CarMichael Angelo

Nobody appreciates me..I'm gonna cut my ear off
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Wisdom from the world of Mechanical Engineering:
1.) The more complex a design is, the more likely it is to have problems that are difficult to isolate and fix.
2.) If it moves, it will break at the most inconvenient time...

Your old turbo intake manifold goes a long way towards eliminating problems 1 & 2...
And on that note:....
 
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CarMichael Angelo

Nobody appreciates me..I'm gonna cut my ear off
SN Certified Technician
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It says something when after going out for the evening, coming home after having a few drinks, and choosing to " piddle" in the garage for a couple of hours,...I solve the " how do I adapt the old design" to make it work in the current situation.
I guess I'm just a "simpleton" .
 

CarMichael Angelo

Nobody appreciates me..I'm gonna cut my ear off
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Well,...what's left to do to make this work?
I have to weld the cut line in the charge tube..it required a slight angle to accommodate the uo-angle that the tub is now facing.
I have to cut the BOV flange off of the old charge tube, and weld it into the new one. I have to make a 1/8 npt fitting and weld it in for the water/meth nozzle.

I have to make a return spring attachment for the tb, and rig up an extension cable so that the now too short existing throttle cable will work.

I have to decide if having the IAT sensor immediately at the front of the intake manifold inlet is the best place for it, considering the amount of water it's gonna get blasted with...and move it or leave it.

I have to plug the six inlet holes that are going to the iron lung, and t into the 3/8 vacuum line that goes to the brake booster. One leg of that t will now go to the bottom of the old intake where the existing 1/4 npt fitting! And the other two will go to the booster, and the iron lung respectively. That will supply the IL with its vacuum/boost reference signal to the map/vacuum modulator/FPR/ and BOV that are still plumbed into it.

I have to weld a patch panel into the side of the intake manifold wher I had to cut out a chunk so that it'll get past the big assed Cobra brake booster.

Then I have to remove everything,....hook it all up to my pressure testing rig,..and test it to see if that thing leaks.

If it doesn't, it gets painted. Then gooped, allowed to dry for awhile, and installed.

I have a set of 60lb injectors that I originally started with when the monster was first started. The most recent DL's showed that I may be running out of injector,..so I think that this is what I'll put back in.
Since they were purchased as " reconditioned" I replaced them with new 46 pounders when trying to determine if I had one of the 60's not working...(it was fine, this was back in the copper head gasket days of monster history),....it wasn't a bad injector that was causing my problem back then,..it was water that was getting past that POS gasket.

Regardless as to my plans however,..it'll all be a matter of how much can I get done in as little time as possible. I have to take the hairy assed dog to the groomer to get shaved,..fling dog loads into the woods behind my house, go pick up the dog from the groomer, and then STOP...because my brother that I haven't spoken to in years is coming to visit me on his way back after picking up a car in fla.

So,........I have.....some things to do this weekend.
 

xecute

Active Member
Wisdom from the world of Mechanical Engineering:
1.) The more complex a design is, the more likely it is to have problems that are difficult to isolate and fix.
2.) If it moves, it will break at the most inconvenient time...

Your old turbo intake manifold goes a long way towards eliminating problems 1 & 2...
Im a carb ITB defender/appologist.

ford-falcon-xf-ute-drag-challenge-engine-2.jpg



Like all that Maserati and indeed Citroën style idea weirdness, it lookes like some contrary wacko called Alferri or Andre has been deliberately difficult. Untill you try your first ITB low end response or hydropnematic ride or power assited clutch or gearchange

The Citroën SM engined Merak had it all except the hydro suspension, power assited clutch or gearchange. The gearbox was used in the Lotus Esprit; the gearchange is perfect.

message-editor%2F1512689178150-p1090329.jpg


The turbo ITB Espirt Turbo used Dell Ortos and a T3 60 turbo and made a bunch of power without electronics. The complicated way the air circuit was mapped to enrich on boost air fuel was exceptionally smart, and few people understand it.

jl_esprit_turbo.jpg
 
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jrichker

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Hey Joe, are you a Vietnam veteran?
Yes - I am an 8 Year USAF veteran as a piston engine aircraft mechanic. I spent 1 year in Viet Nam from Nov 13 1967 to Nov 13 1968 and I am a Tet Offensive survivor.
I spent about 6 months in the Mekong Delta region at Bien Thuy AB during the 1968 Tet Offensive. For about 2 months we had nightly mortar attacks; about 2:00 AM, they started shelling the base and flight line. The VC succeeded in hitting my room in the barracks with an 82 MM mortar. That forced me live in a 4 man Quonset hut while the repaired the damage that the mortar hit did. I spent the other 6 months at Na Trang AB where it was much more peaceful.
 

Davedacarpainter

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Yes - I am an 8 Year USAF veteran as a piston engine aircraft mechanic. I spent 1 year in Viet Nam from Nov 13 1967 to Nov 13 1968 and I am a Tet Offensive survivor.
I spent about 6 months in the Mekong Delta region at Bien Thuy AB during the 1968 Tet Offensive. For about 2 months we had nightly mortar attacks; about 2:00 AM, they started shelling the base and flight line. The VC succeeded in hitting my room in the barracks with an 82 MM mortar. That forced me live in a 4 man Quonset hut while the repaired the damage that the mortar hit did. I spent the other 6 months at Na Trang AB where it was much more peaceful.
Besides being so dang smart, you're a good man too Joe.

