Rear End Talk
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That's my "logic". See one thing I have going on right now is I really want a Miata. I have been looking for a steal of a deal on one. Having that in the back of my head is saying scrap the road course for the fox. I mean a Miata is pretty much a "track" inspired car. Then I could just dedicate the fox to drag and see about some class rules.
@2000xp8 I can appreciate what you're telling me. I guess I could always just run a 9.2-1 compression ratio in my motor for a while. Then throw on a blower, add to the fuel system, swap out the efi, etc. down the road when I want it.
Man I tell you what a little while back, all day long. Recently they have been pretty pricey. I will take either an NA or NB, if I could choose I'd get an NB. I haven't seen a RTR Track Miata for under $4k in about a month. I'd prefer one with the 1.8L and LSD and what not, however I wouldn't be opposed to a 90 model since it wouldn't need emissions.
If you want to build your mustang into an all around street/occasional track/drag car concentrate on the chassis,brakes,suspension,cooling and keep the motor n/a. With your dart block build you should easily make 550-600hp(flywheel). You have to have a good foundation to build a house. Same thing for your fox. I started to play around with thinking I wanted mine to be able to handle. I've since abandoned that thought process and concentrated on a straight line/steerable combo.
You are probably right, although the aftermarket block will likely handle more rpm.
Out of curiosity, why the goal of 1000hp?
500rwhp really is enough in one of these car to get you into trouble.
You have to remember, foxes are very light compared to newer cars.
They have no traction control
No anti lock brakes
No stability control
Driving a 1000hp car 3200lb car missing all these things is a job, not a pleasure. I have half that number and drive around on drag radials and have still had some situations that were close to going real bad.
You aren't going to get any amount of rear tire under the back end, narrowing the rear is expensive, so is tubbing and I can't see how a panhard bar would fit. In a handling situation you are only going to get a 265-275 rear tire on the car if you don't want it to rub around corners (my 275's rub on hard cornering, that's why I bought a phb)
IMO, get the 351 in and running, don't go bonkers with the cam, you want to be able to operate it in traffic if you have to (a mistake I have made, going for max power instead of max driveablity), then concentrate on the brakes and suspension.
Right now you are on the 5 year 50,000 dollar plan.
My intent isn't to insult, it's meant to prevent you spending years and countless dollars building something you can't do much with.
You never know when life it going to change, so you don't want to be sitting on a non running car that has 20,000 bucks in.
making the power is also the cheap part.
the maintenance on cars at this power level are crazy!
also if you are looking for a 351 based short block we have a 450" windsor with an RDI block GRP rods custom diamond pistons callies crank danny bee belt drive 55mm cam bearings and lots of spare rods pistons and rings for sale for 6500 firm. it made over 958NA with a set of old motor sport SC1s and a single carb cast intake
the maintenance on cars at this power level are crazy!
also if you are looking for a 351 based short block we have a 450" windsor with an RDI block GRP rods custom diamond pistons callies crank danny bee belt drive 55mm cam bearings and lots of spare rods pistons and rings for sale for 6500 firm. it made over 958NA with a set of old motor sport SC1s and a single carb cast intake
@2000xp8
True on the higher rpm, then it's alot higher valvetrain cost correct? I need more info on this subject, for sure. Man I would love to be able to hear 8k revs! I definitely don't want a solid roller cam that I have to adjust the valves after every run. Is it even possible on a Hydr. Roller...
Well the 1000HP # is because I would love to race it later on down the road. I have no objections to getting used to the lower power numbers in this car first. Obviously that's what one would do. I'm just weighing options and doing my research. I would love to be in @84Ttop's shoes one day.
I'd like to stay 275's if possible. That's what I have now, but the BS on my wheels are so horrible they rubbed BAD. Recently I got an Eastwood fender roller, rolled the lip, and pulled the fenders out. Only one side barely rubs every now and again since I need to finish pulling. My car is lower than stock due to MM Adj. LCA's. How much did the PHB help? It must help a good bit, to be labeled the part Ford forgot ha-ha.
So far I've got the short block. I'm going to get a custom Hydr. Roller Cam (from Woody),a pair of 11R's, & either a Super Vic Intake/FAST 2 EFI. I figured when I talk to Jim about a cam, he knows this thing will need to be street-able. The cam and compression ratio will be my deciding factors whether it will be street-able or not, correct?
I appreciate you sharing knowledge and helping a fellow mustang/racing enthusiast. I agree one minute you're up and then the next you're down. I don't take anything on this forum as an insult, I have pretty thick skin.
@srtthis Thanks for the offer!
True on the higher rpm, then it's alot higher valvetrain cost correct? I need more info on this subject, for sure. Man I would love to be able to hear 8k revs! I definitely don't want a solid roller cam that I have to adjust the valves after every run. Is it even possible on a Hydr. Roller...
Well the 1000HP # is because I would love to race it later on down the road. I have no objections to getting used to the lower power numbers in this car first. Obviously that's what one would do. I'm just weighing options and doing my research. I would love to be in @84Ttop's shoes one day.
