Kenne Bell 2.4L for 05 Mustang GT-Sick!!!
- Thread starter 99svtlightning
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Both Whipple and Kenne Bell are a good "twin screw" design, but personally I've had great luck with the KB on our Lightning, 03 Cobra, and 05 GT.
There are 9 second 03 Cobra's with a KB, haven't seen any Whipples pulling those times. IMO, you can work a KB blower hard and it doesn't give in.
As far as HP, I believe 425rwhp is the safety zone. I've seen 2v GT's live long happy lives with that kind of power. I'm pushing 475rwhp, but the car is not beat on and it's constantly datalogged and tweaked. Bascially we're working hard to build safe base tunes for both street cars and for those inclined to race. The plan is to build a block for more power, not because it's blown. We'll keep you informed.
There are 9 second 03 Cobra's with a KB, haven't seen any Whipples pulling those times. IMO, you can work a KB blower hard and it doesn't give in.
As far as HP, I believe 425rwhp is the safety zone. I've seen 2v GT's live long happy lives with that kind of power. I'm pushing 475rwhp, but the car is not beat on and it's constantly datalogged and tweaked. Bascially we're working hard to build safe base tunes for both street cars and for those inclined to race. The plan is to build a block for more power, not because it's blown. We'll keep you informed.
99svtlightning said:If you try to go crazy on the power, plan on saving for a block. Keep it setup like the manufacturer intended and your motor will live a long and happy life.
I'm sure you mean shortblock right? The only aftermarket block you can get is a Sean Hyland block and it's $4600. Keep it setup like the manufacturer intended? Would anyone be on this website if we wanted to "keep it setup like the manufacturer intended"? What fun would that be?
Briane
Built block, meaning stronger internals...sorry for not being more descriptive. We've all seen stock 4.6 aluminum blocks lay down 600+rwhp with ease. Heck, a lot of 03-04 Cobra owners switch over to aluminum blocks when building a motor for the weight savings.
I'm not trying to prove anything out here, it's already been done. The 4.6 2v internals are very similar to the 05 4.6 internals. Everyone know's the limitations and nothing is being proved. Saleen has done a very good job at that for us already.
When I stated "keeping it setup like the manufacturer intended", I mean the blower manufacturer. Keeping it like Ford intended would be dull.
I'm not trying to prove anything out here, it's already been done. The 4.6 2v internals are very similar to the 05 4.6 internals. Everyone know's the limitations and nothing is being proved. Saleen has done a very good job at that for us already.
When I stated "keeping it setup like the manufacturer intended", I mean the blower manufacturer. Keeping it like Ford intended would be dull.
It's a nice set up, but does anyone other than me wonder why the "kit" was equipped with such small injector for such a big blower? Hell, even a 1.7L moves more than enough air to run the 39lbers out past the ragged edge, so I wonder why they wouldn't have gone with a set of 50-55lb/hr or at the very least 42lb/hr injectors (which I would still consider too small) for such a deep breathing and capable unit like the 2.4L?
99svtlightning said:Centrifigals really require higher RPM's to make a good, strong curve. High RPMS kill stock blocks, tranny's and clutches. That's why Saleen and Roush offer Twin Screws or Root's blower's on stock block Mustangs. The Saleen S281 and Roush Stage 3 are factory cars with stock blocks that are warrantied by the dealer. If you try to go crazy on the power, plan on saving for a block. Keep it setup like the manufacturer intended and your motor will live a long and happy life.
um NO .. TORQUE more then anything kills clutchs and tranys..
rpm is only tough on the rotating assembly but in these cars its not rpm that is the week link its the rods and pistons ability to deal with any detonation ..
if you detonate with any blower on these cars your goign to get the dreaded 4.6 wrist pin knock.. there just is no safety margin..
and the STOCK BLOCK can take 500-600 slywheel horsepower all day if you put good rods and pistons in it.
and another thing i hate is people who got pre production kits that come here and hype them and they will not be available for the general public to buy for6-8 months and the kit will most likley not even be the same when it reaches us as far as the inlet pipeing etc.
