Build Thread 1978 Fairmont…My day off spent in the hills,…( that have eyes)

revhead347

Apparently my ex-husband made that mistake.
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My son is already private / instrument rated. He’s now maybe 3/4 way through commercial. Would you say his timing is right?
The timing couldn't be better, the shortage is really severe. There are a lot of factors involved, most notably money. Most people simply can't borrow enough money to keep up with today's training rates. Then there is the 1500 hours of experience required that passed Congress a few years ago. The jobs that one can build that kind of experience with simply don't exist anymore. Every town has a blood lab now, so there is no flying blood around at night; the banks don't fly checks, pipelines are now monitored via Satellite, etc. I know a few jobs that one can get to build experience, but they are hard and dangerous. I do have a lot of connections, so please don't hesitate to ask questions. Probably best to move it to PM though, as to not gum up Mike's build thread.

Kurt
 
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CarMichael Angelo

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,
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Look at me.…..Groveling.

I have the new mount plate just about finished. Between working an hour in the morning before going in to sit and do nothing for 8 hours, and coming home for a 1-1/2 hour lunch, I’ve managed to get it close enough to be able to mount it today.
Made out of not one, but three pieces of 1/8” plate, the flimsy firewall will no longer need the brace I made earlier in the week. ( see what I did there @droopie85gt ?..I put one of your suggestions into place)

If it turns out that it still does, I should still be able to use it,…but it’ll have to be “ modified“ to fit now that the firewall mount plate is so thick.

Since I’m extending the pushrod mount leg 1/2” longer than it presently is, ( going from 1-5/8 c to c, to 2-1/8”) that will impact the pushrod intersect angle in a bad way. So, I built some down angle into the firewall mount plate. That should drop the mount point enough to allow for less pushrod angle when it moves through its arc.


I hope to hell this works.
 
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CarMichael Angelo

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,
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It didn’t. :nonono:

The target goal for a clutch pedal ratio is 6:1. In theory, if the clutch pedal moves 6”, the pivot arm moves 1”.
To accomplish that, you need to measure from the center of the pivot point, to the center of the pedal pad.
once you have that number (12”), You simply take that number, and since it’s double length on the clutch pedal,…you gotta double the length of the actuator lever.

So,….12 divided by 2 equals 6….1 multiplied by 2 equals 2.

The clutch lever is 12“,..the actuator lever is 2”.

Now keep in mind that the master cylinder piston has to move a minimum of 1” to even have a prayer of working right.

The issue at hand is that my clutch pedal only moves about 5” before it hits the floor…and that lever…….only moves about 3/4” because of it.

The bottom line….The clutch still won’t disengage.

So…

Redo #3.

This time,..I gotta lower the MC..
This time I gotta build the firewall plate out of at least 1/4” plate. ( cause the firewall is a disaster).
This time the actuator lever is gonna be 2-3/4” long c2c, with additional hole drilled at 2-1/2”, and 2-1/4”.

The problem is that I don’t know when I’ll have the next chance to make that time, this time,.:shrug:
 
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CarMichael Angelo

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,
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Hooo boy! You should see my poor firewall….( But you won’t,……because I don’t post OMG photos)
I purchased a new 1-3/8” hole saw at HD this morning, and put it into use at lunch today…I now have a 1.5” wide oblong hole that is about 3-1/2” long running vertically to the left of the PBB…

It is one ghastly looking thing.

I also have a piece of 1/4” plate that will get bolted to the firewall over the top of that hole. with a new, lowered mount hole cut through that plate courtesy of my newly purchased hole saw blade…All done before lunch today…

The question is….will I be able to comfortably push the clutch pedal with a 2-3/4“ long actuator leg, when it supposed to be 2”?
The other question is…
How tired am I of fckin with this?
And the other, other question is,….If it works, and the pedal is a little heavier than It was before,..do I give a rats red bunion hole?
 
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CarMichael Angelo

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,
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Decisions, Decisions.

Tomorrow, I have to make the firewall plate.
I can make it fit inside the factory reinforced area, where that’ll leave a very narrow margin along one edge, or I can extend the plate past that to alleviate that. Doing it the latter way requires that i cut a piece of 1/8 plate to sit inside the margins of the factory reinforcement because there is a raised border along the inside edge that I’d have to get past so that the thicker plate will sit flush against the firewall.
image.jpg

*Pure butchery…what can I say though..Try cutting that hole with everything in place on your car.
image.jpg

More ugly…This is what’s left of the actuator arm, now that i’ve cut it. There is very little remaining of that lever, and it’s only 3/16” bar. The “rod” that goes from the clutch pedal to this lever is only mild steel round 1/2” hot rolled bar like what you get from HD. It rides on two bushings that are on both ends of the larger tube that is welded to that frame.

Two things here..

