94-04 calipers on 67-68
- Thread starter 67rcks
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I thought that was maybe a little too harsh, so I edited it out. So much for that idea!
brianj5600
Active Member
Not everybody is in it to make a buck. Opentracker is a prime example. Even after opening ORP, he still helps people build what he sells. There is a thread just a couple days old that proves his willingness to help a fellow enthusiast out. I don't have anything against someone that is not willing to give details out, but respectfully declining or not answering at all would be the professional thing to do IMO. I took time to measure out 99-04 brackets for a Granada spindle/rotor and don't care if it is copied by anyone. I never posted blueprints, but I believe all the measurements are on my Cardomain site.
No, have no idea how you came to that. Please do not ask any money for your time, effort and spending brain capacity for your post from this forum. Same nasagt, edbert and a few others. By the way none of you appears to have what I am looking for
edgars23
Member
Rusty67
Dirt-Old 20+Year Member
67rcks, I think you will end up with worse result then I did trying to get schematics, measurements, diagrams or pictures of what you want. It seems to me that you want something that no one has made. When I went looking for into on the T/A brake adaptor brackets it was like the information had been lost to time. Those were really popular and are vitrually impossible to find. Only one places sells repros and they charge a completely unfair amount for them.
Once I get my brackets made I'm going to post the CNC files up on this forum for everyone to use because I think anyone should be able to make brackets it they have access to the machines. I don't care how much time went into R&D, the cost to make these brackets simply CAN'T justify in my mind how much they charge. Anyways, if you get your brackets off the ground, maybe you should do the same.
Once I get my brackets made I'm going to post the CNC files up on this forum for everyone to use because I think anyone should be able to make brackets it they have access to the machines. I don't care how much time went into R&D, the cost to make these brackets simply CAN'T justify in my mind how much they charge. Anyways, if you get your brackets off the ground, maybe you should do the same.
ultrastang
Founding Member
I have been a member [one of the "Founding Members"] of this site since 2002. I'm quite certain there are members on this site, as well as several other Mustang sites I frequent, that will relate that I have answered many questions and provided a tremendous amount of help and information to them --well above and beyond the minimum they were asking for, and I did it without expecting a single solitary penny in return. I've also had numerous Mustang parts (some of which I had a good deal of my own money tied up in) that I just simply gave away --again, not expecting anything in return from them.
There are many things I will share freely with other Mustang enthusiasts, but to ask someone who sells Mustang parts/wares [to anyone that's interested in such parts], it's a bit presumptuious to ask someone to hand over their drawings.
Regardless of what you think a bracket design involves, someone had to take the time to gather the parts to be adapted, pay for them, spend the time to measure things, make the drawings, have the parts machined, pay for the machined parts/labor/and materials, assemble the components, and test them.
This is all time consuming, labor-intensive, and it takes money to develop and have parts manufactured for such conversions.
Mustangs are not my primary source of income. I have a full-time (day job). The Mustang business is a side-line thing. I would like for it to become my primary source of income, one day, but for now I have a vested interest protecting what I've produced on my own. --and, I'm not alone in this thinking. There are many other companies (some small, some big) that produce parts, and I'm sure if you asked them for their designs you would be turned down by them as well.
To my knowledge, I know of no one that has both the caliper AND rotor of an SN-95 Mustang on the spindle of a vintage model Mustang. If these are the components you are wanting to use, then it's likely you will have to gather these parts and try to make them work with the spindle you are wanting to install them on.
Sometimes ideas work and sometimes they don't. It's just the risk you take in trying to put the parts from one vehicle onto another vehicle they weren't originally designed for. I hope it works out for you, and good luck in your adaptive pursuit of these parts.
There are many things I will share freely with other Mustang enthusiasts, but to ask someone who sells Mustang parts/wares [to anyone that's interested in such parts], it's a bit presumptuious to ask someone to hand over their drawings.
Regardless of what you think a bracket design involves, someone had to take the time to gather the parts to be adapted, pay for them, spend the time to measure things, make the drawings, have the parts machined, pay for the machined parts/labor/and materials, assemble the components, and test them.
This is all time consuming, labor-intensive, and it takes money to develop and have parts manufactured for such conversions.