1fastz,
Detonation issues can occur with any set-up and can be just as damaging with no forced induction as with. When you add aftermarket induction versus having it warranted with the vehicle purchase, it is the price you pay to play.
For those individuals waiting on a TS S/C it has been an ongoing issue with Lysholm Technologies and contractual issues with Whipple that had placed a crimp in the market for the T/S. I have been in contact with the CEO of Lysholm, Martin Stenback and VP Engineering for Saleen, Bill Tally. Lysholm has terminated their contractual obligation with Whipple and will be working with Saleen to continue providing the T/S S/C in North America. Supply hsould start getting better within a few months. Prices will indeed increase; however.
Contributions to this forum from individuals like 99SVT are always welcome. He has the ability to obtain and install a pre-production kit, I say more power to him. His contribution allows us to run the conceivable scenarios with the 3-V 4.6L. He came here to advise us of his set-up and performance numbers and it is appreciated.
I think you may need to develop a little more tolerence if you "hate people" for getting a pre-production kit and contributing positive information to this forum. (Not to mention his contribution was made months ago..
) 
Jennifer
Detonation issues can occur with any set-up and can be just as damaging with no forced induction as with. When you add aftermarket induction versus having it warranted with the vehicle purchase, it is the price you pay to play.
For those individuals waiting on a TS S/C it has been an ongoing issue with Lysholm Technologies and contractual issues with Whipple that had placed a crimp in the market for the T/S. I have been in contact with the CEO of Lysholm, Martin Stenback and VP Engineering for Saleen, Bill Tally. Lysholm has terminated their contractual obligation with Whipple and will be working with Saleen to continue providing the T/S S/C in North America. Supply hsould start getting better within a few months. Prices will indeed increase; however.
Contributions to this forum from individuals like 99SVT are always welcome. He has the ability to obtain and install a pre-production kit, I say more power to him. His contribution allows us to run the conceivable scenarios with the 3-V 4.6L. He came here to advise us of his set-up and performance numbers and it is appreciated.
I think you may need to develop a little more tolerence if you "hate people" for getting a pre-production kit and contributing positive information to this forum. (Not to mention his contribution was made months ago..
) Jennifer
blackonblack06
New Member
So if someone wants to get a supercharger...don't do it with the stock block? If someone did get a supercharger, it should have been with completely rebuilt motor, or a new motor period,tailored to fit the specifications of the SC being installed.
I have been thinking about getting a SC, but ANY route I go will not be covered by Ford. So,I will be S.O.L.if the engine detonated or whatever.
I appreciate everyones opinions/experiences with SuperChargers. I will just wait until someone designs a system that works, and warranties it.
Whats so good about a 500-600RWHP car if you can't use it to the potential it can give? If that's the case, it kind of negates the whole 500-600HP fiasco because 30 percent of it is unusable...!
Maybe I go with NOS instead...but then again it maybe can't handle that either?
I have been thinking about getting a SC, but ANY route I go will not be covered by Ford. So,I will be S.O.L.if the engine detonated or whatever.
I appreciate everyones opinions/experiences with SuperChargers. I will just wait until someone designs a system that works, and warranties it.
Whats so good about a 500-600RWHP car if you can't use it to the potential it can give? If that's the case, it kind of negates the whole 500-600HP fiasco because 30 percent of it is unusable...!
Maybe I go with NOS instead...but then again it maybe can't handle that either?
the stock engine will live a very long life at under 430 rwhp as long as you don't detonate it..
As for jens statement no naturaly aspirated it would take you being a total moron to hurt you engine from detonation as the cylinder preasures are far less then under a forced induction situation..
you would literaly have to stay in it while your engine was pinging like all hell for a decent amount of time.
Yes over time its going to hurt parts but it wil take some time with a naturaly aspirated engine.. it would take very audible detonation for a extended period to realy hurt something.
