351W/408 stroker swap into an 87 GT. Everyone welcome, teach me!
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408stroker5.0
The world would be a better place if all males jus
5.0 HOtrain
Founding Member
afr 205s would do fine on a 393 box stock no porting..the TFS R heads are also nice..but if your talken bout big heads and port work ect..it would be a waste to be able to get all that air in, and trust me..these strokers really suck the air...then not be able to get it out cause of the 2 1/2 exhaust..either way it will benifit to run 3 inch
keep in mind you can buy really good heads and have them ported out to the max but it not going to help much if the intake cant flow enough air to feed the heads what they want...so you need to have the intake ported also, IMHO if your looken for a street machine a 393 with box stock afr 205's OR TFS R's with the TFS intake and custom Ed cam will get you where you want to be, i would only suggest port work if your going to go all out and race it alot ect., but right now id only suggest some gasket matching for your app., ..but..its your ride
and a 306 is not a stroker..its just a 302 bored .30 over...you said before you desided on a 393..just stick with that....
and Ed Curtis IS FTI
and with a stroker id run a HV oil pump and deep sump pan(canton, etc.) ground clearence shouldnt be a problum, if your still worryed ask around for ppl with lowered cars and aftermarket pans
keep in mind you can buy really good heads and have them ported out to the max but it not going to help much if the intake cant flow enough air to feed the heads what they want...so you need to have the intake ported also, IMHO if your looken for a street machine a 393 with box stock afr 205's OR TFS R's with the TFS intake and custom Ed cam will get you where you want to be, i would only suggest port work if your going to go all out and race it alot ect., but right now id only suggest some gasket matching for your app., ..but..its your ride
and a 306 is not a stroker..its just a 302 bored .30 over...you said before you desided on a 393..just stick with that....
and Ed Curtis IS FTI
and with a stroker id run a HV oil pump and deep sump pan(canton, etc.) ground clearence shouldnt be a problum, if your still worryed ask around for ppl with lowered cars and aftermarket pans
Go 408.....
If your looking into forged kits look at the new Eagle internal balance kit, Brian sells these as well. These are much easier to get currently then the SCAT stuff that has been on backorder for a long time. I deal with Brian on a few different levels and he is a good guy.
My personal opinion is the TFS R although a decent head that will make good power (shown by Mike's numbers), but they need to be ported by someone very knowledgable about the head to get them to there potential. Out of the box the AFR's are hard to beat and on a big Windsor I go 205 min, maybe the 225 if it healthy. Both require special headers...
The larger bore also unshrouds the valves on the head in increase power, not sure if the 205 or 225 would clear a stock 4.0 bore motor. You'll need to use a fully dish or reverse dome piston to get the compression under 11:1 with a 58cc-60cc head.
I'd go 1.875" on the header, and 3" exhaust all the way out, don't choke the motor. If you are going to use Ed talk to him he will help you sort out your combo, he needs to know the entire combo to build the cam for you.
You do not need the HV pump unless the clearances are opened up to take full advantage of it, Melling has a nice adjustable pump out that has 25% more volume, standard pressure I use them. I like the DSS girdles, drop in unit that fits great....
If your looking into forged kits look at the new Eagle internal balance kit, Brian sells these as well. These are much easier to get currently then the SCAT stuff that has been on backorder for a long time. I deal with Brian on a few different levels and he is a good guy.
My personal opinion is the TFS R although a decent head that will make good power (shown by Mike's numbers), but they need to be ported by someone very knowledgable about the head to get them to there potential. Out of the box the AFR's are hard to beat and on a big Windsor I go 205 min, maybe the 225 if it healthy. Both require special headers...
The larger bore also unshrouds the valves on the head in increase power, not sure if the 205 or 225 would clear a stock 4.0 bore motor. You'll need to use a fully dish or reverse dome piston to get the compression under 11:1 with a 58cc-60cc head.
I'd go 1.875" on the header, and 3" exhaust all the way out, don't choke the motor. If you are going to use Ed talk to him he will help you sort out your combo, he needs to know the entire combo to build the cam for you.
You do not need the HV pump unless the clearances are opened up to take full advantage of it, Melling has a nice adjustable pump out that has 25% more volume, standard pressure I use them. I like the DSS girdles, drop in unit that fits great....
Hmm. Seems like everyone feels that 3" exhaust is the way to go. Where can I get shorty headers that are 1 3/4, and a full 3" exhaust? It kinda sucks that my whole exhaust is relatively new and I need to take it out. I still haven't really decided on the oil pan/pump issue. My rockers are pedistal mount I believe, so I don't know if I'd need different ones for the AFRs. If I were to get the AFRs ported, I'd probably get the intake ported too. I'm shooting for a decent compression, somewhere around 10.5-11:1, because I plan to stay N/A.
The AFR's out of the box will be fine really no reason to port them for what you want to accomplish, you will need new stud mount rockers for the heads.
AFM/Bassani is the only header I know off made for a 351W swap, 1.75" I have heard mixed things about they way they fit... I'd go 1.875" long tubes and a X-pipe....
Does this car need to pass emissons?
EDIT**** 1:08PM EST As far as I know the AFM/Bassani shorty is not made with the cross bolt pattern for the TFS R, the AFR has the standard 2" and 3" horizontal pattern.
AFM/Bassani is the only header I know off made for a 351W swap, 1.75" I have heard mixed things about they way they fit... I'd go 1.875" long tubes and a X-pipe....
Does this car need to pass emissons?
