Saleen Series IV Supercharger

MASHBY

New Member
Feb 24, 2006
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Calgary,AB
So I have fallen in to the mod bug and decided to get a supercharger.Ive been chatting to my Mustang shop and he suggested the Saleen Series IV Supercharger.I have done a search and cant find that many topics about the Series IV.The reason we are leaning towards to Saleen as opposed to K.B. is the lower lbs of boost for similar performance gains.Plus the Saleen seems more efficeint so less heat and as this is my daily driver and don't wont an unrelible car.Just realy want around 375hp.So I just wondered if any of you guys had this saleen blower or any thoughts on it.
Thanks
 
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I think your performance shops been blowing sunshine up your dress. The Series IV kit is a nice piece, but in no way is it superior to a 1.7L Kenne Bell. The Series IV uses a 1600AX, which is similar (slightly smaller) in displacement to the 1.7L Autorotor used with the Kenne Bell kit. They’re both twin screw units and essentially of the same design. They’re both going to make about the same level of heat and move the same volume of air per revolution and one won’t be any more efficient that the other as far as the compressor itself is concerned. The real difference between the two kits is the intercooler and manifold design. Of which I’m sorry to tell you, the Kenne Bell has the better of. The Saleen intercooler brick to manifold area is prone to leakage because of the way it was designed. There are literally “gaps” between the lower manifold and intercooler brick itself that allow hot discharge air from the output side of the blower to get past the cooler and into the manifold, which to a certain degree is spoiling the air charge (so much for efficiency). Secondly, the Saleen has a more complicated, restrictive manifold that in order to make flow as well as the Kenne Bell unit, would need extensive porting and/or an Extrude Hone process. Both of these issues are fixable and if you’re willing to address them, the two kits would then be on a pretty level playing field. A high point for the Saleen kit though, is that it does incorporate a larger heat exchanger, equipped with cooling fans to reduce the chances of heat soaking the blower in low air flow situation (IE Traffic, line up at the staging lanes, etc).

Not trying to sway your decision either way, both kits are great pieces and will both pretty comfortably make 375rwhp, but I though you should know all of the facts before plunking down your hard earned cash on one or the other. :)
 
kb 1.7L is $4850 or so I think. I think the saleen series IV is a 1.6L but I can't rember if it is a whiple? I think it is $4200 or somthing like that.

I don't think saleen series IV in stock trim will get you near 375hp. I have seen people in the low 300's without modding the kit. I know the KB 1.7L will to 375 in stock trim most likely. the restriction on the sereies IV is the manifold. you can make the kit make power but I think the KB is just an eaiser way to go because you don't know mods to the kit.

this is all just stuff I have read. there was a long thread about a buy getting like 387hp out of one but had alot of dyno time and mods to the kit.

my vote would be kb 9spi.
 
hognutz said:
kb 1.7L is $4850 or so I think. I think the saleen series IV is a 1.6L but I can't rember if it is a whiple? the series II was the blower that really sucked IMO.
The Series IV utilizes a 1600AX, which yes, was made by Whipple Industries.

As for the Series II blower sucking.....define suck? The Series II kit utilizes an Eaton MP90 as the blower. The AED REV II supercharger kits use this same blower with their patented manifold design as does Roush and are making nearly 400rwhp with them....right up there with the guys running the 1.7L Kenne Bells.

My AED REV I kit uses an earlier version GEN III Eaton M90S which is actually a lesser blower than the MP90 and when set up right, moves enough air to propel a 3,900lb car like mine into the 11.9X's@115mph

So, to elaborate, the Series II kit itself sucked from a horsepower making standpoint, but the blower it utilized isn't half bad. :)
 
Gearbanger 101 said:
The Series IV utilizes a 1600AX, which yes, was made by Whipple Industries.

As for the Series II blower sucking.....define suck? The Series II kit utilizes an Eaton MP90 as the blower. The AED REV II supercharger kits use this same blower with their patented manifold design as does Roush and are making nearly 400rwhp with them....right up there with the guys running the 1.7L Kenne Bells.

