Which will have better street manners: E303 or F303 cam? Something else?

[mike93lx]

Please don't turn this into an off-the-shelf vs custom debate or a rant about how alphabet cams suck.

I have a few options:
back to stock cam
E303
F303
or another cam for <$200 that acheives the goals outlined below

I plan to turbo at some point, and i may go custom at that point, but I don't want to HAVE to change the cam if I don't want to. right now, my car sucks on the street. I want some low end torque back and I want the car a lot quieter. Squeezing all of the power out that is possible is not what I want.

How do the three compare in driveability? Will the F cam give me a bit more power with essentially the same drivability or will I make some big sacrifices?

Motor is out the car and I need to make a decision soon so I can drive it. Any help is much appreciated!

Thanks,
Mike

 

[NKau]

I'd say go with the E-cam

 

[thumper460]

The E303 is the best over the F303 ( for what you are asking) ! there are a NUMBER of turbo 450+ WHP on mild turbo/ ported GT40s and E303 camshaft!! just a thought!!

Just me..........................

Thumper

 

[enyawix]

The F303 cam is "THE" Turbo cam!

F303 cam all the way. Look around http://turbomustangs.com. You will see 80% of the forum mustangs run the F303 cam! I have 642hp at the crank. With what most would call crap parts "with no porting"! My engine is not in a car yet.

------------------------------------------------------------------
Twin T3 T4 T04E turbochargers .50 A/R Compressor, .63 A/R Turbine
Air to Water intercooler

351w: GT40x heads with 1.72 roller rocker arms, GT40 upper and lower intake, f303 roller cam, 75mm throttle body, 42lbs injectors @ 45lbs, Distributorless Ignition.

 

[thumper460]

LOL.. but I think he was looking for "Mild mannors"? With a twin turbo.. E303 and ported GT40s the "SUV" ( Fox Hatch) was in the mid 9 sec ET's and a good street car!! I was just showing the mild aspect of the E303!! the F will work also.. but then the Mild is gone!! Just a thought!!

Just me.............................

Thumper

 

[mike93lx]

enyawix, as I mentioned, power is not #1 here. I have driven this car a total of 3000 miles in 6 years and I want something comfortable to drive. the goal this year is 5000-7500 miles. time to put some miles on this money pit.

thumper and nkau, thanks. I think I am going to use an E cam. Maybe it will stay in when I turbo and maybe it'll come out, I'm not sure. But for now, I'll only be out $150-175.

I forgot to mention and I don't think it is in my sig...I have 1.6 RR's. Does that change the recommendation? I am certainly not switching out to 1.7's as well, for now.

 

[Foxfan88]

the E is pretty mild and wont give you much problem.
but it does have quite a bit of overlap which isnt ideal with forced induction, during excessive periods of overlap boost will go straight out the exhaust valve since it and the intake valve will be open at the same time.

the F cam is a little more agressive and has less overlap (reduced period of both valves being open) which is why it works well with forced induction, keeps the air in the cylinder and builds more combustion pressure.

the stock cam is 116* LSA
E has 108* IIRC
and the F has 114*

as far a drivability, the E will certainly drive well. but that doesnt mean the f wont, the F cam isnt really mild but its not really that big depending on how you look at it. with teh fuel injection and some tuning all the issues that come with a cam can be tuned out of it easily and the car will drive great.

 

[mike93lx]

hmm....i was always under the impression that the e cam was a decent forced induction cam.

i didn't mention that I still have the stock cam in a box in my basement. While it would make it definitely mild mannered, and form what I have read, a great turbo setup, will I be throwing away most, if not all, of the performance gains of my Twisted Wedge heads and Systemax intake?

thanks for all of the feedback guys, keep it coming

 

[earleys94gt]

The "E" cam has .498/.498 lift w/ 1.6 rockers, and seems to be a good all around cam.

The "F" cam has .512/.512 lift w/ 1.6 rockers. This cam might cause piston-to-valve clearance issues, but is a good supercharger cam.

For a future turbo project, I think the "E" cam since it will be "easier" to install.

Another cam to consider would be the Steeda 18.

 

[Fast63]

I have heard a lot that the E-303 is a good forced induction cam as well, but that doesn't mean the F-303 isn't.

I have never used the F-303 cam, but I have used the E-303 and the stocker, and I was in the same boat as you wondering if I should keep the E-303 and somehow try to pass smog with it in my carb'ed car, or if I should just put the stock back in. Let me tell you I am glad I put the stock back in because driveability is WAY better with the stock, and I personally don't think I lost any power because of it, but I need to hit the track and find out if my ET and mph have changed (I haven't changed anything to the car itself).

My setup consists of windsor jrs, performer intake, stock 600 carb, headers and exhaust, underdrive pullies, and different pistons for 10.13:1 compression. My engine definitely likes the stock better.

 

[enyawix]

the E is pretty mild and wont give you much problem.
but it does have quite a bit of overlap which isnt ideal with forced induction, during excessive periods of overlap boost will go straight out the exhaust valve since it and the intake valve will be open at the same time.

the F cam is a little more agressive and has less overlap (reduced period of both valves being open) which is why it works well with forced induction, keeps the air in the cylinder and builds more combustion pressure.



the stock cam is 116* LSA
E has 108* IIRC
and the F has 114*

as far a drivability, the E will certainly drive well. but that doesnt mean the f wont, the F cam isnt really mild but its not really that big depending on how you look at it. with teh fuel injection and some tuning all the issues that come with a cam can be tuned out of it easily and the car will drive great.

