2009 Mustang

[shooterm1]

I'm afraid that as an ex-4th gen owner, blah, blah blah .......

I'm waiting for the Camaro but will be keeping my blown 05 too. If the Camaro is as good as my 4th gen, I may sell the Stang but who can tell, we can only speculate until both players show their cards.

 

[red05bullitgt]

I'm afraid that as an ex-4th gen owner, I too think the Chevy left the Ford for dead in the styling department - 3rd and 4th gen. I think the Mustang survived because it sold an awful lot of V6 models and was physically more compact and easier to drive so sold more to small families and women - the 4th gen had low seats and it was hard to see any of the extremities if you were short, the doors were long and the hatch was big. The Mustang wasn't as hard-core as the 4th gen, more like a saloon (it still is in many respects), which had gobs more power and handled better although again I think the steering may have been too heavy for many. I think the 4th gen had a pricing issue too from historical agreements to build the F-body in Canada but the fact was you had the cost of an all-alloy Corvette engine too.

The main difference between Ford and GM is that when Ford wanted to kill/replace the Mustang with the Probe, the outcry was enough to change Ford's mind. When they decided to axe the F-Body, despite an outcry, GM did what they always do - exactly what they want. Marketing was never GM's suit and their advertising was very poor.

As for the new Camaro v Mustang, I wouldn't be so confident or arrogant to presume that GM isn't a whole lot more serious this time. It has seen the profit in retro-styling and how a little effort can pay dividends. For the sake of both companies, I hope both the restyled Stang and the production Camaro hit the mark. I'm not too bothered about the Challenger as it's a regeneration of a long-dead 60's model line, bigger, heavier and a different proposition as it's still an old Mercedes under the frock.

Myself, I'm waiting for the Camaro but will be keeping my blown 05 too. If the Camaro is as good as my 4th gen, I may sell the Stang but who can tell, we can only speculate until both players show their cards.

First of all, the 4th gen Camaro also had a base 6cyl model as well, therefore I don't buy into the excuse in which the Mustang survived just because it sold more V-6 models than GM ? The reason why the Mustang has survived for 40+ years ! is because Ford has stayed true to Mustang's original philosophy, by keeping the car as an overall practical/affordable sporty car, for everyone..Therefore I agree with what you posted, concerning how the Mustang is physically more compact and easier to drive, and has sold more to small families and women.. While at the same time ! offering a choice of several different power and handling options for the enthusiast as well.. Which is exactly why the Mustang has always been more of a practical alternative over both the Camaro, and whatever the Mopar boys had to offer at the time..The bottom line is ! the Mustang will always be my car of choice, because it continues to provide the best bang for the buck performance hands down, and although the upcoming Camaro will more than likely offer the 400 HP LS-1 and IRS ? I just don't see how GM would be able to keep costs of the Camaro competitive with the Mustang IMHO And even if it does ? it still won't make any difference as far as I'm concerned, because I've been nothing but a faithful Mustang and Ford fan, and will always remain so...

 

[07BLKSTANG-GT]

The bottom line is ! the Mustang will always be my car of choice, because it continues to provide the best bang for the buck performance hands down, and although the upcoming Camaro will more than likely offer the 400 HP LS-1 and IRS ? I just don't see how GM would be able to keep costs of the Camaro competitive with the Mustang IMHO And even if it does ? it still won't make any difference as far as I'm concerned, because I've been nothing but a faithful Mustang and Ford fan, and will always remain so...

It is true. Mustang GT is the best bang for the buck. If you want to know how much the new Z28 will cost, then look at the dealer invoice of the 05 GTO. There is no way GM will be able to keep the cost of the new Camaro Z28 under $30k and that will be one of the deciding factors as to what gets sold. If HP/TQ were the only thing that mattered then GM has Ford beat. As far as being practical, well Ford has GM beat. As long as ford keeps the Mustang under $30k, it will stay ahead of the Camaro in sales.

 

[SlideWRX]

Why would they put a TT v6 in a mustang? The whole point of a v6 mustang is economy (lower insurance,gas prices etc). Just asking

Remember the SVO? It's ok, not many do. Turbo 4 cylinder mustang that was quick. A TTV6 could be made into a driver's car if they wanted to. The powerforce (iirc) engine they showed in a lincoln concept was 400 hp. I'd bet it would get equal mpg to the current v8 (good for CAFE regulations).

Tom

 

[shooterm1]

a lot of speculation here about the face lift, but what about power options?

more specifically; what will be the Base engine / trans package for both the V6 & the V8 ?