Where in a supercharged forced induction aplication the extra air and fuel present make for a much larger much more violent spike in cylinder preasure when you detonate.
.
Audible detonation is when the explosion hapens so early you can actualy HEAR the piston and the rod slaping against the wrist pin and the crank as the crank trys to force them through the stroke.
this is the tell tale sound of PINGING or rocks in a can that you can audibly hear
Inaudible detonation is milder and not possible to hear it happens when the explosion is hapening sooner then it should and the cylinder preasures are building to a dangerous amount at the very last second before the piston is going to be traveling down the bore and reliveing preasure..
but however the explosion did not happen so fast that the piston had not reached the top of the stroke before it got out of controll.. so there is no slap sound no " rocks in a can " sound.
In a naturaly aspirated combination inaudible detonation would require a rediculous efective compresion ratio to cause damage but in a forced induction situation it can still cause a high enough spike in cylinder preasure to damage things like the head gaskest and rings and wrist pin bearings etc.
As for jens statement no naturaly aspirated it would take you being a total moron to hurt you engine from detonation as the cylinder preasures are far less then under a forced induction situation..
you would literaly have to stay in it while your engine was pinging like all hell for a decent amount of time.
Yes over time its going to hurt parts but it wil take some time with a naturaly aspirated engine.. it would take very audible detonation for a extended period to realy hurt something.
Where in a supercharged forced induction aplication the extra air and fuel present make for a much larger much more violent spike in cylinder preasure when you detonate.
.
Audible detonation is when the explosion hapens so early you can actualy HEAR the piston and the rod slaping against the wrist pin and the crank as the crank trys to force them through the stroke.
this is the tell tale sound of PINGING or rocks in a can that you can audibly hear
Inaudible detonation is milder and not possible to hear it happens when the explosion is hapening sooner then it should and the cylinder preasures are building to a dangerous amount at the very last second before the piston is going to be traveling down the bore and reliveing preasure..
but however the explosion did not happen so fast that the piston had not reached the top of the stroke before it got out of controll.. so there is no slap sound no " rocks in a can " sound.
In a naturaly aspirated combination inaudible detonation would require a rediculous efective compresion ratio to cause damage but in a forced induction situation it can still cause a high enough spike in cylinder preasure to damage things like the head gaskest and rings and wrist pin bearings etc.
_jb_
New Member
1fastz said:
That's what I was thinking. Because when you lanuch, you are taking objects that are not currently moving, and making them move with a lot of force. At least when they are already moving, there won't be as much stress on it.
Duke4 said:
Jeff,
I responded to you via PM. Here is a link containing the content of the emails I have had with Martin Stenback at Lysholm and Bill Tally at Saleen. Whipple at this point is an enigma. Of the 3 companies involved in the legal proceedings, only Whipple ignored me.
http://forums.stangnet.com/showthread.php?t=602388
I can shoot their upper management another email and see if they will respond now that Lysholm and Saleen have repsonded to me once the court ordered gag order was lifted after 12/19/05.
Jennifer
For those who asked...here is the email I sent to Whipple's Technical department. We will see if we get any information back other than the standard public detail poop. With these types of correspondence, we can conclude that if there is no response within 15 days, there will be none. 
_______________________________________________
(E-Mail Content)
Good Morning,
I am a senior member and moderator for Stangnet, a large Mustang site with over 90,000 members. Many of the S197 Mustang owners are eager to obtain general additional information concerning your supercharger development now that Lysholm Technologies and Whipple Superchargers no longer have a business arrangement.
I have been in contact with Martin Stenbäck, CEO of Lysholm Technologies and Bill Tally, Vice President of Engineering for Saleen. Mr. Stenbäck deferred any detailed comment until after December 19, 2005, when the legal court ordered gag order concerning the legal proceedings was lifted. There are many consumers on the forum who feel that the Lysholm developed/engineered Twin Screw S/C is what provided the Whipple Charger with its fundamental integrity and are questioning the redesigned Whipple product.
