Need Help! Need Advice For Super Charger On 03 Gt
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sneaky98gt
10 Year Member
I really would like to hear that info. I'm not being condescending, I really would like to hear a serious rebuttal from the other side of the argument. I'm a pretty open minded guy, and ALWAYS enjoy learning new things, but to this point in the discussion, I haven't hear that 'other side' yet.
At what point in all of our discussions have we been talking about race cars? I SPECIFICALLY SAID earlier that I wasn't talking about race cars with a super narrow powerband.
But, still want to play that card? Sure, I'll bite.
....yet you don't seem to mind continually stoking the fires, with each post?!?
lol....they aren't breaking them with centrifugal blowers, stock blocks, or street worthy cars for that matter either. What's exactly was your point? Last I checked, your average Joe reading this thread wasn't going after an low 8-second Outlaw pass, or sinking $100,000 into their daily driver?
Well, I don't mind being a little condescending. I'm gonna say you're not hearing any serious rebuttal, or hard facts put out by these guys because they haven't got any to give. More of the same unfounded jibber-jabber based on their so called "personal experience".
I have yet to see one dyno sheet posted, airflow data, efficiency ratings, head to head comparison, and/or a list of mods supporting even one of their arguments. Too many "just because I said so...." and "my car feels fast, so it must be fast" type of responses from these guys, with no actual data to back their claims.
Back them into a corner by asking them to address a specific question or qualify a claim and all of the sudden we're being unreasonable and starting a pissing match.
Three50won
10 Year Member
- Jul 11, 2010
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The reason you aren't hearing any "serious rebuttal" (according to you) is because it isn't worth arguing over. I've been on the internet and on internet forums long enough to know that if you post data, then I post some data...then you post a video and I post a video...and then you post a graph and I post a graph. And end of the day, all either of us did was waste our time. I've been in back and forth keyboard dog fights more times than I care to remember. And it does nothing to change another person's mind. No matter how much hard data you provide. Judging by the comments on here, nobody is gonna change their mind not even in the slightest. So "serious rebuttal" in this case would be futile.
Mattstang04
15 Year Member
I think we scared off the OP. Been noticing a lot of newly joined folks disappear after their first few posts.
restomod66
Active Member
The entire reason the Centri feels like it pulls like a freight train on the top end is the same reason a little Honda Civic with its V-Tec feels like it pulls so hard on the top end; They both lack low end torque! So of course it's going to feel as though there is this massive power surge, it's a peaky setup. As I stated before, this is coming from a guy (myself) who ran a Vortech on an 01 Cobra. Nearly all of these blower setups Centri or PD make almost identical peak HP, it's all the same with the only difference being in low end torque and that goes handily to the PD blower.
This statement confuses me greatly: Three50won- "You have your info that tells you what you know, I have mine. Your info tells you PDs are better. Mine tells me centris are better."
You have presented absolutely no data whatsoever to support your argument, only a biased personal opinion and first hand accounts of what you've seen at a track. The "info" you're referring to is not information at all, but rather a personal opinion which is good for nothing when trying to prove any point wether it be on a Mustang forum or in a court of law. You would make an absolutely terrible lawyer because you seem to confuse facts and data with personal opinion. You're one of those square peg round hole type of guys it seems.
This statement confuses me greatly: Three50won- "You have your info that tells you what you know, I have mine. Your info tells you PDs are better. Mine tells me centris are better."
You have presented absolutely no data whatsoever to support your argument, only a biased personal opinion and first hand accounts of what you've seen at a track. The "info" you're referring to is not information at all, but rather a personal opinion which is good for nothing when trying to prove any point wether it be on a Mustang forum or in a court of law. You would make an absolutely terrible lawyer because you seem to confuse facts and data with personal opinion. You're one of those square peg round hole type of guys it seems.
Three50won
10 Year Member
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Because like I said, I'm not gonna get into all that. Even if I post all the info in the world to support my statements, it won't change anyone's mind not one bit. I've been there, I've done that, and I don't care to ever get involved in discussions like that ever again. I've been on forums where I repeatedly posted numerous threads and videos and posts from other forums, Youtube, dyno graphs, magazines, etc to prove my point. I've been in arguments that lasted 7-10 pages over several days. I've been in arguments where the thread had been closed, posts deleted, members given temporary bans, etc. And it never ever changes a person's mind. So that's why I choose not to do all that. I make a statement based off what I know and researched and experienced. If someone wants to believe me, then fine. If not, then fine. I respect everyone's viewpoint even if I don't agree and I ask the same in return.
But as far as torque down low, I've had centri blowers and although they don't make as much down low as a PD, they still make enough to roast the tires and take off like a beast. I never once had any complaint with the low RPM power especially when my set-up was running perfect and tuned right.
lol....again, you state you don't want to argue and get into a long drawn out discussion on the subject, but here you are....8-posts later, doing just that. So what you're saying is that you'd rather just have people take you at your word when you state your "opinion" as fact, because you just "know it to be true" and questioning your logic will simply be met with "I'm not going to get into it"? You have a heck of a way of validating a point my friend.....makes perfect sense.
I've got a feeling I know why some of the threads you've been involved in on the topic have gone south.
