Engine Still Cranks With No Start After Swap

[chapters707]

Hello everyone.

A few months back I overheated my 96 GT and lost compression in several cylinders and had a crank with no start symptom. I decided my engine was done and began an engine swap to another 4.6 motor I bought off the internet, advertised as being tested for good compression etc. After months of working on my days off, changing the clutch, battery, starter, water pump, numerous gaskets and seals and probably plenty of other things, I put the new engine in myself with only the help of forum threads and youtube videos. It's been a long tedious project and today I decided to try and start it up. To my utter disappointment I am now back to square one. The engine cranks but will not turn over.

So I do have some connectors on my wiring harness that I can't figure out where they go. Probably about 4 or 5 connectors mostly on the passenger side towards the front, but i figured I at least had the basics to get the car to start. I tried going to my local junkyard to find cars to use as a comparison but I can't find a single 4.6 motor. They are all 3.6s, 5.0s etc. and it feels like i was comparing apples to oranges. Also most engine bay pics on google dont give me a good angle to follow the wiring harness. I took some photos before I took the engine apart for reference but can't zoom in enough to figure out where these connectors go. If anyone could provide some detailed photos of their engine compartments towards the front passenger side and where the wires plug in, or if you know of some that are tricky to figure out and could direct me I'd appreciate it.

Also it may be worth mentioning that my theft light flashes rapidly when I turn the key, but I was told that in a 96 if the PATS was triggered then my motor would not even crank. I am just feeling really discouraged right now because I have put so many hours into this swap and I find it unlikely that both the old motor and this new one are cracked and lost compression. I just don't know what else it could be. Any suggestions you guys have would be really appreciated. Thanks for reading.

 

[wmburns]

Let's see if we can get you some help

Also it may be worth mentioning that my theft light flashes rapidly when I turn the key, but I was told that in a 96 if the PATS was triggered then my motor would not even crank.

^^not true! For the Ford factory anti-theft (PATS) the symptom is crank with no-start. So your problem COULD be something as simple as PATS.

But based on your report of un-connected electrical connectors, I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that likely the connectors are affecting power to/from the CCRM. This is causing the PCM it not be powered up.

What is one symptom of a powered off PCM? If you said a flashing anti-theft light give yourself a pat on the back.

I think you should go back to the basics and start the trouble shooting from the most OBVIOUS point. IE that the not connected electrical connectors are responsible for the problem. At the very least, they should be ruled out before starting more detailed trouble shooting.

Suggestion. IF you really want quick response, YOU should post picture of the connectors.

Another option is to use the Ford wiring diagrams to determine where the connectors go. If interested in getting a copy for yourself I maybe able to help. PM if interested.

Good luck.

Crank with no start check list:
http://www.allfordmustangs.com/forums/4-6l-tech/336452-1997-mustang-wont-ignite.html#2984838

 

[chapters707]

Thanks for the response, okay that makes me feel a little better. I think I need to go out there again with a fresh mind and try to figure out where those connectors go.

I thought that on 96-98 mustangs the PATS system would shut off power to the starter resulting in a no crank symptom, And the crank with no start was only on the 99-04s? I could definitely be wrong though I just remember reading that somewhere.

Oh I totally forgot that my fuel pump didn't prime when I turned the key but was working before the swap. So presumably one of the connectors must power that. I'm going to take your advice and take some photos of the connectors to post on here.

I would try using wiring diagrams but I'm too unfamiliar with the names of different modules and stuff for them to be particularly helpful to me. I'm more of a visual person who needs photos or illustrations of where things go haha.

Anyway thanks wmburns for giving me hope that this project wasn't a huge waste of time. I'll update with photos in the next couple days.

 

[chapters707]

Hoping to go tomorrow to take photos, I'm not sure how to PM on these forums but I am interested in checking out the Ford wiring diagrams if you can send me in their direction. Also if it does turn out to be a pats issue is there any simple way to bypass that without going to a dealer and emptying my bank account?

 

[wmburns]

Let me ask you this. Before the motor swap did your car have a PATS issue? Did you swap the PCM, cluster, or keys? If not, I highly doubt that after performing a motor swap you now have a PATS issue that didn't exist before.

To have a PATS problem you would have also needed to change the PCM, Cluster, or keys.

Regardless the PATS in the 96 model year has an end user re-programming method that is documented in the Ford service manual.

And no. There isn't an EASY way to bypass PATS. If there were, the crooks would all do it.

Go back and double check your work. You wouldn't be the first person to over look a ground connection or other electrical connection. Review ALL of the information in the "crank with no start check list".

