Fox 500rwhp T5...grinding Sound When Hitting 2nd...

killer5.0

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Oct 8, 2009
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So 2x now when im shifting into second gear its made a grinding sound...its fully engaged etc and it hasnt slipped out or popped back out but something is up. I drove for a bit after both times and the rest of the day was fine but i also did lower rpm shifts from that point....i know the T5 is on borrowed time but i always thought 3rd was their main problem? That being said every other gear is fine for now....idk much abt transmissions at all so am i on borrowed time or an easy fix?
 
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MFE92

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If it's started happening suddenly, maybe the he cable sheath is collapsing, causing the cable not to fully pull the fork and fully release the clutch. Have a look where the cable meets the trans and see if the sheath is bulging.
 
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jrichker

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The noise was the stranglehold the T5 has on your wallet...


I don't know how you feel about the DYI thing when it comes to gears, some people don't like the idea of working on transmissions. If the DYI transmission fix idea isn't something that you would rather leave to someone else, here are some resources:

See http://www.ttcautomotive.com/lit_oem.php to download a FREE service manual for T5 or Tremec 3550/TKO

You will need the Adobe Acrobat viewer which is also a free download – http://get.adobe.com/reader/

See http://www.hanlonmotorsports.com/ or http://www.ddperformance.com for parts

A T5 rebuild kit with syncros, bearings and other small parts costs about $160-$200. It does not include any gears or shafts.

http://www.hanlonmotorsports.com/ also has a video on how to rebuild your T5 or Tremec. It costs about $20, and is worth every penny of it.

I did a Tremec 3550 rebuild, and it wasn't that difficult. The video was an immense help, and I would recommend viewing it. At $20, it will give you an opportunity to look and decide for yourself if you think that it is something you want to try to do.

Alternate sources for the T5 rebuild video...
https://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&aq=&oq=T%+rebuild+video&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4GGLS_enUS531US531&q=t-5+transmission+rebuild+video&gs_l=hp..1.0i22i10i30j0i22i30.0.0.0.9710...........0.Mz886XmDDt4

T5 Shim kits – best product I have seen in a while… http://www.5speeds.com/t5/shims.html
“The Peel ‘n Place T5 World Class shim kit makes shimming T5 counter gear and main drive gears very easy.”

For Tremec 3550 and TKO's:
You will also need a magnetic base and dial indicator to measure the endplay ($40-$120). http://www.mscdirect.com P/N 06444129 cost was approximately $57 + shipping as of Feb 2013


The tricky part is that you will need some shims to adjust the endplay in the two shafts: the new bearings will change the clearance. There is no way of telling what it will be until you get to the point that it is time to measure and check the clearances. Halon has the individual shims if you can wait for them. If you can't afford the wait, the auto parts store can sell you some shim stock and you can make your own, or have a machine shop make them for you. The shim stock comes in brass (easy to cut) and steel, in varying thicknesses. That's where the dial indicator & base come in - there is no way to get the clearance right without it.

Getting the car jacked up high enough to get the trans jack in and out from under the car was somewhat challenging. Since I didn't have a helper, getting the trans out of the car and back it was one of the more difficult things about the job. I built a trans jack out of 2x6's, some angle iron and a $25 floor jack. If I hadn't done that, I would have needed a helper or to rent a commercial trans jack. At 100+ pounds the Tremec 3550 was far too heavy for me to lift by myself.
 
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90sickfox

I didn't really have an issue with the stink...
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Sounds like your input shaft may need to be shimmed. Early sound of a rebuild in your future.

In my experience, the input shaft starts getting play in it....then the main cluster starts to walk a little....that leads to second gear chipping and space between the synchros.
 
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killer5.0

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Thanks guys for all the input and detailed answers...i guess ill start with the simple checks first and go from there...i know HP wise i need to upgrade and plan to but was hoping to at least finish out this season if it can hold up...im torn between a TKO and a T56 when i do upgrade...i know the T56 is like the cadillac of transmissions but ive read of fitment issues (tranny tunnel clearance etc) and it has the higher pricepoint. Ive read the tko is notchy which im fine with...but i really wish i could test both before i make a decision but thats not an option for me since i live in the middle of nowhere lol...
 

90sickfox

I didn't really have an issue with the stink...
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I got a quote if 7k for the t56 and all the swap stuff needed for a fox. I'm going t56 but it'll be a while down the road. The TKO600 is notchier than the TKO500. I've driven both and the 500 seems better on the street. The t56 is a lot better, but the 6th gear ratio .64 is about the same as my zspect5 .62. There is a .50 6th gear available for the t56 but most are .64.
 

killer5.0

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7k? Wow... I was hoping it would be closer to 5k (but so goes the custom car building experience lol) ..and i assume there is more to it than just simply bolting it in? Can a basic mechanic install these or do you really need/want a performance shop?
 

