oh and as far as my 60ft. My hopes aren't in that range, but I should have sub-frames, upper control arms, and adjustable lower control arms on the car within a week or so.
 
5spd GT- I can't imagine this thing with some boost. As for the head gaskets, I've already got that covered. Here's a pic I wasn't able to show before because I didn't want to give the compression away:
77336.jpg

These are Fel Pro MLS gaskets. I'm not actually running them yet as I'm saving them until I get the final heads that will be on the car when the boost hits its. I'm running Fel pro 1011-2(?) on the car now. Here's a link to the thread that had the TB info, look at post #25:
http://www.corral.net/forums/showthread.php?t=840509
I am still running the 94-95 TB setup, inlet and all. I too have heard all the reports about the elbow being the biggest restriction and that's the only reason I want to switch to the fox setup. Switching to the fox setup means I'll need to fabricate a new inlet for it when I put the power adder on, but I don't think that will be too hard.

Yeah, I knew you understood that with proper parts and sealing (gaskets/surface/studs) and a good tune, a supercharger shouldn't have the problems that some allude to:nice: And you will be faster than them, at that.

A good old multi-layer steel gasket. There is a reason why those gaskets are getting more and more popular:) Improved sealing when the head lifts, almost like a spring. Especially with more compressed air in the cylinder, that was a good choice, besides the price tag. You always get top-notch stuff with good research behind it. Are those the 4.200"/.041" compressed gasket?

Those pistons have got some nice dish in them, reminds me of a bowl of cereal:)

Oh, and thanks for the link! - I didn't see any follow-up from him, so I don't know if it was back-to-back swap, which I doubt it. Engines free up a bit of horsepower after a couple thousand miles in which his engine was pretty new at the point when he did that testing, just from what I gather from looking at his old post. I know mine did. I'm sure you have seen me post it, but the Holley Systemax, just a little inside the intake opening of 75mm, necks down to near 65mm. I think, gains on the sn-95's are seen by getting rid of the throttle body elbow and porting away the area inside the intake, not just the intake opening. A 75mm throttle body seems to be a waste on an intake that necks down to 65mm a couple inches in:shrug: