Last Minute Questions before Mach 460 Swap Out

[Aquarius]

Hey Guys,

I'm going to be pulling out the Mach 460 completely this weekend and I have a few last minute questions before I get down to it. First, if I'm going with a brand new head unit, new speakers, and 4-channel amp do I need any type of wiring harness or is it all direct wiring? If so, which one? I have a 2003 GT.

Also, how many people have 6.5's in the lower door? Was it hard to do? What did you do for brackets? Same with installing aftermarket tweeters in the door sails. Difficult?

Finally, has anybody completely removed the rear deck where the Mach amps are? I was wondering what kind of vertical clearance I'd be looking at if this was removed. I'm going to put aftermarket 6x8's back there but, I still have a 10" MTX sledgehammer sub/box from my last car and it'd be great to get that in there if it was possible. The dimensions on the box are 14" H 19.375" W 16" D.

I plan to do a full tutorial on removal, wiring, and installation of all components for future reference as well. Thanks for you help!

 

[mixedbreed02gt]

im struggling to understand why you (and other people) feel the need to remove the mach 460. when coupled with the right aftermarket head unit, the mach 460 is awesome sounding, and more than sufficient for excellent sound in the cabin of the car.

as for the wiring harness, if you're not using the mach460, it will be all direct wiring, you will need to run wiring for every speaker.

also you will need another amp for your subs. use the 4 channel for your cabin speakers, and use a Class D Monochannel Amplifier for your sub(s). If you try to use the 4 channel amp on the sub, it will sound like crap.

removing the mach 460 amp rack isn't too hard. you will need to pop the tabs on the upper deck housing in the back seat of the car, in order to remove the mach 460 amp rack...wish I had pictures but I don't. but there are 4 - 6 bolts...2 of which are underneath the deck cover directly above and behind the rear seat.

vertical clearance should jump from 10" to 14" with the removal of the mach 460 amp rack.

 

[08blueskunk]

im struggling to understand why you (and other people) feel the need to remove the mach 460. when coupled with the right aftermarket head unit, the mach 460 is awesome sounding, and more than sufficient for excellent sound in the cabin of the car.

.

I totally agree, the mach amps push a decent amount of power, just swap the speakers and deck,
You might gain a whole 15 watts more RMS by spending a few hundred $$ extra on an after market amp, and don't forget the time and energy cost associated with installing it.

Definably install an aftermarket amp for SUBS though.

the only real gain of the aftermarket amps would be a better crossover, but again only the best quality aftermarket amps are going to offer that. But it won't be a noticeable difference.

Speakers are key just changing them out will be a night and day difference.

 

[03TrueBlue]

You should get a wiring adapter for the deck to hook up to the stock harness for power and thats it. You need to run power cables from battery to amps and speaker wire from amps to speakers. 6 1/2 in doors is easy just get some 3/4 MDF and make your own adapters. I removed my rear amp rack and its a piece of cake. Here is some info on how to remove it.

http://www.flemworld.com/Mach460/mach.html

 

[08blueskunk]

You don't need to run speaker wire to the speakers themselves!!!

save the time and energy and just tag onto the existing speaker wire that hooks to the factory amps it is already run for you... it is 16ga wire it can handle the power, so don't feel like you need to replace it. Chances are the new speaker wire will be the same size but with a thicker insulation.

 

[03TrueBlue]

only problem with using the stock wiring is where you put the crossovers for the seperates. if you put them in the rear with the amps then you need to run wires for the tweeters being the tweeters stock wires run from the deck not the rear amps. If you put the crossovers in the doors then all you need to do is run new wires in the door for the tweeters and mids. In my last system I ran 12ga to the mids and 14ga to the tweeters. I was running active with 150w to each mid and 75 to each tweeter. By the way 08blueskunk im so jealous of you car

 

[08blueskunk]

thanks,
Yeah put the crossovers in the door,no doubt. unless the amps you have have them built in, then you don't really need them at all.

The stock wiring will hold some heavy duty power, the only reason electrical wiring needs to be upgraded would be for insulation reasoning (wear and tear), or extreme distance, the 10-13ft you need in a car is nothing for electrcal signals in a speaker wire. you could give it a couple hundred watts no problem. but not too many 4 ch amps are going to be pushing that kind of power.