90sickfox

I didn't really have an issue with the stink...
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A basic decent mechanically inclined person can install the swap....here's the swap list I was quoted....
Screenshot_2017-10-08-01-05-44.png
Screenshot_2017-10-08-01-05-56.png


It is 5778...not 7k....smh. Might as well be 7k to me...smh
 

NIKwoaC

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I got a quote if 7k for the t56 and all the swap stuff needed for a fox. I'm going t56 but it'll be a while down the road. The TKO600 is notchier than the TKO500. I've driven both and the 500 seems better on the street. The t56 is a lot better, but the 6th gear ratio .64 is about the same as my zspect5 .62. There is a .50 6th gear available for the t56 but most are .64.
That's weird because the 500 and 600 are identical internally, the gearset is the only difference- all syncros and shift mechanisms are the same. There have been some revisions over the years and different builders have different tricks, so maybe that was the difference.
 

Gear grabber

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A basic decent mechanically inclined person can install the swap....here's the swap list I was quoted....
Screenshot_2017-10-08-01-05-44.png
Screenshot_2017-10-08-01-05-56.png


It is 5778...not 7k....smh. Might as well be 7k to me...smh
I didn't see a clutch on that list. A twin disc adds considerable.
 

FoxMustangLvr

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Mine cries every time I quickly shift into 2nd and 3rd gear at or above 4k rpms. I can't even downshift from 5th to 4th either. I'll eventually be going Astro but first I'll put in my good T5 and beat that one in to submission.
 
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Gear grabber

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I tortured myself for a few months,between the TKO 600 and the t-56.
By the time you buy a TKO,and do the needed mods,the cost is very close.
But the t-56 is a much stronger (and heavier) box. Since I could not afford to
do it once. The thought of breaking the 600, 6 months down the line swayed
me toward the t-56. My t-5 was so beat up,i could barely drive it the last month.
Best thing I ever did,lots of clutch and tire (twin disc/QTP's) shifts like butter.
 
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revhead347

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You either have a blocker ring that is not floating right, or has a few teeth ground down a little bit, or you have fork that is a little bent. The blocker ring is about $18, the fork is about $60. The fork is easy, if it's the blocker ring you better replace it before you grind down the teeth on the gear as well. None of that has anything to do with the power your are forcing through it, it's a product of normal wear....and possibly some missed shifts.

Well, let's go ahead and dispel some myths here. The TKO and T56 are built to the same technical specs (same gear length, same bearing diameter, etc). The TKO has a case that is cast a little too thin in the front, and sometimes cracks. A Swarr girdle fixes that.

https://www.google.com/search?q=Swarr+girdle&tbm=isch&source=iu&pf=m&ictx=1&fir=POd8EGBAh2-m2M%3A%2CaLt1WA_ZnY6OtM%2C_&usg=__eSMzo1tpR46yDVm_F8s4H-kjn5E=&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwidqeLx7eTWAhXCOyYKHaG-AH0Q9QEIKjAA#imgrc=POd8EGBAh2-m2M:

If you really want a 6 speed, it's better to go to the TR6060 (Magnum T56). It's a more advanced transmission; stronger and shifts smoother. Bob Hanlon (Hanlon Motorsports) has tricks and swap parts to get the cost down to around $4k. He even knows a guy that makes an electronic box to operate the reverse lockout.

Kurt
 

Mustang5L5

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provided it's not a clutch issue, it is a relatively easy fix. A blocker ring is cheap. If the dog teeth on the gears are rounded over, you can get new gear and slider for $150ish?

With that much HP, the most common failure mechanism is going to be snapping or shearing the input shaft, or shearing 3rd gear teeth under load. Short of that, I'd keep banging away on that T-5 and just swap out the worn 2nd gear parts.


As for a beefier T-5 setup, I see Astro sells their 485 ft-lb kit for $1300-1650. Sounds expensive, but given the cost of swapping in a different trans completely, it's pretty cheap considering. Plus you still have a light-weight T-5 under the car.

Their 575 tq kit is $2K.
 
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killer5.0

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How hard are these parts to change? Something a run of the mill mechanic can do? Or need a transmission specialist? All i have around here is basic mechanics for the most part...and any idea of how long? Just so i can get an idea of total cost ...would prob do this over the winter and drop the trans off...be a good time to crawl under the car and prep/paint the undercarriage (which sounds like so much fun i can hardly wait lol)
 

FoxMustangLvr

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How hard are these parts to change? Something a run of the mill mechanic can do? Or need a transmission specialist? All i have around here is basic mechanics for the most part...and any idea of how long? Just so i can get an idea of total cost ...would prob do this over the winter and drop the trans off...be a good time to crawl under the car and prep/paint the undercarriage (which sounds like so much fun i can hardly wait lol)
Here is a great video of a T5 tear down. It gets you a little dizzy from all the little parts in it. I have a spare T5 and I might take a stab at it one day.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9csOWX_olE
 
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Mustang5L5

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You can do it with handtools. It's not that complex of a trans and if you were to ever learn how to rebuild one, the T5 is the trans to do it on.


http://www.allfordmustangs.com/techarticles/t5rebuildmanual.pdf

Here's the rebuild manual take a look at it and see if you are up to it. As to a regular mechanic being able to do it? I'm not sure. Most mechanics these days would just install a completely new trans. You'd have to find an actual trans shop, bring them the t5 and see what they will charge you to install the parts.

I've rebuild a handful in my time. I think I did 6 of them including the one currently in my car. For my next engine setup, I really should put a stronger trans in.
 

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