One, I want to redo the actuator end and just put a new thicker one piece lever cut to the right length and drilled in two locations so as to give me the flexibility to change the length of the mount point..( like one at 2.25”, and at 2.5”, and 2.75” respectively). Problem is, that the bigger tube is full of grease to help lubricate, and support that 1/2” bar that runs through it.
* And welding a new lever onto that shaft that will get stupid hot that is surrounded by grease…..well,..you get the picture.

Two,..while it seems strong enough with regard to twist resistance when I press on the clutch pedal,..the bar is only 1/2”, and it’s not perfectly round like what you’d expect a shaft would be,..( machining tolerances, and the process by which it was formed) and on top of that, it’s not exactly 1/2” diameter. ( hence the decision to pump the outer tube full of grease) There is the slightest amount of slop, albeit not really enough to worry about..But as i use it,..I’d expect that slop will get sloppier..

So…When i went to the Metal Supermarket to get the plate, I Found a cold rolled 5/8” bar shaft..much more round and smooth, and a larger piece of DOM tubing that that shaft slides fairly tightly into. I have that stuff too.
It would never twist, and would be supported along the full length of the outer DOM tubing, not just at the two ends like it is now.

But I’d have to redo that too…which means cutting that apart to re-do as well. I‘d end up spending the day tomorrow just redoing what is already done.
 
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CarMichael Angelo

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:dig:Let’s see…..Where did the progress thread go…..:dig:

Oh! here it is….wayyy at the bottom of the dumpster.

I’m working on clutch pedal revision…..Uhhhh…..what is it now??:thinking:three?

The first one had a 1/2” shaft with a “ too short“ 2” actuator leg
The second one had me cut that apart, and add a 5/8” shaft, but by the time I added the longer leg ( 2-3/4”), the M/C mount location was so low the intake manifold wouldn't allow the M/C to fit..
The third version had me cutting that apart once more, and raising the mount tube/shaft 1/2”. In doing that, the entire top of the pedal mount bracket was cut through so that the shaft could stand above it. When re-welding the thing back together, the heat from the welding caused the outer tube to contract slightly, and had now made the pedal shaft fairly tight. ( As in: The pedal shaft itself takes a small amount of effort just to get it to move w/o anything hooked up to it.)
I had to lengthen the clutch pedal, because I raised the pedal shaft…
Im hoping that usage will loosen that, but in reality, it’ll probably require a version 4 of this fckin thing where i clearance the outer tube slightly.

Blah…..blah….blah..:bang:

The rubber firewall “ boot” that the steering shaft goes through was replaced with a piece of 1/8” plate with a 1”hole drilled through it for the shaft to pass through. ( The rubber was cracked, and the fact that there is this big assed hole through the firewall with a big piece of rubber screwed there kinda made sense that the “ structural support “ i’m trying to get back would be greatly enhanced if i put a piece of steel there instead. )The support bearing that i put there years ago was causing a bind in the shaft…not a lot, but enough to make getting that shaft on and off a bitch.
So i have to redo the support bearing mount. Now that there is a fairly close hard clearance for the steering shaft to pass through, if the steering shaft support bearing isn’t perfectly located,…The shaft will make contact with the metal plate.
:nonono::nonono::nonono:

All of this because I decided that I wanted to make a Nissan 370z 6 speed fit behind a Toyota 2JZ, and put all of that in a ford that it don’t fit in.
 
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CarMichael Angelo

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,
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How close am I to undoing the whole 6 speed thing, and going back to an automatic?

Real fckin close.

The clutch pedal assembly is in. The M/C pushrod now moves 1-1/4” when the pedal is fully depressed. The firewall is stiffly reinforced, The steering linkage passes through its support bearing w/o contacting the hole it passes through.
13DC7C36-A215-4A56-B4C7-B890007468B1.jpeg
72FFD106-FE89-497A-A490-5FDD84130E31.jpeg

You have to get on the floor to see that.
I have pumped so much brake fluid through that T/O bearing, it can’t possibly have any air in it.
Despite all of that,…
The fckin thing won’t go into gear.
Put it up in the air, and you can force it into gear, it’s definitely not disengaging the clutch fully.
I put it into gear, and let it idle. I got under it and watched the drive shaft…It looks like the thing has too much runout..,it appears to be wobbling. It’s dead steady at the tail of the trans, and the pinion flange, but I’d swear the thing is wobbling like a bitch.

And you watch those wheels spinning….They are junk…they rotate like they’re egg shaped…how I haven’t felt the out of round that these things exhibit is beyond me.

Frustrated, I call Wilwood. I tell dude what is happening, and what I’ve done so far.

He refers me to MCCleod.

“I don’t have anything on my car made by McCleod dude”..
He says “yeah, but what you’re asking for is beyond me, and mccleod has done this kinda stuff routinely, so if anybody can help you, they can”.
Wow!…
So much for Wilwood tech.