Three50won
10 Year Member
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I'm here "8 posts later" addressing the comments that you and others are making towards me. And what point would it be to argue? Is there any way that anything I write will change your opinion Gearbanger? No there isn't. Even when I tried to make a neutral comment you STILL came at me. I even said I respect your choice and viewpoint even tho I don't agree with it. You have not done me the same courtesy in return. Not even remotely. That right there is enough information to tell me that you guys just want an argument. And you know good and well that even if I did post a video or graph, you'd just post another one. And we'd go back and forth. And 10 pages later we'd still be fighting about it. And at some point either someone will give up or the thread will get closed...but neither of us will walk away with a different viewpoint. You can't even agree to respectfully drop the argument in favor of maintaining some level of mutual respect and peace on this forum. So what more do you want? Here is what I'm gonna do. I withdraw all my comments on this subject. And I will return to this thread to offer only solid mechanical advice or advice on tuning or purchasing parts etc. But as far as this conversation of whats better and who can piss farther, count me completely out as of now. If OP wants a PD blower, then good for him. If he wants a centri blower, then fine as well. If he gets one and then swaps it out for a different and then back again, then more power to him. Either way the car will be faster and more fun to drive than it is now. Blowers are fun, boost is fun, regardless of how much, where in the RPM, or whatever the heck else there is to argue about.lol....again, you state you don't want to argue and get into a long drawn out discussion on the subject, but here you are....8-posts later, doing just that. So what you're saying is that you'd rather just have people take you at your word when you state your "opinion" as fact, because you just "know it to be true" and questioning your logic will simply be met with "I'm not going to get into it"? You have a heck of a way of validating a point my friend.....makes perfect sense.
I've got a feeling I know why some of the threads you've been involved in on the topic have gone south.
Bob Hughes
Member
I think it would be wrong to say that a pd falls on it's face up high......I just had to increase the limiter on my ecu at the recommendation of sneaky to spin some more high end hp. And I'm running an eaton.....super inefficient compared to other blowers. And I'm still running n/a cams losing a lot on low end. Planning on stage 3 blower cams this summer.
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restomod66
Active Member
Lookie there, yet another dyno sheet showing a PD blower still climbing at the end of the chart while providing a hugely linear torque curve. Great looking numbers!
Bob Hughes
Member
Thanks it taken me a lot of time and money to get it there. I'd love to slap a 2.3 tvs on next year
Three50won
10 Year Member
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Can't wait to get some boost under my hood. But its gotta wait, unless I come across a steal. Trying to mod 3 different vehicles is tough...and expensive.
Bob Hughes
Member
sneaky98gt
10 Year Member
What cams are you running? Depending on their exact specs, they may or may not be causing much, if any, loss down low.
I'd love to see what kind of AFR and spark your tuner has you running down low. My tuner was scared to run very much spark low in the rpm range until I pretty much demanded that he add some. Wound up seeing significant torque increases below 3500 rpm, and never had any issues with detonation. IIRC, it was a pretty much flat spark curve around 13 degrees or so all the way across the power band with no water/meth, and with the water/meth (via cooler ACTs), it started around 14-15 degrees at tip in, and increased with the rpm towards 22-23 at redline.
I'd love to see what a TVS could do on a 2-valve. But be sure to take it to the track as it sits now first. Definitely want to see how it runs with the Eaton.
Bob Hughes
Member
Currently the cams are the set that come in the twisted wedge 2v kit. I don't have specs in front of me. But they're designed for n/a cars more than boosted applications. Down low lost torque until around 3500. I'm hoping to put the tvs in this coming January. Gonna need to either run twin pumps or go return style figuring gonna be another $5000 to install $1,000,000 2v lol
okay so I found a used 1.7 kb. ( about 15,000 miles) complete setup with the intercooler. Paid $1900. Was wondering if this setup sounds legit/safe:
(again just a weekend cruiser and trying to get thrown back in the seat a little more)
Boost a pump with stock pump
39lb cobra injectors
NGK TR6 plugs .035
3 inch pulley
kn Cold air intake with I'm assuming stock mass airflow ant throttle body (kb and a Dyno shop here in town said would be ok but would not get max gains wich I'm cool with.)
Was told 8.5-9.0 boost, is that safe for a stock 4.6?
Thought I would ask people who are in the trenches.
Thanks a lot
(again just a weekend cruiser and trying to get thrown back in the seat a little more)
Boost a pump with stock pump
39lb cobra injectors
NGK TR6 plugs .035
3 inch pulley
kn Cold air intake with I'm assuming stock mass airflow ant throttle body (kb and a Dyno shop here in town said would be ok but would not get max gains wich I'm cool with.)
Was told 8.5-9.0 boost, is that safe for a stock 4.6?
Thought I would ask people who are in the trenches.
Thanks a lot
Bob Hughes
Member
It should be a good setup. Just make sure you get a good tune before you go romping on it when it's together
trinity_gt
10 Year Member
That's basically my setup though I can't recall if the 3" pulley nets 9psi. That pulley might actually go higher... For mine, 9#s seems very safe. I'm running a KB tune (chip/module on the service port of the PCM) and it's pretty conservative. Never a hint of detonation, nice and fat AFR under boost.
I will say I'm not thrilled about the K&N CAI if it places the air filter under the hood. Seriously consider a KB cold air intake that puts the air filter down in the fender well:
http://kennebell.net/KBWebsite/Accessories_pg/Cobra Cool Air Kit/layouts/cobracoolair.htm
This will help reduce IATs and steer you away from detonation.
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