Mustangs are not my primary source of income. I have a full-time (day job). The Mustang business is a side-line thing. I would like for it to become my primary source of income, one day, but for now I have a vested interest protecting what I've produced on my own. --and, I'm not alone in this thinking. There are many other companies (some small, some big) that produce parts, and I'm sure if you asked them for their designs you would be turned down by them as well.
To my knowledge, I know of no one that has both the caliper AND rotor of an SN-95 Mustang on the spindle of a vintage model Mustang. If these are the components you are wanting to use, then it's likely you will have to gather these parts and try to make them work with the spindle you are wanting to install them on.
Sometimes ideas work and sometimes they don't. It's just the risk you take in trying to put the parts from one vehicle onto another vehicle they weren't originally designed for. I hope it works out for you, and good luck in your adaptive pursuit of these parts.
A well written and reasoned response, just what we have come to expect from your membership in our community...and by that I mean the one that is much larger than just this site. Many of us who have been in the hobby for ~25 years know you and respect your contributions. I just wanted to clarify one thing in your post....
I am not even close to being familiar with all the products that are available, but I bought a set of brackets that allow the use of SN95 ("Cobra" version) calipers and rotors onto a vintage spindle. So your statement probably needs to say stock SN95 V6/GT caliper/rotor combination.
LMan
Founding Member
Darn it, another intelligent post from Steve. How much you want for it? 
I have PBR (SN95) calipers on my vintage spindles (not SN95 rotors, though)....and no, you can't have the drawings. :SNSign:
I have PBR (SN95) calipers on my vintage spindles (not SN95 rotors, though)....and no, you can't have the drawings. :SNSign:
StangDreamin'
Founding Member
Un-effin'-believable. Steve has put himself out there; "pioneering" things on his own nickle and often on his own neck so the rest of us don't have to invest the time, labor, parts and machine work ourselves; and you want him to "give away" the fruits of his labor? Like he somehow owes all his efforts and investments to the rest of us???
Wow, a "progressive" (I hear that's the "PC" term for "bleeding-heart, you-all-owe me-everything Liberal" these days) in our midst.
Steve, before I invest my time and dime on some 71-73 drum spindles for my Coog; have you ever thought about working up some conversion brackets from the OEM disc brake spindles to the Cobra rotor/calipers? Maybe you should design some and then give me the prints, so I can con somebody else into machining them up for me.
I'd be ever so thankful!
EDIT: Seriously (for a moment), let me try to 'jack this thread into something useful....
May I ask how much (if any) difference there is in track width with going to the Cobra caliper/disc on the OEM drum spindle?
Wow, a "progressive" (I hear that's the "PC" term for "bleeding-heart, you-all-owe me-everything Liberal" these days) in our midst.
Steve, before I invest my time and dime on some 71-73 drum spindles for my Coog; have you ever thought about working up some conversion brackets from the OEM disc brake spindles to the Cobra rotor/calipers? Maybe you should design some and then give me the prints, so I can con somebody else into machining them up for me.
I'd be ever so thankful!
EDIT: Seriously (for a moment), let me try to 'jack this thread into something useful....
May I ask how much (if any) difference there is in track width with going to the Cobra caliper/disc on the OEM drum spindle?
Rusty67
Dirt-Old 20+Year Member
StangDreamin' for the love of God, please don't bring politics into this. For starters the labels applied to people by politics tend to be based on minute exposures to single opinions on one topic. They usually aren't acurate and don't allow for an explenation of beliefs. Also, there is nothing wrong with being a liberal or a conservative. Neither is bad/wrong/evil and both sides have good points. We could do with a little more ballance in this country.
I don't see why everyone is geting so down on this guy as the product he wants is supposedly not even made by anyone. Normally the worst thing that can happen to a person for asking for something is to get a no but everyone really seems hell bent on crucifying this guy for simply asking.
Keep it tech related, give him some ideas on how to develop the bracket or at least make a useful post. Otherwise just bit your fingers/tounge and say nothing.
I don't see why everyone is geting so down on this guy as the product he wants is supposedly not even made by anyone. Normally the worst thing that can happen to a person for asking for something is to get a no but everyone really seems hell bent on crucifying this guy for simply asking.
