Mid-engine, AWD, foxbody with Ferrari chassis

JDSpeed

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Happy Friday Folks!

I'll shoot straight to it, as you can't post "AWD" and "Foxbody" in the same sentence and expect people to hold attention too long without pictures. But long in short I have been planning a build for a while as a I acquired a 02 Expedition and like the 5.4 platform. In the middle of the bag and tag process, figuring out the next move. I understand what it takes to make an AWD system and have followed @jeremythedestroyer's build (Hats off, exceptional) - but want to take it a different avenue.

Mounting engine in rear of the car to mimic the ford GT, mid-engine setup. To do this, I would need need a custom cross member which got me thinking. I have the rear crossmember of a 2013 Ferrari 458 that was removed due to body damaged from an old shop I worked at. Although some cosmetic damage, the mounting points and symmetry lines are square where necessary. Figured it'd be neat to build the 5.4 into the frame, then graft into a foxbody hatch. Maybe use the front diff in the expedition in the fox and run a Detroit TrueTrac? Since the crossmember is all aluminum and sound - thought I'd give this some more thought.

I dropped some tape across the member to give perspective. It's been a few years since i've had a fox and can't remember exact #'s. Included some pictures of the member. What are some initial obstacles ? I would like to run a T56... That Ford GT Ricardo 6spd is a bit pricey... Alot of questions. But figured I'd start with the basics in terms of the crossmember "will it fit?!"
 

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JDSpeed

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Don’t know how you will fit a 5.4 with a T56 behind it in front of the rear end. You’re going to have to get awfully creative on this one. Would love to see it done though.
I'm thinking it would have to be a transaxle setup, similar to the GT. T56 is a long shot, but want to have some sort of manual control. I have a 4R100 and its transfer case, but I'm trying to think as "linear" as possible.
 

General karthief

wonder how much it would cost to ship you a pair
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The cartoon picture in my mind shows there is no room for the engine and trans inline, it is going to be a trick just to use a transaxle setup and keep the drivers seat in the stock place.
 

CarMichael Angelo

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There was a guy on the FEP forum that attempted it. He got as far as he could go before reality bitch slapped him back to his senses.
He quickly found out that having a Windsor v8 engine attached to a ZF transaxle and all of that mounted behind him required that he move his seat so far forward that he couldn’t possibly sit comfortably.
He found out that he would have to stretch the distance behind the rear of the door to the front of the wheel opening..and the roof had to be stretched as well......and the wheel opening ,....and,..and,..and.........

Dude gets on the forum with a concept drawing that looks cool,..but the actual reality turns out to be a “ beyond dude” Skill level,..and it dies....

You need something bigger than a fox hatch to put a Windsor behind you ( unless you’re a lollipop kid) think...baby LTD wagon.
Add the width of a SOHC 5.4..and you’re gonna be hard pressed to make that fit into the space. Then you gotta deal with the heat, and the noise, and the danger involved with having belt driving pulleys.... ( that have been know to fly off when bearings fail ) right next to your head.

Bad idea.
 
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trebor3170

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I dunno, I remember an article in some car mag back in the late 80's, early 90's, ( car & driver, motor trend, hot rod, wth, I don't know), dude put a SBC and transaxle in the back seat of a Ford Fiesta. Had Corvette brakes, wheels and tires on all 4 corners. And, no, I wasn't smoking anything. Of course, that was pre www, so it's impossible to find, any info.
 

KRUISR

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... car mag back in the late 80's, early 90's, ( car & driver, motor trend, hot rod, wth, I don't know), dude put a SBC and transaxle in the back seat of a Ford Fiesta. Had Corvette brakes, wheels and tires on all 4 corners...
I think you are remembering the SHOgun (Jay Leno has one). It was the Fiesta with a 3.0L Taurus SHO V6 and manual transaxle mounted in the rear (transverse mounted). I think Jay's even had nitrous on it.

I remember reading back in the day of a couple of Fiero's that put a Cadillac Northstar V8 and transaxle in the back as well.




Back to original post... take some measurements of a Ford GT. What is distance from back of driver seat to centerline of rear axle. How does this compare with what is available in the Foxbody. Also what is center of axle to rear of engine bay. If these are not even close, as mentioned above major reconstruction will be required and could you really call it a Foxbody then.

You could try a transverse V8, say an 3.4L SHO or its bigger brother the Volvo 4.4L (XC90 I think).
 

revhead347

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To be honest, there are better ways to go all wheel drive. My RS has a drift mode, which has driven the insurance rates through the roof. Like, literally you can youtube it. A bunch of dumbasses putting their car in drift mode and crashing it. So there's one drive train platform capable of making around 550hp on pump gas that is showing up in the junk yards. There is also the new Fusion Sport with AWD. I want to get one of those two. It has the more capable 2.7L V6. You could make that fit. Not to mention all the AWD Audis, Subarus, etc.

Kurt
 

CarMichael Angelo

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This is the guy I’ve been talking about. The chassis work looks to be outstanding, he’s hit a wall with the sheet metal..hasn’t been heard from for a few years...
 

jeremythedestroyer

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There was a guy on the FEP forum that attempted it. He got as far as he could go before reality bitch slapped him back to his senses.
He quickly found out that having a Windsor v8 engine attached to a ZF transaxle and all of that mounted behind him required that he move his seat so far forward that he couldn’t possibly sit comfortably.
He found out that he would have to stretch the distance behind the rear of the door to the front of the wheel opening..and the roof had to be stretched as well......and the wheel opening ,....and,..and,..and.........

Dude gets on the forum with a concept drawing that looks cool,..but the actual reality turns out to be a “ beyond dude” Skill level,..and it dies....

You need something bigger than a fox hatch to put a Windsor behind you ( unless you’re a lollipop kid) think...baby LTD wagon.
Add the width of a SOHC 5.4..and you’re gonna be hard pressed to make that fit into the space. Then you gotta deal with the heat, and the noise, and the danger involved with having belt driving pulleys.... ( that have been know to fly off when bearings fail ) right next to your head.

Bad idea.
I had been wondering what happened to that car!

JDSpeed I don't think you can get by NOT using a transaxle. Maybe A Gallardo or 911 transaxle could fit with an adapter. It will get pricey but thats to be had with mid engine cars.
 

a91what

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I am currently working with a gent that has placed a 5.0HO engine in a fierro using a homemade adapter plate for the transaxle. So transaxle gets my vote, I think it can be done and if you wall off behind the front seats with a correctly it should be safe as well.
 
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