My AED REV I kit uses an earlier version GEN III Eaton M90S which is actually a lesser blower than the MP90 and when set up right, moves enough air to propel a 3,900lb car like mine into the 11.9X's@115mph

So, to elaborate, the Series II kit itself sucked from a horsepower making standpoint, but the blower it utilized isn't half bad. :)

the kit is stock trim put down 320rwhp for $4000 that is my definition of sucking. now it may be able to make more than that but with their tune as shipped that is what it made in the couple of write up I saw on it. price just seemed high for what you got.
 
Unfortunately for KB, their customer service sucks big time. There have been Autorotors that have leaked and KB doesn't return their calls. The place that rebuilds their blowers are prone to mistakes too. I seen too many frustrated KB owners who will never deal with KB again. When a tuner sells supercharger "rebuild kits" that have to be installed by KB only watch out. They make great power but you'll never see one of those on my car.
 
StratGT said:
They make great power but you'll never see one of those on my car.
:stupid:

If I'm ever going to run a Twin Screw in my car, it's going to be a Whipple.....and I might as well stick with what works. :D
http://www.allen-superchargers.com/racekit.html

KB 2.2 owners.....eat your heart out!!!

Image2.jpg
 
StratGT said:
Unfortunately for KB, their customer service sucks big time. There have been Autorotors that have leaked and KB doesn't return their calls. The place that rebuilds their blowers are prone to mistakes too. I seen too many frustrated KB owners who will never deal with KB again. When a tuner sells supercharger "rebuild kits" that have to be installed by KB only watch out. They make great power but you'll never see one of those on my car.


that is why im glad i live near them so i can walk in there and tell them in person........ but to the original poster my vote goes for the KB too.
 
Thanks guys for some great advise.So now back to trying to decide which one.Its a shame K.B. has such bad customner service otherwise I would be tempted.I know a lot of you guys run K.B.s but is 9lbs of boost to much for dailey reliability?
 
Advice from someone who owns a saleen supercharger:
If the shop suggested you buy this kit new, or at new price, find another shop. They are either very uninformed, or they have one that they are trying to get rid of. Either way I wouldn't let them touch my car. There is no way in hell that I would have paid the new list price for a saleen supercharger when you can get a KB kit for about the same price. If you can get a good deal on a used one, and either a) don't mind doing a lot of work to it to make decent power, or b) don't mind settling for a lower power level, then go for it. It is a fun reliable blower. Do not pay more than $2500 for the entire kit.
 
Gearbanger 101 said:
:stupid:

If I'm ever going to run a Twin Screw in my car, it's going to be a Whipple.....and I might as well stick with what works. :D
http://www.allen-superchargers.com/racekit.html

KB 2.2 owners.....eat your heart out!!!

Image2.jpg

I just purchased the AED Kit and it's sitting right here in my living room. I'm going to install it in a few days. I notice your in Ontario, me too. Who far are you from Mississauga? Is this thing hard to install? It looks like a couple days work on a weekend. :canada:
 
I'm about 375km North East of you in Sudbury. Which kit did you go with? The race kit I posed above, or the REV II? Both are great set ups. The Race Kit utilizes a Whipple based 2300AX blower, where the REV II uses an MP90. The installation is fairly extesive, but it's a well thought out kit. PM me if you've got any other questions about the install and I'll see if I'm able to help you out. :)
 
Gearbanger 101 said:
I'm about 375km North East of you in Sudbury. Which kit did you go with? The race kit I posed above, or the REV II? Both are great set ups. The Race Kit utilizes a Whipple based 2300AX blower, where the REV II uses an MP90. The installation is fairly extesive, but it's a well thought out kit. PM me if you've got any other questions about the install and I'll see if I'm able to help you out. :)

I purchased the new AED Eaton Rev 5 blower kit with intercooler and a 7way adjustable SCT chip set up for different settings.

I am shying away from the twin screw Autorotor blower until I start hearing some longivity stories on how well their holding up. However, I know my kit can be upgraded to the 2300AX blower from AED so I'll keep that in mind after I purchase a built motor with P&P heads and blower cams.