If you have an amp that pushes that much power money is no option for you, and you would be paying to have someone do all this for you, and you would be running huge wires everywhere. and if that was the case you wouldn't be posting o this forum asking for advice.

lol

 

[Aquarius]

Here's my take on the 460: I really like the system, don't get me wrong, but it sounds like I may have blown either the door speaker or the tweeter on the passenger side. It rattles a bit when there's strong bass. As far as I know, you can't simply replace one of the speakers unless you plan to pay out the a** at a dealership for a OEM replacement. There's no drop-in aftermarket speakers that will work because of the messed up impedance of the Mach system. What's the RMS power output of the stock Mach 460 H/U? The Pioneer Avic D3 I'm putting in will be outputting 22 RMS (50 Peak). I've also heard that the speakers will sound like crap with an aftermarket H/U. Do you disagree? I've read that if you're going to change out the head unit, you should go ahead and replace the entire system. You seem to disagree...

The bass is another thing, I like tight bass - I listen to hip-hop, classic rock, etc. and sometimes the 460 just doesn't do it. Will a new head unit fix this?

 

[08blueskunk]

most stock radios are 8-12 watts RMS output, i believe the stock 460 amps are getting you close to 45-50 RMS
most 400wats 4ch.
are about 75watts RMS each channel.

 

[Aquarius]

So it still stands that you can't just drop in new speakers due to the impedance difference of aftermarket speakers and the Mach system

 

[mixedbreed02gt]

I totally agree, the mach amps push a decent amount of power, just swap the speakers and deck,
You might gain a whole 15 watts more RMS by spending a few hundred $$ extra on an after market amp, and don't forget the time and energy cost associated with installing it.

Definably install an aftermarket amp for SUBS though.

the only real gain of the aftermarket amps would be a better crossover, but again only the best quality aftermarket amps are going to offer that. But it won't be a noticeable difference.

Speakers are key just changing them out will be a night and day difference.

no I meant he should keep the mach 460 speakers and amps, and just swap out the head unit. the mach 460 speakers and amp will provide ample sound for the interior, and is a nice compliment along with an aftermarket sub and monochannel class d amp.

if he runs it the way he was talking in the initial post, he's going to be a very very disappointed person after it's all said and done.

 

[mixedbreed02gt]

So it still stands that you can't just drop in new speakers due to the impedance difference of aftermarket speakers and the Mach system

that is correct.

just swap the head unit, use a metra harness, put in a sub, subbox, and class d monochannel amp, you'll not only save a ton of time and money, but the sound will be better than what you are trying to do as stated in your initial post.

 

[ChingonStang]

no I meant he should keep the mach 460 speakers and amps, and just swap out the head unit. the mach 460 speakers and amp will provide ample sound for the interior, and is a nice compliment along with an aftermarket sub and monochannel class d amp.

if he runs it the way he was talking in the initial post, he's going to be a very very disappointed person after it's all said and done.

What I don't understand is how in other posts, you totally trashed the Mach 460 system and said it sucks. Now you say its a ok system even if its only half there?

It's gonna sound a hell of a lot better if its completely removed. I know if I installed a nice head unit, I rather hear it thru some nice components rather than paper speakers.

But I will the first to say that the Mach 460 system has a decent sound. And the sole reason I choose to keep the system intact was not for the sound, but security. Especially driving a vert and that I keep my top down a majority of the time.

 

[mixedbreed02gt]

What I don't understand is how in other posts, you totally trashed the Mach 460 system and said it sucks. Now you say its a ok system even if its only half there?

It's gonna sound a hell of a lot better if its completely removed. I know if I installed a nice head unit, I rather hear it thru some nice components rather than paper speakers.

But I will the first to say that the Mach 460 system has a decent sound. And the sole reason I choose to keep the system intact was not for the sound, but security. Especially driving a vert and that I keep my top down a majority of the time.

I think you're getting confused with me putting down the Mach 460 Head Unit. I hate the Mach 460 Head Unit...it's garbage it's trash, it sounds like doo doo, the sound quality is terrible, the bass is pathetic, the volume on it is a joke, and it's because it's not a high powered head unit.

The Speakers and Amps themselves are perfect when paired with an aftermarket head unit...the sound with no subs or aftermarket amp, is incredible, but when you add the subs and aftermarket amp, man its freakin' downright awesome.

I myself have a Pioneer integrated into my Mach 460 amps and speakers, and I love the sound, it's more than ample to blow my eardrums out when combined with my class d monochannel Alpine MRP-M850 850 Watt Amp and 2 12" Kicker DVC Subs rated at 400 Watts each, and I can't even set the gains at more than 1/3, otherwise my ears start throbbing.