EDIT**** 1:08PM EST As far as I know the AFM/Bassani shorty is not made with the cross bolt pattern for the TFS R, the AFR has the standard 2" and 3" horizontal pattern.
Yeah, I figured as much. I don't really have a set power goal on this project, and I figure that porting the heads would help me get the most performance out of them. I know it would cost me alot of money to have them professionally worked, so it'll probably be one of those things that gets done if I can afford it. My exhaust is all new within the last year, and I know my P headers would get some decent $ on Ebay, but those have to go either way. My prochamber is in good shape, and I don't know if the 3" system is worth it. I really don't want LTs at all, I already have clearance issues.
5.0 HOtrain
Founding Member
My heads are UNported 
Summit sells hooker swap headers for a 351 w/"R" heads in a fox body, a little cheaper than going with kooks. I'm not biased to either head, just was impressed with what my motor made. As i've said many a time, EITHER head will rock with the right cam/induction/exhaust on a stroked windsor.
mike.
Summit sells hooker swap headers for a 351 w/"R" heads in a fox body, a little cheaper than going with kooks. I'm not biased to either head, just was impressed with what my motor made. As i've said many a time, EITHER head will rock with the right cam/induction/exhaust on a stroked windsor. mike.
5.0 HOtrain said:My heads are UNported
mike.
Mike from what I heard from many racers/builders the TFS-R can be a great head, but it needs to be ported by one of the few people who really understand how to make that head work. I forgot about those Hookers, but I guess it doesn't matter since he seems stuck on shorties...
5.0 HOtrain
Founding Member
Rick 91GT said:
From what I gather, TEA does a sweet cnc port job on the "R" heads. I will either sell them with the motor later on or buy a new set and send them out to TEA when I decide to build a 450+ dart based blown windsor
mike.
408stroker5.0
The world would be a better place if all males jus
Keep in mind guy's, BBK and even Mac make 351W swap header's as well for stock exhaust bolt pattern on the head's. I'm currently using 1 3/4 BBK's and have been fairly happy with them since the begining.
As for Shorty's astronut... I woudn't even think of using them on a big stroker.... Go with long tubes.
As for Shorty's astronut... I woudn't even think of using them on a big stroker.... Go with long tubes.
5.0 HOtrain
Founding Member
408stroker5.0
The world would be a better place if all males jus
5.0 HOtrain said:When are we going to see some #'s from that beast
Had the car booked in about a month ago to put it on the chassis dyno..... long story short... twisted and snapped the stock driveshaft
. Ever happen to you??Anyhow I got a FRPP Aluminum D/S on her now and needless to say I learned my lesson with the Stock driveshaft. I knew I was pushing it, but went with it any how.
Live & Learn.....Live & Learn.Anyhow As Soon as I got any kind of number's you'll be the first to know Mike! Hopefully before the Summer/Fall is over I'll have something.
I intended on getting the BBK 351 swap headers. I'm not big on MAC's individual flange design, they are a PITA to get back on the head. If I were to get 1 3/4 shorties and 3" Prochamber w/ 3" flowpath catback, how much could I really gain over the same combo in 2 1/2" form? Also, why go with LTs over a shorty setup? I know they offer a few more HP, but they sit low, and already my subframes and midpipe take a beating. I don't want to bash a $400 set of headers driving through the city.
astronut1885
It sounds like your combo is some time away. What I would do is try to think of what your goal will eventually be. It would make selecting parts a lot easier. Are you looking for a street set up or an all out race car? It sounds like a street set up to me, which is what I am in the process of building. I got a sweet deal on a 351w bored 40 over, recent Jasper rebuild. So for now, I'm just slapping a cam in this pig and some AFR 185's to go with my rockers, and I'm set. What HP/TQ goals do you want? On a street car I would want serious torque. Are emissions a factor? That will seriously limit H/C/I selection.
It sounds like your combo is some time away. What I would do is try to think of what your goal will eventually be. It would make selecting parts a lot easier. Are you looking for a street set up or an all out race car? It sounds like a street set up to me, which is what I am in the process of building. I got a sweet deal on a 351w bored 40 over, recent Jasper rebuild. So for now, I'm just slapping a cam in this pig and some AFR 185's to go with my rockers, and I'm set. What HP/TQ goals do you want? On a street car I would want serious torque. Are emissions a factor? That will seriously limit H/C/I selection.
Emissions aren't a big deal, my car "doesn't" pass now. I want a mean street contender with enough balls to run the strip. I'm shooting for over 500 RWHP/RWTQ, favoring torque where possible. I've already built my H/C/I 302, so I know what areas to look into, it's just the whole bigger displacement thing is new to me.
408stroker5.0
The world would be a better place if all males jus
Astronut.... check out my sig. Sound's like to me something you would be very happy with, and is something you could maybe go off of a bit. I'm running a Comp Hydraulic Roller 288HR .556/.575 lift just so you know. Unfortunatly I have no number's to back me up as this is a just broken in set up for me but estimated HP is around 550 Flywheel. It's a blast to drive on the street (very Streetable With a proper cooling system) and highway and as 5.0HOtrain(Mike) would say, "pleasently violent," when you hit the throttle. It's just basically your decision as to which type of induction you want to run (Carb, EFI).
In that case get some AFR 205's. AFR's quality is awesome. Pricy but wotrth it. The only thing that scares me off is the raised exhaust port location. I mean how much are talking here? Can a regular shorty header fit without modification? A lot of guys are running them though. That has to say something. Ed Curtis recommended them to me to. What intake are you looking into? I would go pretty big. T/B, MAF?