I'd like to stay 275's if possible. That's what I have now, but the BS on my wheels are so horrible they rubbed BAD. Recently I got an Eastwood fender roller, rolled the lip, and pulled the fenders out. Only one side barely rubs every now and again since I need to finish pulling. My car is lower than stock due to MM Adj. LCA's. How much did the PHB help? It must help a good bit, to be labeled the part Ford forgot ha-ha.
So far I've got the short block. I'm going to get a custom Hydr. Roller Cam (from Woody),a pair of 11R's, & either a Super Vic Intake/FAST 2 EFI. I figured when I talk to Jim about a cam, he knows this thing will need to be street-able. The cam and compression ratio will be my deciding factors whether it will be street-able or not, correct?
I appreciate you sharing knowledge and helping a fellow mustang/racing enthusiast. I agree one minute you're up and then the next you're down. I don't take anything on this forum as an insult, I have pretty thick skin
.@srtthis Thanks for the offer!
Jumping in late here... I've made upwards of 950rwhp in a past personal project car with a hydraulic roller, its possible but not the easiest thing to do. As far as solid roller maintenance, good valve train plays a big part. With the stud rockers and girdle I was adjusting the valves after 8-10 passes. now with the shaft rockers and all good valve train parts I check them at least every time we head to the track but only adjusted them once every 40 or so passes including the street miles. The 275 tire will always be plenty. When I build any new chassis it will be on a 275 for sure, no questions about it. Street car on 275's cutting a 1.20... Hell yeah!@2000xp8
True on the higher rpm, then it's alot higher valvetrain cost correct? I need more info on this subject, for sure. Man I would love to be able to hear 8k revs! I definitely don't want a solid roller cam that I have to adjust the valves after every run. Is it even possible on a Hydr. Roller...
Well the 1000HP # is because I would love to race it later on down the road. I have no objections to getting used to the lower power numbers in this car first. Obviously that's what one would do. I'm just weighing options and doing my research. I would love to be in @84Ttop's shoes one day.
I'd like to stay 275's if possible. That's what I have now, but the BS on my wheels are so horrible they rubbed BAD. Recently I got an Eastwood fender roller, rolled the lip, and pulled the fenders out. Only one side barely rubs every now and again since I need to finish pulling. My car is lower than stock due to MM Adj. LCA's. How much did the PHB help? It must help a good bit, to be labeled the part Ford forgot ha-ha.
So far I've got the short block. I'm going to get a custom Hydr. Roller Cam (from Woody),a pair of 11R's, & either a Super Vic Intake/FAST 2 EFI. I figured when I talk to Jim about a cam, he knows this thing will need to be street-able. The cam and compression ratio will be my deciding factors whether it will be street-able or not, correct?
I appreciate you sharing knowledge and helping a fellow mustang/racing enthusiast. I agree one minute you're up and then the next you're down. I don't take anything on this forum as an insult, I have pretty thick skin
@srtthis Thanks for the offer!
What were you revving the hydraulic roller motor to?
Crap man 40 passes and street time. That's not bad. Most of the time I've had this car it's been more work than play. I can live with that. Too me the work is well worth it. How much of nightmare is your car to drive on the street compared to, say a 500-600hp fox? 1.20 60' FTW!!
Didn't put the phb on yet, one of those "i'll get to it" projects. But it will help, I know plenty of people that have done it.
Before I got to it I had to change the catback because there was zero chance of me running the car with no tailpipes and it didn't clear my last system. The bar does fit now (ultraflo welded catback), I test fitted it. But before I mount it permanently I'm redoing the rear, it still works well with my 15 year old auburn and moser 31 spline axles, but I don't want to have to remove the phb to work on the rear later. I have all the parts, but am in no rush since I probably won't drive the car for at least another 2 months.
My tires rub on the inside during cornering. Remember too, there is a big difference in running an 18 inch wheel for traction than there is a 15. You also have to consider brake clearance, so if you go with a big brake setup in the rear for road racing, you probably aren't going to be able to run a 15, or maybe even a 16.
There is also a big difference in running a car setup to transfer weight and one that is not. I did the drag setup thing, didn't last long, not sure a guy used to cornering is safe in a drag car on the street. It always seemed like I was one jughandle (we have those in NJ) away from landing up in the bushes.
As for compression, that is not my forte, I've always let more informed people make those decisions for me based on what I was trying to accomplish.
Before I got to it I had to change the catback because there was zero chance of me running the car with no tailpipes and it didn't clear my last system. The bar does fit now (ultraflo welded catback), I test fitted it. But before I mount it permanently I'm redoing the rear, it still works well with my 15 year old auburn and moser 31 spline axles, but I don't want to have to remove the phb to work on the rear later. I have all the parts, but am in no rush since I probably won't drive the car for at least another 2 months.
My tires rub on the inside during cornering. Remember too, there is a big difference in running an 18 inch wheel for traction than there is a 15. You also have to consider brake clearance, so if you go with a big brake setup in the rear for road racing, you probably aren't going to be able to run a 15, or maybe even a 16.