With some of the leaking problems some guys are experiencing hear in Toronto with their KB kits and only 18K on them I decided to stay away. They tell me that they've made many calls to KB with zero feedback. After 2 weeks of calling and numerous emails, they were finally instructed by email to call another company in Cali to rebuild the blower for $2000 Cdn!! Then after 3 weeks the blower was shipped to Toronto and they were dinged again by UPS for another $350 in brokerage fees. To me, that's not customer service!! I know the KB numbers are good but I wanted OEM reliability. Another website has a KB forum and many folks are having the oil leaking issues with very poor customer service. My opinion, if a 03/04 Cobra can put out 475rwhp and be reliable enough to travel across country then I can live with 375rwhp with the same reliability. Personal choice I guess.
 
StratGT said:
I purchased the new AED Eaton Rev 5 blower kit with intercooler and a 7way adjustable SCT chip set up for different settings.

I am shying away from the twin screw Autorotor blower until I start hearing some longivity stories on how well their holding up. However, I know my kit can be upgraded to the 2300AX blower from AED so I'll keep that in mind after I purchase a built motor with P&P heads and blower cams.

With some of the leaking problems some guys are experiencing hear in Toronto with their KB kits and only 18K on them I decided to stay away. They tell me that they've made many calls to KB with zero feedback. After 2 weeks of calling and numerous emails, they were finally instructed by email to call another company in Cali to rebuild the blower for $2000 Cdn!! Then after 3 weeks the blower was shipped to Toronto and they were dinged again by UPS for another $350 in brokerage fees. To me, that's not customer service!! I know the KB numbers are good but I wanted OEM reliability. Another website has a KB forum and many folks are having the oil leaking issues with very poor customer service. My opinion, if a 03/04 Cobra can put out 475rwhp and be reliable enough to travel across country then I can live with 375rwhp with the same reliability. Personal choice I guess.
Your kit is actually called a REV II (named after the manifold design). You've got one of their most recent kits by the sounds of it that came with the 5th Generation Eaton MP90. The difference between your blower and a standard 4th Gen MP90 are that the lobes with the 5th Gen units are Teflon coated to improve efficiency and the 4th Gen MP90's are not. The REV II is a great kit and will run head to head with a 1.7L KB up to about 9-10psi. Beyond that, the Eaton shows it's limitations by increasing discharge temps beyond that standard intercoolers control, forcing the computer to add fuel and pull timing to keep things for getting nasty. Allen Superchargers actually got a couple of short videos on their website of a Bullitt with one of their REV II kits on it and it dyno’s in and around the 390rwhp range. And even with so, so driving, the owner still managed to run 12.6 with it.

The AED kits do have a few flaws that myself and a few owners think should have been address and some in fact have. First off, the Eaton based kits come standard with 30lb/hr injectors. Not bad if you're only going to be running it with the 3" 6psi pulley, but you're really maxing them out at 9psi and beyond. Secondly, the REV I kit like mine comes with a 190lph fuel pump. Again, fine for 6psi, but fuel starvation problems may make themselves apparent up top when the blower is pullied for more boost. (I'll have to let you know with this one. Mines currently pullied to see 12-13psi. :D ) Third....and I'm not sure if they still use it or not, but earlier AED kits came equipped with a mechanical water pump for the intercooler system that bolts to the end of the engine water pump. Not bad when you're above 3,000RPM, but at idle, the slower rotation of the mechanical pump would cause heat soak issues. I like many other upgraded to the Ford Lightning’s Bosch electric pump. It flows much better all around that the mechanical unit and doesn't rob any horsepower in the process.

As I stated before, I've got the REV I kit, that in fact has the same manifold design as their Whipple based Race kit. The primary difference is the use of the 3rd Gen M90 (same as the ones used on the '94-'95 Thunderbird Supercoupe) over the 2300AX. I don't forsee a lot of problems with the 2300AX. It's been around for a few years now as is actually the same OEM unit used on the Ford GT. There's a guy over on tccoa (EECDOC) that's running one on his '95 Ford Thunderbird with ported heads and bolt-ons. At 15psi, he was seeing over 550rwhp to the wheels and was running 10.8's at 128mph. He's since pullied it for 18psi and is now running 10.5's at over 130mph. If the blower is able to push a nearly 4,000lb, IRS equipped MN12 into those kinds of times, imagine what it would do for a much lighter, solid axle Mustang. :eek:

The Kenne Bell issues are becoming more and more apparent I'm afraid. In the last month or so, I've seen the oil usage and issues with leaking come up half a dozen times now on a couple of different boards. It normally wouldn’t be that big of a deal to most of us (the Procharger guys have had them from time to time as well) and is probably easily remedied, but as you said it’s their next to non-existent customer service and in some cases total lack of response that’s really got these blower owners mad. Their customer service has always been the pits though…..nothing at all like Allen Engine's. Scott is always eager to answer questions and I and nobody else I know has ever had any negative dealings with him.