Reason I say its ample is because you want a nice balanced sound ratio between the subs and the speakers in the car.

if you put the 4 channel amp in, and power all the little speakers, and then you power subs with it too, you're gonna get a major sound distortion, not a lot of bass, and everything sounds like crap because it's all being powered off of one thing. not to mention, you're doing a lot of unneccesary wiring, spending a lot of unnecessary money, when all you need to do is make proper use of the speakers and amps to get a killer sound system.

you don't need perfect speakers in the interior of the car, because the aftermarket subs and amp will drown out any imperfections, but you will still be able to hear what the words of the music are, and hear all the instruments and voices in the background (this is what makes the mach460 speakers and amps worthwhile).

 

[08blueskunk]

molded paper speakers (mach 460) have no comparison to polymer cones with stand alone tweeters, the clarity will be night and day difference, even with $50 pioneer speakers you will notice a huge clarity difference.

As far as the tweeters on the door you can modify them to fit aftermarket 1" tweets in the enclosure. Just need a dremel.

If you already have an aftermarket 4 channel use it, if not save the money and get some decent speakers. at least for the front if nothing else. Worst case us ethe money you save to have a custom shop install the speakers.

 

[wytstang]

Kinda Long

I replaced my HU on my stock system long ago with a Pioneer DEH-p7800mp. I know Poineer isn't the best but neither is the Mach system itself. The music I listen too (90's rock and hip hop) still sounds "muddy" for lack of a better word. Every time the bass hits it ruins the song (speakers don't have good excursion). Case in point Snoop doggs song "I wanna F%$# You" sounds horrible or Metallic's song "One" when the drummer goes ape chit on the bass drums.
I've adjusted the stereo countless times to try and improve on this and nothing. Do your self a favor and do it all at once, no factory system can hold a candle to a well thought out after market system. I've held off as long as I can, the mach is gone asap. I've chosen Oz Audio 5x7 for the front and back (should be here tomorrow) along with Oz cross overs and my old Alpine V12 amp. No doubt in my mind it's going to blow the mach system out of the water. Dump it for quality components and in the end you'll just be much happier with the sound. Some people can listen to any system and be fine with it, others like my self want clarity in the mids and highs and clean bass. Good luck.

 

[2BADSTANGS]

460 replace

Ok, let me start by saying that I am an MECP 1st class certified installer and an audiophile. I have a 99 Cobra that HAD the mach setup. I have done quite a few of these now. I agree the mach system is decent, but if you are an audiophile it won't do. If you do use the mach amps with a sub either fabricate a harness to feed them with line level (RCA plug) signals or buy the converter. You will be feeding the factory amps much more power if you hook speaker level outputs to them, causing uneven sub/ mid amp output.(bad) I am running an Eclipse AVN-7000, Infinity Kappa 5x7 components (Mid and tweet seaperate) with a 5channel amp and an mtx 7500 10". I removed and replaced the whole mach system but used the stock speaker locations because there good unless you want full-on custom. The setup should be the same as the 99. As has been stated USE THE FACTORY WIRING!!! When you replace your speakers note the colors of wires as they will match at the amps. The amp right below your head unit runs all four tweets. The amps on the back box run the front and rear mids on their respective sides. You can buy a ford factory amp bypass harness that will plug into the amp harnesses so that you can cut and splice it instead of butchering the factory wiring. Metra makes this harness and it should be avalible at any reputable sterio shop. (I think I used 3 of them) They make it easier and should you decide to remove the gear you simply unplug the harness and plug the factory stuff. Why do 6.5's when they make 5x7's that drop right in? Try to avoid mounting the crossoves in the doors, they are exposed too much to the elements, Ive seen many fail because of that. The wires are already run inside the vehicle, just solder onto them and mount them in the kick panels or under dash. As I said, do yourself a favor and solder your connections! As far as the box under the rear deck, it is not too difficult to remove, but I would use it unless you have to remove it for subs as it gives each mid its own enclosure.(Good) If you have any other questions post them and I'll do my best to help.

 

[Aquarius]

I'll be running a 4 Channel Alpine F450 amp for the speakers and a mono MTX TA4252 for the sub. The only reason I wanted to take out the deck is b/c I have a MTX Sledgehammer box lying around with the T5510 sub from my other car. I really liked that sub and was pretty dissappointed when I found out it wouldn't fit in the Mustang trunk (14" Tall). I think the sub fitting outweights the enclosure for the rear deck speakers? I'm going to put 6.5 components up front and full-ranges in the back.