PM sent regarding Ford service manuals.

 

[chapters707]

I was never certain that it had a pats issue but the theft light did flash after the motor blew. I never changed the pcm cluster or keys though. I ones you back about the service manual, looking forward to getting my hands on that and tackling this problem again!

 

[mogs01gt]

post pictures of the connectors. There arent many on the front of the mod engines. On the passenger side you'll have the below.
MAF
Air temp sensor
crank sensor(going down into the time chain cover.)
Whole bunch of connectors for the ac

that is about it.

 

[chapters707]

Thanks for chiming in!
Yeah I have those ones squared away I think. There is one female connector mounted to the frame, on the driver's side near the battery that I havent figured out yet. Also what looks like an extra connector identical to the ones that plug in next to the spark plugs. That's all I can remember as I'm not with the car right now though, might be able to go down there today though.

 

[wmburns]

There is a ground wire that is commonly missed during an motor swap. It is also sometimes accidentally disconnected during a battery swap. It is a large black wire with a white stripe. The wire goes around the battery to a round single pin connector. Another way to find this connector is to follow the black wires connected to the radiator core support around the battery. Often removing the battery will make it easier to spot.

This ground wire is the CCRM and PCM ground. If not connected, this would create your EXACT symptom.

There is also a similar single pin connector on the front right side of the car below the air filter. This connector is easiest to see with the air filter tube removed.

There's another round single pin connector that has a white wire with a pink/red stripe. This is the starter solenoid and not the critical wire in question. If not connected would cause a "no crank" symptom.

DOUBLE check that the motor grounding strap from the left hand motor mount to the frame rail is in place. This is frequently forgotten and ripped out when the motor is removed. A missing motor ground will usually cause alternator charging "issues".

As for the female connector on the driver's side near the battery that looks like a fuel injector connector, try the CAM sensor located behind the power steering bracket if off of the main engine harness.

Another possibility is the low coolant sensor in the radiator de-gas bottle. Note, this would not prevent the motor from starting.

 

[mogs01gt]

Thanks for chiming in!
Yeah I have those ones squared away I think. There is one female connector mounted to the frame, on the driver's side near the battery that I havent figured out yet. Also what looks like an extra connector identical to the ones that plug in next to the spark plugs. That's all I can remember as I'm not with the car right now though, might be able to go down there today though.

You mean a connector for the COP(coil on pack)? That could be a massive problem. If those are connected correctly, your timing will be off.

 

[chapters707]

No not the coil pack itself but there are 8 connectors, one near each of the spark plugs, and I have an extra one. I'm probably not describing it very well but I cant go take photos until thursday unfortunately.

 

[mogs01gt]

No not the coil pack itself but there are 8 connectors, one near each of the spark plugs, and I have an extra one. I'm probably not describing it very well but I cant go take photos until thursday unfortunately.

Correct, I bet its a female. That connector goes onto a coil pack or of its in the front, its your temp sensor.

 

[chapters707]

Oh okay my mistake, it is at the front, on the drivers side. What is my temp sensor like on my intake manifold? Finally going to the garage tomorrow to (hopefully) figure this out!

 

[soupnutz]

WMBurns already mentioned 2 of the ones on the front drivers side which are the overflow/degas level, and the cam position sensor. The only other two I can think of over there are the coolant temp sensor right next to the thermostat, and theres a little plug that goes into the alternator, but it looks completely different. I also second what WMBurns said about the grounds/bonding wires, make sure they are connected and good. Check all of the little connectors around the fuse block and battery also.

 

[chapters707]

Finally got some photos to show you guys! I did figure out that one of the connectors is meant to go to the Degas bottle, right next to where the lower radiator hose would go. However I have an aftermarket Degas bottle and it doesn't have a spot for that, is this something I should be concerned about?

 

[chapters707]

Finally got some photos to show you guys! I did figure out that one of the connectors is meant to go to the Degas bottle, right next to where the lower radiator hose would go. However I have an aftermarket Degas bottle and it doesn't have a spot for that, is this something I should be concerned about?

 

[chapters707]

these are the two mystery connectors at the front driver's side, maybe this harness is meant to wrap around the front of the block? I'm not sure.

 

[chapters707]

this is the other female connector, it is right behind where the battery sits. I am pretty certain this one is in the right spot as it is still mounted in place.

 

[chapters707]

Also I was checking out the fuel cutoff switch since my fuel pump isn't priming, and the red button is stuck in the pushed down position. Is this normal?

 

[chapters707]

Also today I realized that when I crank the motor the rpm needle doesnt move at all. Does this signify a bad crank position sensor?