How far can I advance my timing and keep it safe

[loosescrew79]

Finally got my programmer to work and I want to advance my timing.

What is the most I can do it with out hurting the motor? I know the best think to do is to have it dyno tuned. But what about for right now. I already advanced it +7 and it drives fine with no ping.

Alot of you guys have programmers and I was wondering what the averge advance is. For the most HP of course.

 

[Pearl02]

I maxed mine out. Listen for pinging in higher gears at lower speeds. If you hear pinging back it off some. Pearl02.

 

[deftsound]

I advanced mine all the way with my diablo and I run premium gas with no pinging

 

[jasonh_86]

I've got my Steeda Timing Adjuster set to 16* with no ping.. but i'm about ot try 17 and 18* and see how it does..

I'd just advance it til u hear ping, then back it down one

 

[GettinThere]

I've got my Steeda Timing Adjuster set to 16* with no ping.. but i'm about ot try 17 and 18* and see how it does..

I'd just advance it til u hear ping, then back it down one

Seems to be good advice. I've got mine at 18*, no ping on 93 octane. I might try to advance it to 19 or 20

At the slightest hint of detonation, I'll immediately back it down 1 or 2.

 

[thomsonc]

Sorry for this question everyone...but what are the advantages of increasing timing? I ask, cause I will be tuning my car with the SCT XCAL 2 soon and would like to know. Actually, a shop is tuning...
So performance-wise, what are the advantages? Disadvantages? Sorry again for this...question...I'm very un-mechanic...

 

[jasonh_86]

It can get you more hp and it pulls harder.. Not sure of any disadvantages unless you've got TOO high of timing, then it can cause detonation and pinging


On a side note, I upped my timing to 18* this morning and went for a long drive. I made MANY MANY WOT passes in every gear, no ping. Just ot make sure there wasn't an unheard ping, I pulled the front plug on my driver's side when I got home. Since my brother was a mechanic, he helped me and we looked it over and saw NNOOO signs of detonation, man I love it!!

I may try 19 or 20* one of these days, but I gotta get used to this 18* for now.

At my local track, 1000ft track, i gained a whole 1.1mph and got a .1 lower 60ft going from 14* to 16*. So now, i'm hoping to get the same gains with going from 16* to 18*. I'll keep everyone informed, I may be going to the track tomorrow actually

 

[propellerhead]

Don't forget that the Predator lets you advance timing at WOT. It has nothing to do with part throttle driving. Max out your timing, then punch it. If it doesn't ping, you're done. If it pings, back off two clicks and punch it. Repeat until it doesn't ping anymore.

 

[SamMan]

I maxed mine with the Predator for both rpm ranges with no pinging. Premium gas of course.

 

[helty]

I know this has been asked several times, but Ive yet to see a straight answer, always "I dont know".

On an SCT-2, what parameter do you adjust to advance timing? I was just out F'n with mine and theres nothing that says "timing". I went through all the adjustable parameters looking for something like 10, 12,14 etc, and theres nothing. There's spark, coolant, and a few other things, but which is it? Its probably there and Im just tuner-illiterate.

C'mon, I its my last day of spring break, I want to go F'k with my car

EDIT: im pretty sure its the "spark" parameter, but it doesnt read 10*, 12*, 14* etc. Its says something like 2500? I guess what Im really wanting to know is, if I want to run say, 16* of timing, what would I adjust the spark parameter to?

 

[spederman]

Helty, from what i remember on my XCAL 2, its the spark that is the timing. It also depends on what your tune already has it set to. So on top of your tune's advance (what ever amount it is), you can add an additional however you want. And it has it in 3 rpm ranges. I think from what i remember it was like 0-2000,2000-4000,4000-8000 rpms. So you can adjust them seperately. When i was bumping my timing on my MPH mail order tune, Tim told me to increase the timing by 2 degrees each in the latter two ranges and check for pinging, And i could keep bumping it until i heard pinging then back it down.

 

[helty]

^^^thanks man, I will try that. Problem I had was with the performance tune sent to me, I had hella (did I just say that?) pining as soon as 4500rpms. Tried a few different gas stations, same thing. So earlier I loaded the "SAFE" tune to the car, problem is I also put half a tank or 87 octane in too. Car doesnt ping anymore which is good, but I guess now I gotta wait to top off on 93 again before I advance the timing.

Thanks again man

 

[jasonh_86]

I wouldn't top it off with 93 just yet. The more gas you put in it now, the longer it'll take for ALL of the 87 to go away. Just drive around and wait til your Low Fuel light comes on, drive ~40 more miles THEN fill it up with 93 and that'll put you close to a 15 gallon fill-up (in close to a 16 gallon tank)

If that makes any sense.

But honestly.. I wouldn't f'k with it if you're not gonna be running it at the track for a while. You're just gonna be leaning your car out and having to use higher octane gas, for really no reason.

 

[helty]

thats what I said I was going to do.

but I guess now I gotta wait to top off on 93 again before I advance the timing.

ie, wait until I run down the 87 I just put in the car before I add any premium.

You're just gonna be leaning your car out and having to use higher octane gas, for really no reason.

isnt that what you do on a daily basis with your timing @ 16 running 93? Im just F'king with the X-Cal to learn the different parameters so its not totally useless right now.

are you back in R-ville already?

 

[jasonh_86]

thats what I said I was going to do.

ie, wait until I run down the 87 I just put in the car before I add any premium.
isnt that what you do on a daily basis with your timing @ 16 running 93? Im just F'king with the X-Cal to learn the different parameters so its not totally useless right now.

are you back in R-ville already?

I'm still in Little Rock.. C. drove the Mach1 to work and said she wanted to go hot-rodding around

I just wasn't sure how you were going to do that, just sounded like u were gonna go top it off first

I plan on racing mine tho, you don't want to race your's because of your rearend. Now if you said you were gonna race at the track, then i'd say advance the **** outta it!