I'm betting on zero change / FORD currently being the cheap SOB's that they are

 

[shooterm1]

If you want to know how much the new Z28 will cost, then look at the dealer invoice of the 05 GTO. There is no way GM will be able to keep the cost of the new Camaro Z28 under $30k and that will be one of the deciding factors as to what gets sold. If HP/TQ were the only thing that mattered then GM has Ford beat. As far as being practical, well Ford has GM beat. As long as ford keeps the Mustang under $30k, it will stay ahead of the Camaro in sales.

GM doesn't intend to try and match the Mustang in total sales with their new -POS- Camero.

They just want to skim off the gravy at the top and beat Ford up a little on the low-end.

Total numbers wont approach even 25K units in my opinion.

 

[anticubicle]

I believe you actually meant to say, that Chevy's styling was a WRECK, when compared to both Ford's Fox and SN-95 design..As Camaro's 3rd generation couldn't even keep pace with the Mustang's aging Fox Gen, and in the end ! not even the 4th generation F-body could save the Camaro from extinction, as it once again ! just couldn't hold it's own when compared to the SN-95 Mustang..And if history does indeed repeat itself ? The Mustang will once again, be the last car standing

That's a matter of opinion I suppose but the 93-97 Camaro looked incredible. I hated the 98+ Camaro, looked like a Sebring front end.

I've never been a big fan of the SN-95. Looks like a chicks car to me.

 

[red05bullitgt]

That's a matter of opinion I suppose but the 93-97 Camaro looked incredible. I hated the 98+ Camaro, looked like a Sebring front end.

I've never been a big fan of the SN-95. Looks like a chicks car to me.

No offense towards SN-95 owners, but personally ! I really wasn't much of a SN-95 fan either..I suppose the car just didn't have the appeal that I was expecting following the 14 year Fox generation, in which it replaced.. In fact before purchasing my 05 GT.. I owned 3 Fox bodied Stangs, in which my last one was a Black 93 SVT Cobra..Other than the first generation Mustangs, and the new S-197 ! my preference of choice, was the Fox body Gen.

 

[kooldawg6]

The '95 GT I owned was a White one, so it lacked all kinds of charachter(IMO). It's body lines were just to soft and the color made it soooo boring. The wife wanted it(auto/leather), so...at least it was the V8. 4 years later it got traded in on a '00 GT 5 speed(that time it was my choice as she had another car by then ) So I can agree that the first six years and the last 4 have been there best IMO

 

[Alternator]

2009MY will have a slight redesign (a la 94-98 & 99-04) and 2011MY will be a whole new style, according to everything I've seen. But it's all speculation.

That's just a mule, most likely testing a new powerplant (probably the Boss engine or a 3.5L TT). That is definitely not a spy shot for a whole new revision.

I do understanf that it's too early to tell and it's all speculation at this point, but no Mustang has had a two year run. How did you come up with this conclusion?

 

[red05bullitgt]

The original 2009MY re-fresh was pushed behind one year, in order to compete with the upcoming 2010 Camaro...Both the re-designed Mustang and Camaro, will go into production in mid 2009 during the 2010 model year ! As for the re-fresh itself is concerned ? it's more than just a slight restyle..In addition to the front and rear makeovers, the restyle also includes hips being added to the rear quarter panels, to give the car a more pronounced/aggressive stance, while the dash and interior will also be upgraded to look more 69-70 era. However the current S-197 greenhouse will remain unchanged and carry over..it's also my understanding their won't be an all new Mustang, until at least 2012-2015

 

[Mike97gt]

I don't care if they change the body at all. I am just interested in the BOSS debuting in the 09 mustang!!!!!!! Finally a motor with some bore size!

 

[ranger04]

The 05 stang struck a cord with young and old alike because of the retro styling. It's hard to mess with success, changing the car too much may take away from what ford has done with it. As long as they keep the retro theme going in some way they will be fine. Rear fender hips will even make it more like the 67, 68 stangs. When looking through FF&MM, I have to look twice to see if it's an old fastback or a new one and that what it needs to continue to be, "confusing", is it old or new, look twice to tell.

 

[stangdude2000]

LV51FER, not being biased, but you are one of the few people I have heard say the F-body had better styling than the Mustang. Even the 4th gen owners I know say they like the Mustang styling better, but aren't willing to sacrifice the power. I don't really think the styling of the F-bodies was a train wreck, but I also don't think it comes close to the Mustang.

The Mustang lived and the Camaro died because the Mustang has just always had a bigger following. Period. Take any non-enthusiast off the street and show them a 4th gen camaro/firebird. I'd be willing to wager that many would not know what kind of car it is. Now show them a Mustang, and I garuntee different results.

Ford does have the rental car fleet advatage however... There were very few rental Camaros compared to rental Mustangs.