The shipping and brokerage fee's on the other hand is just something us Canadians have to deal with. Whenever I make a large purchase from the US, I usually just drive 3hrs to the border and pick it up on the US side of the border in person. This way, you only need to pay the sales tax on the shipment. Brokerage fee’s from the US are something that shipping companies love to tack on in order to make money and is nothing but a scam to the rest of us. Not to mention the shipping cost from going from just ones side of the border to the other are unreal.....double in most cases. You’ve even got to pay C.O.D charges on Credit Card purchases over a certain amount, when paying for the duties with most shipping companies, if you don’t call Canada customs in advance to let them know it’s on its way….whether the shipment is pre-paid or not. UPS nailed me with that one the last time, because instead of tacking it onto your credit card like they do the shipping amount, they pay it up front and then charged you a service fee for doing so when the package arrives. Canadians get hosed….through and through. :bang:
 
Gearbanger 101 said:
Your kit is actually called a REV II (named after the manifold design). You've got one of their most recent kits by the sounds of it that came with the 5th Generation Eaton MP90. The difference between your blower and a standard 4th Gen MP90 are that the lobes with the 5th Gen units are Teflon coated to improve efficiency and the 4th Gen MP90's are not. The REV II is a great kit and will run head to head with a 1.7L KB up to about 9-10psi. Beyond that, the Eaton shows it's limitations by increasing discharge temps beyond that standard intercoolers control, forcing the computer to add fuel and pull timing to keep things for getting nasty. Allen Superchargers actually got a couple of short videos on their website of a Bullitt with one of their REV II kits on it and it dyno’s in and around the 390rwhp range. And even with so, so driving, the owner still managed to run 12.6 with it.

The AED kits do have a few flaws that myself and a few owners think should have been address and some in fact have. First off, the Eaton based kits come standard with 30lb/hr injectors. Not bad if you're only going to be running it with the 3" 6psi pulley, but you're really maxing them out at 9psi and beyond. Secondly, the REV I kit like mine comes with a 190lph fuel pump. Again, fine for 6psi, but fuel starvation problems may make themselves apparent up top when the blower is pullied for more boost. (I'll have to let you know with this one. Mines currently pullied to see 12-13psi. :D ) Third....and I'm not sure if they still use it or not, but earlier AED kits came equipped with a mechanical water pump for the intercooler system that bolts to the end of the engine water pump. Not bad when you're above 3,000RPM, but at idle, the slower rotation of the mechanical pump would cause heat soak issues. I like many other upgraded to the Ford Lightning’s Bosch electric pump. It flows much better all around that the mechanical unit and doesn't rob any horsepower in the process.

As I stated before, I've got the REV I kit, that in fact has the same manifold design as their Whipple based Race kit.





Some good info, thanx. Some of the shortcomings of the AED Kit became apparent to me when I first saw the kit, however, they only seem minor and I consider what I'm about to do to it as simple upgrades.

First: I'm not crazy about the heatexchanger-mechanical waterpump and coolant resevoir. I'm thinking of a Cobra resevoir and a Afco Heat exchanger with twin electric fans, any advice. Or would you simply recommend a electric fan attached to the stock AED 24,000gvh heat exchanger? You mentioned the Lightning Bosch electic waterpump, do you have part numbers for this?

Second: I will keep the 30lb injectors and get the system dyno'd at Steeda which uses a Mustang Dyno with complete numbers including temperature, fuel pressure and boost pressure. If the injectors are maxed, then I'll upgrade to 40's. I know I can easily sell the injestors that came with the AED kit.

I'm not worried about the numbers this kit produces but I will eventually max out this kit including a built bottom end, P&:p heads and VT Stage 1 blower cams. When thats done, I'm installing a Methonal Snaw Kit for additional HP at the track.

What spark plugs do you recommend. I know I need NGK-TR6's gapped at .035 but I can't find them anywhere.

Any advice.