Thank you brother for your service.
 

CarMichael Angelo

Nobody appreciates me..I'm gonna cut my ear off
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Yes - I am an 8 Year USAF veteran as a piston engine aircraft mechanic. I spent 1 year in Viet Nam from Nov 13 1967 to Nov 13 1968 and I am a Tet Offensive survivor.
I spent about 6 months in the Mekong Delta region at Bien Thuy AB during the 1968 Tet Offensive. For about 2 months we had nightly mortar attacks; about 2:00 AM, they started shelling the base and flight line. The VC succeeded in hitting my room in the barracks with an 82 MM mortar. That forced me live in a 4 man Quonset hut while the repaired the damage that the mortar hit did. I spent the other 6 months at Na Trang AB where it was much more peaceful.
My father was at bien hua? In 1968.
 
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CarMichael Angelo

Nobody appreciates me..I'm gonna cut my ear off
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I have everything to "potentially" put the car back together today, except a longer throttle cable. I guess it just wouldn't be me if for whatever reason I need to complicate things. I shoulda bought the damn 60 dollar lokar 48" long cable. And there'd be a 100% likelyhood that that would work.

Except that would be the easier of the two solution..
Instead, I've decided to extend the existing cable, and use one of the pullies that I have from the last time I attempted to extend the previous throttle cable.....that didn't work....

I think the reason I'm gonna try this this time, is because I didn't try it numerous times the last time....And it just makes sense that me having to do things over and over go together,..........like peas and carrots.

So...I gotta try..

It'd be nice if I can actually put the car TOGETHER, instead of keeping it APART.
 
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droopie85gt

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It's okay,...I don't think any of the references have to do one bit with the current situation on our planet.......but......on SETI Alpha 9 where Dean lives...that sht means business.

Maybe,..if you drop a single hit of micro dot, thhen you'll get the pink Floyd prism reference....one incoming air stream split into multiple outputs...( the now ibsolete air box/ITB reference)..otherwise if you stay "right side up".......
Use this emoticon to illustrate your understanding of the current Comments coming from the man who lives where the Lord of the rings was filmed.:confused:
Maybe microdot would make the whole Wizard of Oz, Dark Side synchronicity thing work. A whole lot of booze, not so much.

@jrichker Thanks for your service. What planes did you wrench on?

My dad is a 22 year USAF vet. Enlisted in 50 to avoid being drafted by the Marines and going to Korea. He was a flight engineer on B-29's, KB-29's, KB-50's and did his last few years in a C-141 trucking weapons and wounded.

At 87 he lives by himself and is fully independent. Last year, he was visiting up here from Texas and we went out and saw the B-29 FiFi. He was the toast of those guys. He told stories for about an hour! And he actually flew on Doc, the other flying B-29, so the FiFi guys called the Doc guys and got them on speaker phone with Dad. It was pretty cool. He's been a bit down since my mom passed, but when they said he could go sit in the engineers seat if he was fit enough to get up the ladder, he practically jumped up there!
 

jrichker

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Maybe microdot would make the whole Wizard of Oz, Dark Side synchronicity thing work. A whole lot of booze, not so much.

@jrichker Thanks for your service. What planes did you wrench on?

My dad is a 22 year USAF vet. Enlisted in 50 to avoid being drafted by the Marines and going to Korea. He was a flight engineer on B-29's, KB-29's, KB-50's and did his last few years in a C-141 trucking weapons and wounded.

At 87 he lives by himself and is fully independent. Last year, he was visiting up here from Texas and we went out and saw the B-29 FiFi. He was the toast of those guys. He told stories for about an hour! And he actually flew on Doc, the other flying B-29, so the FiFi guys called the Doc guys and got them on speaker phone with Dad. It was pretty cool. He's been a bit down since my mom passed, but when they said he could go sit in the engineers seat if he was fit enough to get up the ladder, he practically jumped up there!
U-10 - Helio Courier STOL (Viet Nam), EC-121 Lockheed Super Constellation 1049G (Orlando, FL), C-47 - DC-3 Gooney Bird (Alexandria LA), Transient Alert ground service for all types of fixed wing aircraft (Tampa FL).

I put 4 years in General Aviation as a FAA licensed Airframe and Powerplant mechanic in the Orlando area. The work and pay did not prove to be profitable, so I went back to college to get an AA degree in electronics. That was my entry key to get in the computer fixing business where I have been for the last 40+ years.
 

CarMichael Angelo

Nobody appreciates me..I'm gonna cut my ear off
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It feels like I got a fair amount of work done, cept I have little to show for it.
Now that the clutter is gone from having a fuel rail under the intake system, and 7 vacuum lines going to a seperate reservoir, I could actually get back to tidying up the wiring again.

Believe me when I tell you that this is significantly cleaner than it was just two weeks ago.

