HELP no spark off coil!!

Discussion in 'Fox 5.0 Mustang Tech' started by Teal_Deal, Feb 1, 2008.


  1. parrty247

    parrty247 New Member

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    Never mind the hall effect, i thought we were still talking about no spark.lol
     
    #21
  2. robert fugate

    robert fugate Member

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    So you guys think i can just tie all the grounds together?
     
    #22
  3. jrichker

    jrichker StangNet's favorite TOOL SN Certified Technician Founding Member

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    Grounds

    Revised 04-Oct-2012 to revise computer ground description into one paragraph

    Grounds are important to any electrical system, and especially to computer controlled engines. In an automobile, the ground is the return path for power to get back to the alternator and battery.

    1.) The main power ground is from engine block to battery: it is the power ground for the starter & alternator.


    2.) The secondary power ground is between the back of the intake manifold and the driver's side firewall. It is often missing or loose. It supplies ground for the alternator, A/C compressor clutch and other electrical accessories such as the gauges.

    Any car that has a 3G or high output current alternator needs a 4 gauge ground wire running from the block to the chassis ground where the battery pigtail ground connects. The 3G has a 130 amp capacity, so you wire the power side with 4 gauge wire. It stands to reason that the ground side handles just as much current, so it needs to be 4 gauge too.

    The picture shows the common ground point for the battery , computer, & extra 3G alternator ground wire as described above in paragraph 2. A screwdriver points to the bolt that is the common ground point.

    The battery common ground is a 10 gauge pigtail with the computer ground attached to it.
    Picture courtesy timewarped1972
    [​IMG]

    Correct negative battery ground cable.
    [​IMG]

    3.) The computer's main power ground (the one that comes from the battery ground wire) uses pins 40 & 60 for all the things it controls internally: it comes off the ground pigtail on the battery ground wire. Due to its proximity to the battery, it may become corroded by acid fumes from the battery.
    In 86-90 model cars, it is a black cylinder about 2 1/2" long by 1" diameter with a black/lt green wire.
    In 91-95 model cars it is a black cylinder about 2 1/2" long by 1" diameter with a black/white wire.
    You'll find it up next to the starter solenoid where the wire goes into the wiring harness.


    4.) All the sensors have a common separate signal ground. This includes the TPS, ACT, EGR, BAP, & VSS sensors.

    5.) The O2 sensor heaters have their own ground (HEGO ground) coming from the computer. This is different and separate from the O2 sensor ground. It is an orange wire with a ring terminal on it. It is located in the fuel injector wiring harness and comes out under the throttle body. It gets connected to a manifold or bolt on back of the cylinder head.

    6.) The TFI module has 2 grounds: one for the foil shield around the wires and another for the module itself. The TFI module ground terminates inside the computer.

    7.) The computer takes the shield ground for the TFI module and runs it from pin 20 to the chassis near the computer.


    See http://assets.fluke.com/appnotes/automotive/beatbook.pdf for help for help troubleshooting voltage drops across connections and components. Be sure to have the maximum load on a circuit when testing voltage drops across connections. As current across a defective or weak connection, increases so does the voltage drop. A circuit or connection may check out good with no load or minimal load, but show up bad under maximum load conditions. .

    [​IMG]

    Extra grounds are like the reserve parachute for a sky diver. If the main one fails, there is always your reserve.

    The best plan is to have all the grounds meet at one central spot and connect together there. That eliminates any voltage drops from grounds connected at different places. A voltage drop between the computer ground and the alternator power ground will effectively reduce the voltage available to the computer by the amount of the drop.


    Rear mounted battery ground wiring. Follow this plan and you will have zero
    ground problems.


    One 1 gauge or 1/0 gauge wire from battery negative post to a clean shiny spot
    on the chassis near the battery. Use a 5/16” bolt and bolt it down to make the
    rear ground. Use a 1 gauge or 1/0 gauge wire from the rear ground bolt to a clean
    shiny spot on the block.

    One 4 gauge wire from the block where you connected the battery ground wire to
    the chassis ground where the battery was mounted up front. Use a 5/16” bolt
    and bolt down the 4 gauge engine to chassis ground, make sure that it the metal
    around the bolt is clean & shiny. This is the alternator power ground.

    [​IMG]


    The computer has a dedicated power ground wire with a cylindrical quick connect
    (about 2 ½”long by 1” diameter. It comes out of the wiring harness near the
    ignition coil & starter solenoid (or relay). Be sure to bolt it to the chassis ground
    in the same place as you bolted the alternator power ground. This is an
    absolute don’t overlook it item for EFI cars

    Note: The quick disconnect may have fallen victim to damage or removal by
    a previous owner. However, it is still of utmost importance that the black/green
    wires have a high quality ground..

    Picture courtesy timewarped1972 [​IMG]

    Crimp or even better, solder the lugs on the all the wire. The local auto stereo
    shop will have them if the auto parts store doesn't. Use some heat shrink tubing
    to cover the lugs and make things look nice.[/quote]
     
    #23
  4. robert fugate

    robert fugate Member

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    Your great jrichker! b4 i read this grounding post though i split the ground from the tps sensor to a new good ground, and BAM! car starts! rough as hell as i have so many new parts to work on, and get my timing set. But i ran out of light so another day tomorrow!
     
    #24

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