Super Snake...605hp and 12.5 quarter mile...WTF?

Discussion in '2005 - 2014 S-197 Mustang -General/Talk-' started by MikeysOTP, Oct 31, 2007.

  1. I don't know a lot about drag racing but I was thinking that my car with bolt-ons would be in the low 13s, possibly high 12s with some weight reduction and good conditions. How in the world does a GT500 run 12.8 and a Super Snake run 12.5. I understand that they have a heavier motor and are heavier in general but I still don't get it. I remember seeing here somewhere that someone runs 11.99s N/A in a GT. Is an additional 200+ horsepower really only going to get me half of a second if I spend 6k on a twin screw? Winter is almost here, the beater is coming out and I need to start planning.
  2. I'm right with you on this bro. However, Super Snake will run low 11's with bolt on suspension mods. Even though its a Shelby there will still be room for improvement. Engine mods will lower that number even more.
  3. It's because Ford & Shelby spend too much time upgrading the wrong parts. What's the REAL difference between 300 hp and 500 or 600 hp without upgrading the suspension significantly? The Shelby's are still too heavy, and traction is still an issue. But... hp sells right? People will more money than brains, and some serious compensation issues love to brag about their hp.. but.. I'm sure a properly tuned GT with bolt ons could spank a stock GT500. I'm not impressed by the Shelby's at all.
  4. Its all in the suspension and traction. First thing they can do is ditch those 20" wheels, and get some decent tires..... that alone would make a world of difference.
  5. I went to an informal 07 GT500 meeting with my 07 GT. We went for a drive through the twisties in the foothills as a group. 5 GT500's, an SVT Cobra, an 07 GT/CS, and my 07 GT. Leading the pack was 2 GT500's, followed by me, then the rest of the group. Once we were way outside civilization, the lead GT500's opened it up every chance they could and every time they did, my lowly GT (tuned & with 4.10's) stayed right on their tails. We were moving, but as these were twisties, we never went more than about 85-90 mph. On an open highway, the extra power of the GT500's would have left me behind, but in tighter quarters, the GT holds its own.

    On a similar note, over the summer I went drag racing frequently. I lined up once against a guy who was there often, as well, who has a 2006 Corvette Z06 (505hp). He had stock tires, but plenty of practice racing the car. I had drag radials, and plenty of practice. I took him off the line, beat him to the 330' and was side by side at the 1/8 mile (over 80 mph by then). Of course, once all that 505hp finally got going, he whooped me to the 1/4 mile stripe by nearly a full second and by 15+ mph.

    In summary, these big hp cars need lots of room to really shine. In the reality of shorter stoplight races or back roads, a lightly modded GT is more than a match.

    Now, as far as the 605hp SS running 12.5 and the GT500 running 12.8? You're looking at the wrong stat. Look at the trap speed at the end of the 1/4 mile. 115 to 120 mph proves that they have a huge reserve of hp. The worse than expected ET's prove that they don't hook up well when you try to launch. Proper suspension and traction and these are 11 second beasts.

    All the hp in the world is a waste if you can't get it to the ground.
  6. Don't be too concerned with initial stats. Evan Smith ran 12.5X with a bone stock right down to the air filter GT500. If we believed every initial test we've ever read in a Magazine, then we'd believe that an '03 Cobra was only able to run a 13.3 and will get it's tail handed to it by STi's, as tested by Hot Rod Magazine a few years back. :rolleyes:
  7. Sooooo......sounds like I haven't been putting enough thought into traction/suspension mods. Thanks for the info guys!
  8. Gearbanger nailed it. Its mostly the driver i'd bet. Once you see them in competent hands they'll turn good numbers.

    Suspension mods will help this car too. I bet it pulls like a monster at the top.
  9. With the power of the Super Snake, I bet it could trap easily in the 120s. Suspension/traction is the whole story. Without it you would have a beast of a burnout contest car capable of 180 MPH+. Evolution Performance has gotten their GT500 in the 9.40s with about 650RWHP. That shows us just what potential is in the Shelby's, but takes aftermarket massaging.
  10. I rode in a shelby GT500, they will run like a scolded dog, don't kid yourself about these cars not being fast, thel'll take your breath away. If the super snake came with slicks it would run in the 11's. As ststed, trcation is the problem, not power or weight. The torque will melt the stock tires. These cars are no laughing matter and are serious runners, set up just for the quarter and the numbers will be impressive to say the least.
  11. muscle mustangs and fast fords got a bone stock shelbyGT500 to run a 12.1! The driver mod is a big part in drag racing! Don't read car and driver or motortrend, they are idiots. And I am sure a supersnake would run at least mid elevens.
  12. Simple answer...someone can't drive the GT500 or the super snake.

    GT500 bone stock, should rip off 12.5-12.8 with a seasoned driver.