Keep it tech related, give him some ideas on how to develop the bracket or at least make a useful post. Otherwise just bit your fingers/tounge and say nothing.
brianj5600
Active Member
Maybe I read it wrong. I thought he was asking for plans from an individual who was willing to share from their personal experience. Something like this http://www.woodyg.com/fairlane/finfo/discs66.html http://www.woodyg.com/fairlane/finfo/brackets.html
StangDreamin'
Founding Member
Sorry if I offended; but it certainly sounded like the OP thought "it wasn't fair" that ultrastang didn't want to throw his design into the public domain; and it just rubbed me the wrong way at the end of a long day.
I will still stick up for Steve on this; he works his tail off on his own dime to design these conversions; and his name is out there for all to see - and he exposes himself to quite a bit of liability in these days of a lawyer "creating instant victims" around every corner.
For that last matter alone, I don't blame him for not wanting to put it out there in the public domain.
Picture this: I download and copy his plans; pick up some rusty 1/4" scrap-metal (Oops, not enough 1/4"; oh well there's some pretty good 3/16"!); CNC it (Oops! no CNC machine, just grab the gas-axe and a grinder.); and slap it on there!
When it breaks off when I'm trying to not run a redlight at 85MPH in a school zone; my attorneys (Takim, Fleesum and Ownem) will figure out a way to get past all the liability disclaimers and sue him for all my pain and suffering! Because I sure didn't have anything to do with it!
No way would I want that! That scenario will probably never happen; but you never know. When I decide to "up" the brakes on my Cougar; I won't be asking for free designs. I'll grab my wallet and get something built by a better engineer/machinist than I'll ever be, put it on following the instructions; and remember that it was my idea to put it on there!
EDIT: For the record; I know a guy on StangNet (and you do too) who put a Taurus R&P into his 69 'vert; and refuses to share anything about it at any price for fear of the liability issues.
brianj5600
Active Member
ultrastang
Founding Member
The OP didn't ask me (point-blank) for any of my (specific) bracket designs, but he did (generically, for anyone that would respond to him) say he was looking for drawings of BOTH front and rear setups dealing with the SN95 (base model/GT) disc brake components.
I don't think it's any secret that I designed the brackets I have for both the SN95 V6/GT & the Cobra rear disc setups (as well as my first bracket designs for the Mk VII rear disc swap) that I offer to anyone who cares to purchase said brackets.
If you are an individual who wants to make a set of adapter brackets to make a one-off conversion for your own vehicle, that's cool with me. If you are an individual who came up with a design for something, and you want to share the blueprints of how you did it, then that's fine too. But, if you are an individual who bought something from some company (be it a small company or a large one), and you pass the design/drawings on to someone else for them to copy, or you post the company's drawings/information on the web, then you are just as guilty of piracy as the person who actually uses the (stolen) information.
Stealing is stealing no matter how anyone tries to spin it or rationalize it.
The brackets I have don't look like anyone else's designs because no one else gave me any of the bracket designs I produced. I came up with the conversion parts I offer all on my own. --that was by me gathering the parts I intended to use, spend a lot of time measuring and fitting things up, having a prototype set of brackets made, paying for the prototype brackets, bolting everything on, and then testing them out to see if it was going to work.
I wasn't persecuting the OP (nor do I think anyone else was either), but I was a bit put off to realize they were simply wanting someone to hand over their bracket designs. This is a day and age where nobody wants to take responsiblity for their own actions, and people don't want to have to work towards earning anything. They simply want everything to be easy and handed to them for nothing. (instant gratification). Well, life ain't all about instant gratification.
Successes are built more on failures than from just straight success alone, and in this instance, if the OP wants the setup he's after, I'm afraid he will simply have to do what I (and others have done in similar situations) and that's put the time, expense and sweat equity into figuring out what he's wanting to accomplish himself.
I (personally) don't have the designs (for the front) of what he's after, but even if I did, I would have to respectfully decline extending to him what I had to figure out myself or what somone else had to go through to figure it out (assuming that the design came from someone that was selling the brackets to the general public for such a conversion).
--Steve
I don't think it's any secret that I designed the brackets I have for both the SN95 V6/GT & the Cobra rear disc setups (as well as my first bracket designs for the Mk VII rear disc swap) that I offer to anyone who cares to purchase said brackets.