I call mccleod. Dude listens.. he tells me that I need to buy one of their 65.00 self bleeder lines. And..
If that don’t work..
I have a clutch or a T/O bearing issue.

perfect.
 
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90sickfox

Wasn't a pretty sight...and I've got big hands
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If the shaft is balanced to that wobble then it's fine. If its out of balance you'll now it when you drive it. I've seen a driveshaft that didn't look straight spinning drive fine. If they just welded it up and didn't balance it may be fckt.

Hydraulic TOB are notoriously hard to bleed. Some of them take 2 people to bleed. My Ranger was a PITA. Bleeder had to be closed with peddle on the floor. A few Hondas I've worked on had to be rapid pumped with the bleeder open ( weird ) and then held to the floor and closed up.
 

CarMichael Angelo

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,
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If the shaft is balanced to that wobble then it's fine. If its out of balance you'll now it when you drive it. I've seen a driveshaft that didn't look straight spinning drive fine. If they just welded it up and didn't balance it may be fckt.

Hydraulic TOB are notoriously hard to bleed. Some of them take 2 people to bleed. My Ranger was a PITA. Bleeder had to be closed with peddle on the floor. A few Hondas I've worked on had to be rapid pumped with the bleeder open ( weird ) and then held to the floor and closed up.
I’ve ordered a speed bleeder valve. it’ll allow me to crack it open, submerge the valve in a container full of brake fluid, and just pump the pedal. It’ll pump out whatever air is there ( if any) and since it’s submerged in fluid, only be able to suck brake fluid back in on the pedal backstroke. If that doesn’t solve the issue, something is wrong elsewhere, and that will obviously require the the transmission be removed.
 
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CarMichael Angelo

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Aside from the transmission…..I’m sliding under the front end repeatedly while building the firewall reinforcement. It’s at this time that I notice that the inside of the drivers’ side rotor is all tore up. That prompts me to spin the tire….very hard to get it to move.
I pull the tire, and look…it appears that the rotor has been making contact with the caliper bracket. So, I decide to take the rotor yesterday morning with me when I go searching for a 3/4-16 jam nut for that steering shaft bearing.On the off chance that I would get the car running, I didn’t want to have some stuck caliper be another reason to delay the shake down cruise.
( If you back a few pages, you’ll see that that plan didn’t work out either)
Here’s what you need to know about a drilled and slotted rotor:

None of the worthless AP stores that have signs on the front that read “ We turn drums and rotors” will touch your rotor. They all claim that they can’t turn a slotted rotor. That turned out to be case in 6 different AP stores, and auto-repair shops ( Pepboys, Firestone, and a local shop) I finally resigned myself to take the thing to an Automotive machine shop, and have them put the freaking thing on some flywheel resurfacing machine that they had…Dude said he’d have it done by three. The bottom line here for those that are reading is if you damage your slotted rotor…you now know what to expect
So I leave it..and go looking for the unobtainable 3/4-16 jam nut that would fit that heim joint that I’m using as a support bearing for the steering shaft.
Nobody, had nothing…even a nut/bolt house. The castle nut you see sitting there is a 3/4-20 that I ran a 3/4-16 tap through to adapt it to fit..As you can imagine,….I spent over a couple of hours looking for, and ultimately modifying a spindle nut to lock a freakin rod end in place.
today I look at the caliper..it appears that one of the two pistons ain’t moving.
So I put a c clamp on the one that moved, and stepped on the the pedal. The other piston moved. I pushed that piston back, and put the pad back on, and again, stepped on the pedal. This time they both moved..Hopefully I freed it up.
 
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7991LXnSHO

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On slotted or drilled rotors, the worry is the cutting tip would go in a groove or hole, likely breaking the machine or the rotor.
As far as the machine shop, that approach should get it flat. I hope it is parallel to the mounting surface when they are done. A rotor that looks like this // will be not helpful.
 

90sickfox

Wasn't a pretty sight...and I've got big hands
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You can turn a drilled and slotted rotor but can only take off a couple thousandths at a time. I've done them on a few cars.
 
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7991LXnSHO

wanna catch the space herp
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Wait...... the big box parts store employees get training?
FLAPS stores often do their own thing and it shows. When Western Auto became Advance Auto, they could only hire certified counter people. Then you had to watch the training videos, go through the MSDS books, prove you could total a register at the end of the shift or day, and still be closely supervised until checked off. For others, it depends entirely on the managers.

I talked with a new O’Reilley’s about my lifetime warranty parts from a chain they bought out, Autoworks/Checker. The two guys on duty were convinced the generator for my old car was a gas powered unit with switches that might break. It was a confusing conversation, but it is still covered. Since OBD1 was before most of the chain employees were born, and points before the managers were born, quality experiences are not guaranteed.
 
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