There is also a big difference in running a car setup to transfer weight and one that is not. I did the drag setup thing, didn't last long, not sure a guy used to cornering is safe in a drag car on the street. It always seemed like I was one jughandle (we have those in NJ) away from landing up in the bushes.
As for compression, that is not my forte, I've always let more informed people make those decisions for me based on what I was trying to accomplish.
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Yea shaft rockers for us also and we use to adjust them about every 15 passes when the head gaskets were getting replaced. We would check the nos motor every so often but unless something was coming apart it was always within .002 or so
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With the hydraulic can we saw 7800 with no issues, beyond that we had lifter trouble. My solid roller has been past 9k with no issues once hahaha. We shift at 8,200 and were trapping 8,800rpm in the 1/4. That is likely to be similar in 1/8th trim for this new season. We will be changing headgaskets a little more often like Derek and Co. Though lol
Yea, I can understand that. Every once in a while I have that happen. I currently have dumps and I'm not attached to them. Only reason I would like tailpipes is for looks. I guess it would be nice to not have all the dishes in the kitchen clinking in the AM when I'm warming up the car ha-ha. 2 months! Man how do y'all deal with that cold weather.
That's another conundrum I've been facing. Either stock-ish brakes and a nice soft wrinkly side wall VS big brakes and a stiff smaller sidewall. I know I want the car to be street-able for sure. Whether it's drag setup or street setup, who knows... I almost feel like if I was just going to throw driveability out the window completely, I could have bought a big arse 460ci.
Does it make any sense to start with just a hydraulic setup and then later if I need more start the switch over? I'm trying to calculate cost difference (rough guesstimate will do) of Valvetrain setups. Hyd. VS Roller. I'm assuming all of your motors are shaft mount rockers? Ha-ha past 9k, holy crap! Any comments on how the car is on the street compared to anything with generously less power? I know that's kind of a loaded question.. lol.
Stockish brakes? Try stopping 2-3 times hard in a short period of time with them, the first stop will be decent, the second will be quite a bit worse, the third? Hold on and reach for the E brake and hope it works.
I'm all about the brakes these days, in fact I think a set of big brakes should be on the top of any street cars list.
You can get up to speed in a powerful car much faster, therefore you may need to stop much quicker.
94/95 spindles with rear 94+ cobra discs was one of the best things I've ever done. I should have done it before adding any power.
Just remember with higher rpm there is always more risk and expense. So many here have come and gone with big dreams of high rpm monsters. Not sure I've seen anyone here pull it off that didn't own or work at a shop.
I'm all about the brakes these days, in fact I think a set of big brakes should be on the top of any street cars list.
You can get up to speed in a powerful car much faster, therefore you may need to stop much quicker.
94/95 spindles with rear 94+ cobra discs was one of the best things I've ever done. I should have done it before adding any power.
Just remember with higher rpm there is always more risk and expense. So many here have come and gone with big dreams of high rpm monsters. Not sure I've seen anyone here pull it off that didn't own or work at a shop.
Stock-ish rear brakes on a drag car, 15" wheel. I agree about having good brakes, especially on a street car. I've had my brakes go out twice it's not fun. Then you add friends in the car, jeeze.
Thanks, for the advice on the rear 94+ cobra discs! The 94/95 spindles are definitely what I'm going to use.
Trust me, I see that alot. People are always buying this and buying that, then selling it. Trust me I'm asking and learning so I can do this. I understand one day things could change and I'd have to sell my dream.
Luckily I work at a shop.
hopefully you run a narrower spring than we do. couple of the nuts up by the valve springs SUCK to torque!
yea we have been 9800 2 years ago with the old converter. the new one is 9300 out the back when he lifted (202mph) as long as you can keep the bob weight low in the motor and the valve train stable, wing that bitch as high as you need too!
Nope, haha I so feel your pain on this one!
There is no harm in starting with a hydraulic roller and switching later on. The biggest expense will be the lifters and cost of the cam. While I run shaft rockers it's not mandatory and we haven't had them on every single build in years past. As far as streetablility, my car has great street manners and is very easy to drive and sit in traffic with. The radiator placement due to the gear drive is more of an issue than anything else. The driveability will all come down to the tune. I"ve driven 500rwhp mustangs that have terrible manners and just plain suck to drive while I've driven a fair share of 1,000+ rwhp cars that drive like a dream. Tune Tune Tune... there is no replacement for the amount of time that it takes to work all of the fine details out. Anyone can make hp on a dyno but it is truly an exercise of patience to tune driveability to that level no matter how much hp it makes.
yes TUNE TUNE TUNE TUNE!!!!
the turbo car is an ex street car... it has lost all its street manors now with the dry decked heads filled block and the new trans cooler set up. but thats the cost of trying to go as fast as we are trying to go.
and nick... order a few extra nuts.you will mess a few up from time to time
the turbo car is an ex street car... it has lost all its street manors now with the dry decked heads filled block and the new trans cooler set up. but thats the cost of trying to go as fast as we are trying to go.
and nick... order a few extra nuts.you will mess a few up from time to time
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