But after the track closes, i'm gonna go back to 10* timing and go back up as the track opens.


Edit: Track tomorrow is Test N' Tune only!

 

[helty]

I'm still in Little Rock.. C. drove the Mach1 to work and said she wanted to go hot-rodding around

I just wasn't sure how you were going to do that, just sounded like u were gonna go top it off first

Now if you said you were gonna race at the track, then i'd say advance the **** outta it!

But after the track closes, i'm gonna go back to 10* timing and go back up as the track opens.


Edit: Track tomorrow is Test N' Tune only!

then where the F'k are you.....sisters? I was just wondering where the hell you were posting from

anyway, I put the stock tune back on it, the only thing that sucks is the ECM has to re-learn all over again bc of the Accufab TB/Plenum, so now I have a high/hanging idle. It goes back to 800 after about 5 seconds, but if I dont wait, I dont even have to touch the gas and it will start going all by itself if I let out the clutch. So when I do give it gas, its surging a little bit. Guess I'll be doing some driving this weekend.

I plan on racing mine tho, you don't want to race your's because of your rearend.

you had it set at 16* all winter when the track was closed though and its been almost a month since youve been to the track thats what I was getting at

 

[jasonh_86]

then where the F'k are you.....sisters? I was just wondering where the hell you were posting from

anyway, I put the stock tune back on it, the only thing that sucks is the ECM has to re-learn all over again bc of the Accufab TB/Plenum, so now I have a high/hanging idle. It goes back to 800 after about 5 seconds, but if I dont wait, I dont even have to touch the gas and it will start going all by itself if I let out the clutch. So when I do give it gas, its surging a little bit. Guess I'll be doing some driving this weekend.

you had it set at 16* all winter when the track was closed though and its been almost a month since youve been to the track thats what I was getting at

Yepp, i'm at my sister's apartment. Just killing time and thinking about going to visit ol' Scott (previous owner.. or 02whtgt) here in a bit.

Ahhhh.. Yeah, I had some high idle problems when my timing went back to 10* and even when it was at 12*. Not sure why, but it was rather ghey.

I see what you're getting at, but my timing was backed down to 14* after the track closed. BUT that still means I had advanced timing (from what the stock timing is set at). However, I did my fair share of street racing in the meantime ... I know i know, street racing is bad but I was bored

 

[spederman]

anyway, I put the stock tune back on it, the only thing that sucks is the ECM has to re-learn all over again bc of the Accufab TB/Plenum, so now I have a high/hanging idle. It goes back to 800 after about 5 seconds, but if I dont wait, I dont even have to touch the gas and it will start going all by itself if I let out the clutch. So when I do give it gas, its surging a little bit. Guess I'll be doing some driving this weekend.
QUOTE]


Yeah, that always pisses me off too. Everytime i do some minor adjustement, like last time it was for changing the tire size so my speedo and odometer would be on, i have to go through all the crap of hangin idle til it learns it over the week.

 

[helty]

I have another quick question for you spederman

so first of all, (total noob Q) Im assuming when you adjust the timing, each degree you advance timing is 1 degree OVER STOCK, right? BTW, what is the stock timing set at? 10*?

Secondly, say I adjust timing to xx*. Then I want to make another adjustment or load another tune. I then have to go back and advance timing again right? in other words, it resets back to the initial timing JMS (or MPH for you) set on the custom tunes, is that correct?

Thanks man!

 

[spederman]

I have another quick question for you spederman

so first of all, (total noob Q) Im assuming when you adjust the timing, each degree you advance timing is 1 degree OVER STOCK, right? BTW, what is the stock timing set at? 10*?

Secondly, say I adjust timing to xx*. Then I want to make another adjustment or load another tune. I then have to go back and advance timing again right? in other words, it resets back to the initial timing JMS (or MPH for you) set on the custom tunes, is that correct?

Thanks man!

Dont worry about man, when i first got it last month, i was very confused with the same question that you have now. I had to do a lot of reading and asking on here and the sct forums.

OK, first each degree you advance your timing is going to depend on which tune is on your car at the moment. So if you downloaded the new tune from JMS, it is advancing over what he already advanced it. So say JMS tune is advanced to 15 degrees, well when you go in to bump it up by 1*, its going to now be 16. But on the tuner its going to only say 1* or whatever you are adding in addition to the JMS tune. So to find out exactly what you are ending up at, you need to know what JMS set the timing to for that tune.

Second, once you change any paramater on the tuner, it asks you if you want to save the settings to the tune that you just modified. So say you adjusted the timing on the JMS tune to +1*, it will ask you to save, i always hit yes, so that way you know what you did last. Now say you want to go back into that tune and bump timing some more, when you go back into spark for which ever rpm range, it will still say 1* which is what you advanced it last time. And this 1* means, +1 degree over the JMS set timing, which could be whatever number. It wont ever go back to the default JMS tune unless you specify it. In each parameter there is a choice for set back to default. When you select that, it will go back to the original settings that were on the JMS tune. If you load a total different tune, (another performance, or even back to ford stock), all the settings will be whatever the new tune is. Nothing you did on a different tune will affect another tune (hope that makes sense). For example, lets say JMS tune #1 you messed with timing, but then you load JMS tune #2. Nothing that you changed in tune #1 have any affect on tune #2. Now say you back to load JMS tune #1, it will have saved all your settings from when you messed with it the first time. And you will know what you messed with, because when you go into a parameter, ie, spark, it wont say 0 anymore, it will still have a 1 (or what ever number of degrees you advanced) in that field.

I hope this makes sense and i wasnt rambling, and sorry to get off topic to the orig poster.