why would no on adjust the timing w/o a timing gun? i do it all the time. what matters more, having the timing set at XX* or setting it to where one hears no pinging? i did not use a gun for years - just advanced till i heard detonation and then backed it down a smidge til i heard none at any time. knowing the number meant nothing as there is no magical number for optimum timing. i often go check it with the gun thereafter for my own edification, but given the choice of using a gun or my ear, i would take the latter.
ya.......when i didn't know how to adjust timing, i had my dad adjust my timing for me awhile back, (old time hot rod guy) and he undid the distributer and turned the car on, i was like WTF are you doin the gun isn't hooked up, he said you don't need a gun its all by ear, afterwards i hooked the gun up and sure enough he had it right around where i wanted it.
you hit the nail on the head. the ultimate determination of where timing should be set is done by our ears. if we hear pinging we back it off. the light just gives us a point of reference. it is also good to have a gun if the car wont start after pulling a dizzy. the stang is the first car i ever used a light on (just so i knew where it ran best at in given temps [i run 10* in summer, 15 in winter]). i guess im old school like your dad.
Thats not true, just because you dont hear pinging, dosent mean the timing is right. You can give it too much timing, not ping and make less power.
this is true, but is neither here nor there, in this discussion. w/o being on a dyno or using similar tuning devices, it is almost impossible to know one has advanced the ignition timing too far (if not hearing detonation). a timing light would not tell someone this has occurred (some cars only run at 10* timing, while others can run 18*. the car at 18* is not necessarily 'over the hill' in terms of running the most timing and achieving the most performance gain). still if someone said i could use a gun, set it once and have to leave it, or i could use my ear and adjust it as needed, i would take the latter any day. there is no magic number, and for the circumstance you provided, a light is not gonna help someone know they have gone too far - more precise tuning means are needed. i do agree with ya about someone being able to advance too far for performance gains; I'm just not sure how it applies to this discussion.
Gonna try the ear method out tomarrow actually. My timing is crap at the moment and it should do me well, =]
I know what you are saying, all I am saying is by ear will get the car going but if you want to fine tune it, you need a light and somewhere to start from. If you didnt, you might end up at the same timing spot about 10 times without knowing it.
Guys you can adjust timing 6 or more degrees without hearing or seeing a difference in but 6 degrees is good for 50+ horsepower & it messes your air/fuel ration up wich will lean or richen your car out thus making it loose even more horepower.
i think i may have been ambiguous in my phrasing and i should clarify. i would not set timing by ear if the starting timing point is not known. in previous posts, i said that i would use a light if the dizzy had been removed and re-stabbed. i use the ear method when (for example) i know i am at 10* and want to advance it up for winter. i could use the light and set it at 12, then 14, then 15 degrees (and so on), but i know i am at 10* and i want to advance it till i ping. so i bump it a smidge and then drive while listening for detonation - i dont know what exact number i will see detonation at so the light is not helping me. so i sometimes omit the use of the light when going from 10 to 12 to 14. i just advance it a smidge, lock it, and drive it. thing is, whether or not i use a light, i have to drive and listen for pinging - everyone should. a case in point of the timing light misleading someone is if the outer ring of the balancer has slid. one must listen - there is no magic timing number for any motor. MusPappis, i would follow the advice of others (and myself) - if you have no clue where your timing is at, use the light. where we were all differing was largely semantics - some use a light to go from exactly 10* to exactly 14*, for example. i know i am at 10* and advance it a bit and drive it. but if i had no idea where the timing was set at (and did not have a good feel for how much rotation of the dizzy equalled how many degrees change), i would highly recommend the use of a light. i am sure you know all of this, but your post worried me a little. the playing with it by ear is purely a 'final and fine touch' procedure that i do when i know i am really close and being finicky (from 10-15*, for example). the safe way and best way is to always use a light. im just lazy. BTW, some of the old hot rod guys did not use a light cuz the timing was so inaccurate on a car with miles on it, nothing was too close to factory spec.
I should clarify a little myself actually. I'm not intending on doing it by ear for the final set or anything, I'm just trying to get the engine running as solid as possible to get it street worthy so I can take it to a Ford dealership near here where some friends of mine work and we can get it on a light and set everything properly. Its semi, somewhat kinda functioning now.. It starts and idles somewhat smoothly but doesnt like to rev. You have to go slow or it bogs down and gets pissed. If you do take it slow the engine is smooth at higher rpms and sounds mean as hell. I'm a little worried that when the engine is under load from the tranny its gonna just sputter and die though. I may be getting ahead of myself.. For all I know when I get it on the street it'll run well enough to make the 9 mile or so drive without fiddling. Hopefully tomarrow or the day after will tell. Once its at the shop and I can put it on a rack I'm gonna totally redo the timing and do it right. I just wanna get her running well enough to make it to the shop, =]