    Now, there are gt500's with less than 600 hp, running in the 11's. But this is also with the help of tires. I think once you get to the mid to low 12's with these cars..your fighting a traction issue.
  13. Thats because Ford & Shelby still market cars for the old school American personality. MORE POWER!!. I agree with you 100% what good is 600hp if your chassis can't plant it to the ground. Thats why a lot of foreign cars are fast they have chassis that put as much power to the ground as possible. What will you do with 600hp on the street when on a turn you'll spin out and take out a neighborhood. :D
  14. I'd say they had some severe traction issues
  15. Not to mention that C&D and MT hate domestics. I'm sure they sandbag a lot of these track tests when it comes to Fords.
  16. Shelby doesn't build his cars for the drag strip, his cup of tea is more in the line of trans am type racing. If the suspension and tires were set up for the strip, they would rip some numbers. As far as the road courses, yeah a vette may out ccorner it, but thats the curse of the pony car. The mustangs are in the camero, firebird, javilin and challenger class known as pony cars. To out corner a vette it would need a chassie like a vette, thats where the ford GT comes in or known as the GT-40 to us old timmers. The shelby mustangs, boss stangs and GT-40's won thier share of road races even against vettes and european sports cars. Even the 289 powered shelby GT 350's were awesome road racers. The mustang was designed to be a work car monday-friday and do well at the road course on saturday and win at the drag strip on saturday night. It does a great job of being all things to all people, but it can't be bullitproof at them all, but it pretty much is if you keep in in it's class of pony cars. The new shelby GT's may be better competetion for the vette's on the road course than the 500 as it has the lighter engine for better balance. I'm not an expert on the 500, I just know everyone seems to complain about the weight and I'm sure it maybe a little nose heavy, but also sure it would hold it's own in the pony car class. I haven't road raced one, but the one I road in was hell on wheels and seemed to handle verywell in the curves. The point being is the shelby 500 doesn't come from the factory as drag racing being it's primary task, set it up for the strip and you will have a straight line rocket.
  17. Problem is the GT is a flop too. Again with the WRONG engine. The GT would have been a better car with a 4.6L 4v with variable cams timing, 12:1 compression and a set of free flowing heads and match cams. Made same BHP and got better fuel mileage....or atleast better then 9mpg. Not to mention the lack of mid range torque would have made it better on the track around twisties.
  18. Wishful thinking.

    I'm right there with you but keep in mind the GT wasn't built just for racers. It was built as a consumer vehicle and made to SELL. Believe it or not, they had to keep the car marketable to the 45 year old mommy's as well as the 25 year old men ;) Sales are their #1 Priority and if that means keeping the car subdued then so be it. Remember your car BEFORE you got it tuned????? Ewwww! Right?

    The 3V is a great engine. The problem isn't the motor nor it's HP output. Aside from the Cobra and other special production Mustangs, the S197 GT is the first production Mustang to come out of the factory rated @ 300HP. The 3V responds extremely well to simple bolt-ons (see my sig as proof), much moreso than the New Edge or SN-95 models.

    The real problem is how heavy we are!!! :shrug:
  19. I don't see us having a problem, it's a stock 13 second car, 12 seconds with a few bolt ons, 11's with a pro-charger. Handles great stock handles awesome with a handleing package. I read in MM&FF where the new mustangs were tearing up road courses in Europe. Either people expect too much are just are never satisfied. These cars have a large enough back seat to haul passengers, have all kinds of options from power + heated seats to 1000 watt stereo's. They can be used as a dayly driver comuter vehicle to weekend racer. There big and heavy enough to afford you a bit of safty in an accident, all at a decent price. The mpg isn't bad either. I don't know how much more one can ask from these cars. I guess if you want them lighter, you can start ripping out the ac, ps, stereo and so on. The new mustang is winning all kinds of races all over the world plus take people and passengers to work everyday. I hear the shelby being knocked, but open up the mags and you see pitches of shelby's reaking havic on the tracks. This isn't a slam to anyone, but I think we some times just like to hear our selves complain. This is the best batch of mustangs ever to roll out of the factory and I would gladly take a shelby GT 500, shelby GT, mustang GT or V-6 pony car for that matter or any other varriant. Sure we could be lighter, but we would have to give up some things to be lighter and I like all my features that I have, at least were not heavier. I for one am not disappointed in this car in speed, handling, room or comfort. If I want it faster, I will buy the parts to make it so. If I never did anything to it, the thing is fast just the way it is. If you've ever riden in a shelby GT 500, you wouldn't be disappointed with them either. I think it's more jealousy cause we can't afford one.
  20. I agree with ranger. Sir, you have hit the nail on the head. :nice:

    We (as consumers) are rarely satisfied with what we have and are always looking for more and complaining about what there isn't, instead of focusing on what IS.

    ranger described in exceptional detail what it is. The intended end result as designed has reached Ford's goal, only time will tell if it has met the goal of those who own and drive them.