Two things here..Firstly you can plainly see what I did to extend the throttle cable. That litle aluminum smashie dude is now crimping the extension to the old cable. We'll see how long this lasts before I have to tear the thing out of the car and put a new one in its place,.. but for now it works.
Secondly,...the new/old manifold intake port is markedly smaller than the port on the head. I can't change that. I used a 1.75" tube to make the intake runner, and that makes the tube i.d. 1-5/8". I believe that the port entrance is at least 1.75. It's not that big a mismatch, and it's in the right way..at least there's not a "big going to small" mismatch.
Nonetheless,....I ain't got nothing to port on that intake..the tube wall won't allow me to open it up.

And,

Speaking of the old girl...

Main inductionTube now clocked 180*, and angled slightly upwards and now sporting the current engine combo color scheme.
Underneath is the new throttle cable attaching points. I gotta figure out what I'm gonna do to keep RD's fins from rusting though..those things are raw steel. Bout the only thing I can do is brush clear on them.
For those that lament the removal of the ITBs, I hear ya, I liked it too. I think this intake looks every bit as good when it's bolted to the side of the engine,..and it's night and day easy to deal with. The injector rail is on top, as are the connectors. there's no alignment issues to worry about,..and only one throttle blade to adjust for idle speed correction. And,....like the ITB monster induction system,...it's the only one on the planet.
So I'm not too broke up about it.
I'm presently working on the goofy assed breather/puke tank relocation,..I'm gonna get that thing located before I put the intake on for good. I gotta plan for that thing too though...
 
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xecute

Active Member
And you've partly fixed the injector placement. Its still not quite as good as the stock Fifty dollar head found in the 1983-1984 LE2 Bosch and 1985-1992 Xflow EECIV EFi in the Fairmont.

c2_ford_head_001.jpg


c2_ford_head.jpg






xeefi.jpg


1004DtOXEFalconAlloyHeadIIHF5Hondacastcrossflowh.jpg


The injector had a machined out pocket relief hole in the port which you can incorporate. Your idle surge is injector postion related, not just dead time which Steve fixed. It should impinge on the back of the intake valve, and allow air flow and atomisation. Bosch designed Pulse Width Modulation injectors to work in a certain optimal position.

The BMW ITB system had good injector placement stock, but the extra 30 degree across the air flow bend to make it fit the Falcon alloy head gave it poor injector placement compared to your custom system.

You'll make that bad boy do the bussiness CMA.

Anyway....spray and walk away.

WELCOMETOTHEASPHALTJUNGLE.jpg


That's my motto...
 
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CarMichael Angelo

Nobody appreciates me..I'm gonna cut my ear off
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As you'd expect with me, I'm walkin two steps forward, and three steps back.

I made this hideous hookah looking thing over the last few days. Basically I modified the original puke tank to allow me to run 4 lines to it, and have a drain that would go to a remove able reservoir so I could dump off the puke, instead of allowing it to return to the engine.
image.jpeg

It gets mounted to the drivers side inner apron, and that's that. I install the intake, and sht starts not fitting. The throttle linkage that I adapted is too short, now that the intake is mounted...No big deal, it was probably for the best that I replace that anyway. The bigger problem is that it runs under the intake...right in front of those three fittings on the bottom, which also conflict with the hose for the remote power steering reservoir.. And as hurky as the thing looks, getting it mounted past all of the hoses already on the car was a pain.......
That paled by comparison once the intake was mounted, and I needed to get it back off.
image.jpeg

I'm not thinkin it's going back on.
Anywhere.
I'm sure the whole crankcase vent system I conjured up is now overkill.....(4 ) -12 hoses are probably way more "ventin" than I need, but it worked last time I tried this, so I'm going with what I know.
I know that trying to get the three hoses between the new fuel rail and the valve cover dont work,...I know I don't want the hoses on top of the intake either..I also know that I've already cut up 5-6 feet of the 15' of brand new -12 hose trying to make this work...and I'm not ever gonna be able to get that back.

So........business as usual,.....give me the wall to bang my head against, and point me into the wind so I can piss into it.
 
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02 281 GT

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Maybe microdot would make the whole Wizard of Oz, Dark Side synchronicity thing work. A whole lot of booze, not so much.

@jrichker Thanks for your service. What planes did you wrench on?

My dad is a 22 year USAF vet. Enlisted in 50 to avoid being drafted by the Marines and going to Korea. He was a flight engineer on B-29's, KB-29's, KB-50's and did his last few years in a C-141 trucking weapons and wounded.

At 87 he lives by himself and is fully independent. Last year, he was visiting up here from Texas and we went out and saw the B-29 FiFi. He was the toast of those guys. He told stories for about an hour! And he actually flew on Doc, the other flying B-29, so the FiFi guys called the Doc guys and got them on speaker phone with Dad. It was pretty cool. He's been a bit down since my mom passed, but when they said he could go sit in the engineers seat if he was fit enough to get up the ladder, he practically jumped up there!
I got a short little video of FIFI taxiing and taking off a couple years ago when I just happened to be at Meacham Airport in Fort Worth where it's based getting my A&P. Impressive machine.
 
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