If you are an individual who wants to make a set of adapter brackets to make a one-off conversion for your own vehicle, that's cool with me. If you are an individual who came up with a design for something, and you want to share the blueprints of how you did it, then that's fine too. But, if you are an individual who bought something from some company (be it a small company or a large one), and you pass the design/drawings on to someone else for them to copy, or you post the company's drawings/information on the web, then you are just as guilty of piracy as the person who actually uses the (stolen) information.
Stealing is stealing no matter how anyone tries to spin it or rationalize it.
The brackets I have don't look like anyone else's designs because no one else gave me any of the bracket designs I produced. I came up with the conversion parts I offer all on my own. --that was by me gathering the parts I intended to use, spend a lot of time measuring and fitting things up, having a prototype set of brackets made, paying for the prototype brackets, bolting everything on, and then testing them out to see if it was going to work.
I wasn't persecuting the OP (nor do I think anyone else was either), but I was a bit put off to realize they were simply wanting someone to hand over their bracket designs. This is a day and age where nobody wants to take responsiblity for their own actions, and people don't want to have to work towards earning anything. They simply want everything to be easy and handed to them for nothing. (instant gratification). Well, life ain't all about instant gratification.
Successes are built more on failures than from just straight success alone, and in this instance, if the OP wants the setup he's after, I'm afraid he will simply have to do what I (and others have done in similar situations) and that's put the time, expense and sweat equity into figuring out what he's wanting to accomplish himself.
I (personally) don't have the designs (for the front) of what he's after, but even if I did, I would have to respectfully decline extending to him what I had to figure out myself or what somone else had to go through to figure it out (assuming that the design came from someone that was selling the brackets to the general public for such a conversion).
--Steve
brianj5600
Active Member
Well put Steve. I agree 100% that copying stuff w/o consent is 100% wrong. Your fan club did some speaking for you that prompted my posts.
ultrastang
Founding Member
No harm done. Most anyone who truely knows me, on a personal level, knows I'm a pretty easy-going, laid-back person and that I'm not hard to get along with. I've been very free with my information --at least up to the point of what's reasonable.
I don't know if the poster was just looking for some individual's information in this setup, and hoping someone had done it and would respond? Or, if it was aimed at gathering information from some company's designs (if they existed)? Or, if it didn't matter to the poster where/who the information came from, as long as someone was willing to produce the information, regardless of its origins?
It's rude to ask someone how much money they make a year, and to me, from the perspective of producing brake conversion components for sale, you don't ask people for their designs.
I don't know if I have a "fan" base, but I think most people can identify that I've have shown more than a willingness to provide information, technical links and even so much as gone to the trouble of including links to photos I've taken to help illustrate the point of whatever it was I was talking about at the time.
I am not one of these Mustang vendors that is all-consumed by the money aspect, since as I said, this is not my primary job. I'm a common working grunt just like many of you that most often slides by paycheck-to-paycheck. I know what it is not to have the money to afford all the high tech, high dollar, gadgets you see in the Mustang magazines.
That was the premise behind what started my small business 6 years ago. I wanted to offer a means to help the average Mustanger/family guy to upgrade to a modern rear disc system without having to come up with the kind of money it would require to buy one of Baer or Wilwood's setups, and I would make a small amount of money to suppliment my income in the meantime. I think my bracket prices are more than fair, and for the people who elect to buy them, they get a nice setup over the drums they had, it doesn't break their bank account, take food away from their kids, and it helps keep the wife off their backs because they didn't have to spend a fortune to get it. That's pretty much a Win-Win situation for all concerned, and that's the main point in it all.
whether you know it or not Steve you do have a lot of "fans" in the mustang community. i should know i'm one of them , though i haven't purchased any of your brackets (yet) you are an inspiration to the guys like us who are either poor, or havethe ability to make our own stuff but don't have the tools or know where to begin and people like you and John (opentracker) willingly share so much information that it makes it easier for us to get a handle on what it is we're trying to do or make it attainable for us if we can't do it ourselves. for that i say thanks!!!!
, though i haven't purchased any of your brackets (yet) you are an inspiration to the guys like us who are either poor, or havethe ability to make our own stuff but don't have the tools or know where to begin and people like you and John (opentracker) willingly share so much information that it makes it easier for us to get a handle on what it is we're trying to do or make it attainable for us if we can't do it ourselves. for that i say thanks!!!!Similar threads
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