I respectfully request any general information that you can provide as to the redesigned engineering of the Supercharger that Whipple is offering. In particular, the W140x that is used in the 05-06 3-v, 4.6L Ford Mustang.
Who is manufacturing and assembling the core compressor of the Twin Screw Supercharger?
Is the only role Ford Racing providing to the S/C kit is the calibration flash and program?
I want to thank you in advance for your attention and information. Again, there are many consumers on the forum who feel that Lysholm's contribution to the final product for distribution in North America was paramount to the success of the Twin Screw Supercharger. The recommendation from them to consider the Saleen Supercharger the best engineered product on the market for the S197 Mustang, leaves many of us considering Saleen for their future Supercharging needs.
Jennifer S. White
Senior Member and Moderator
Stangnet.com
S197 V-6 Technical
_______________________________________________
(E-Mail Content)
Good Morning,
I am a senior member and moderator for Stangnet, a large Mustang site with over 90,000 members. Many of the S197 Mustang owners are eager to obtain general additional information concerning your supercharger development now that Lysholm Technologies and Whipple Superchargers no longer have a business arrangement.
I have been in contact with Martin Stenbäck, CEO of Lysholm Technologies and Bill Tally, Vice President of Engineering for Saleen. Mr. Stenbäck deferred any detailed comment until after December 19, 2005, when the legal court ordered gag order concerning the legal proceedings was lifted. There are many consumers on the forum who feel that the Lysholm developed/engineered Twin Screw S/C is what provided the Whipple Charger with its fundamental integrity and are questioning the redesigned Whipple product.
I respectfully request any general information that you can provide as to the redesigned engineering of the Supercharger that Whipple is offering. In particular, the W140x that is used in the 05-06 3-v, 4.6L Ford Mustang.
Who is manufacturing and assembling the core compressor of the Twin Screw Supercharger?
Is the only role Ford Racing providing to the S/C kit is the calibration flash and program?
I want to thank you in advance for your attention and information. Again, there are many consumers on the forum who feel that Lysholm's contribution to the final product for distribution in North America was paramount to the success of the Twin Screw Supercharger. The recommendation from them to consider the Saleen Supercharger the best engineered product on the market for the S197 Mustang, leaves many of us considering Saleen for their future Supercharging needs.
Jennifer S. White
Senior Member and Moderator
Stangnet.com
S197 V-6 Technical
The Kenne Bell T/S kits for the 05-06 Mustang GT are now available!
http://www.kennebell.net
TS1000-05 $4599.00 [5-6 PSI KIT ('05-'06 4.6 GT) NON-INTERCOOLED]
TS1000-05-INT $5599.00 [8-13 PSI KIT ('05-'06 4.6 GT) INTERCOOLED]
TS1000-05-TUN $5199.00 [10-24 PSI KIT ('05-'06 4.6 GT) INTERCOOLED ("TUNER KIT")]
http://www.kennebell.net
TS1000-05 $4599.00 [5-6 PSI KIT ('05-'06 4.6 GT) NON-INTERCOOLED]
TS1000-05-INT $5599.00 [8-13 PSI KIT ('05-'06 4.6 GT) INTERCOOLED]
TS1000-05-TUN $5199.00 [10-24 PSI KIT ('05-'06 4.6 GT) INTERCOOLED ("TUNER KIT")]
300bhp/ton
New Member
looks good, but has the usual over optomistic headline dyno numbers. But I guess this is more due to them being produced on a Dynojet more than anything.
That's typical Kenne Bell Marketing for ya though. They always clear coat their advertising and make it a "creative writing assignment" to make things seem more interesting than they are. It's like the 1.7L kits being rated at 650hp. Sure it is.300bhp/ton said:
........maybe in a perfect world, but we weren't in a perfect world last time I checked? When was the last time you saw anyone with a 1.7L make much more than 500rwhp, even with all the bolt ons? Don't get me wrong, I like the Twin Screw blowers, but I'll never fall pray to the "creative" marketing strategies Kenne Bell often employs in order to push their products, like most have.Similar threads