No one is realey talking turbo tech! You build a forced induction engine differently than an N/A engine. Foxfan88 is correct about the E cam. During the time of overlap The E cam will send your boost out the exhaust pipe. If you want "Mild mannors" use the stick cam. Because of overlap the stock cam will make more turbo power than the E cam. The stock cam and a rebuilt Caterpillar turbo can produce block splitting power. "600+ wheel hp"

 

[89streetbeast]

just like thumper said, go with the E cam. F cam is alright but in comparison the e over the f. e cam keeps the powerband thru the range, f falls off, atleast on desktop dyno it does

 

[enyawix]

just like thumper said, go with the E cam. F cam is alright but in comparison the e over the f. e cam keeps the powerband thru the range, f falls off, atleast on desktop dyno it does

If the engine was N/A you would be correct. N/A thinking will not work in turbo world.

 

[89streetbeast]

If the engine was N/A you would be correct. N/A thinking will not work in turbo world.

i like this lol. f cam has more duration which would help for top end which is where the turbo application would kick in "ie" after 7K rpm. e cam would be ok but fall on its face after 6500K. if longtube headers were in stake the powerband would be moved up 1k RPM. what i guessed was around a shorty design. thats where most people get there numbers of, a longtube will achieve 1k more rpm than a shorty in peak rpm band

since the OP has a 5 speed i'd run an e, if it was like a c4/c6 and 4000 stall run a f. , its up to you, run what you want.

 

[enyawix]

i like this lol. f cam has more duration which would help for top end which is where the turbo application would kick in "ie" after 7K rpm. e cam would be ok but fall on its face after 6500K. if longtube headers were in stake the powerband would be moved up 1k RPM. what i guessed was around a shorty design. thats where most people get there numbers of, a longtube will achieve 1k more rpm than a shorty in peak rpm band

since the OP has a 5 speed i'd run an e, if it was like a c4/c6 and 4000 stall run a f. , its up to you, run what you want.

I can see you do not and have not had a turbo. Duration is NOT the issue. The issue here is overlap. You need to do some home work. I make peak power at 5500! Long before 7K rpm and that is with 1.72 rocker arms making my cam BIGGER .550 IN and .550 EX.

"longtube headers" What are you thinking remote mounted turbos? He did not say anything about a STS style turbo system.

 

[89streetbeast]

Please don't turn this into an off-the-shelf vs custom debate or a rant about how alphabet cams suck.

I have a few options:
back to stock cam
E303
F303
or another cam for <$200 that acheives the goals outlined below

I plan to turbo at some point, and i may go custom at that point,?Thanks,
Mike

where did he say he was going to full blown turbo. from what i read he couldnt decide?.

 

[enyawix]

where did he say he was going to full blown turbo. from what i read he couldnt decide?.

In that case the E cam is fine. and the word is "couldn't" not couldnt lol

 

[mike93lx]

i will be doing a turbo in the next year or so, as I mentioned in the first post, that is why I am having this debate now.

Power after 6500 rpm? Doesn't matter to me. I want to put some miles on this car, so power off idle is what matters.

I think I'll probably slide the stocker back in for now and see how she feels. If it is WAY down on power, I'll deal with it then.

 

[Foxfan88]

dbl post sorry

 

[Foxfan88]

the stocker will have the best street manners. a stock cam will work well with a blower. but your limited to the lower powerband. you could retard the cam 4 degrees or something, that will move the powerband up a bit.

but if getting a different cam, i'm sticking to my guns and saying F, its an better forced induction cam the E will be. the only reason i see running the E cam for a blower/tubro is to inentionally kill off compression. a stock 5.0 is 9 to 1, adding 8-10PSI is like runnign 14 to1 compression, the E cam would bleed some off and kill some compression to keep things away from detonation, but the trade-off is you lose potentional power. PLUS screwing up o2 readings... which doesnt matter for stock o2s since pretty much any time your under boost your at WOT where the stock HEGOS dont have any input on calculating AFR anyway. but the bleeding off air could skew a wideband reading ( which everyone SHOULD have when running forced induction)

so like i said the stocker will drive the best obviously. the E-cam will drive good seeing how its so mild, but your leaving power on the table IMO, the E-cam is more at home on a mild N/A combo like ported e7s or gt-40 etc etc. its not a blower cam in my eyes and i have no idea why FRPP advertises it as one.

the f-cam would work well with a blower/turbo, its not BIG like some people say. it doesnt peak anywhere near 7k or any of that crap. most poeple may turn them 6k. in the world of cams, the F isnt very big. with the F-cam i'd expect a powerband from like 2800-5800 or something like that. sound too high?? advance the cam, bring the power down a bit.

the BEST option but quite a bit more expensive is a custom grind.... the bad thing about the FRPP cams is they are pretty old designs and arent a dual pattern camshaft. a blower/turbo car is going to need more duation on the exhaust side. your engine isnt going to have a problem getting air into the cylinder, but it doesnt quite have the same help getting it out. opening the exhaust valve a little longer will give the exhaust a chance to get out. this is even more important on a turbo car since your relying on getting alot of exhaust gas to spool up the turbo, its better to have all of it available to spool the turbo than to miss out on some.

anyways back on custom cam, give a custom cam grinder a call. they will be able to help you more than we can, they make cams for a living and are experts and they will probably be able to help you. they will be able to custom tailor a camshaft to your needs, that will have, performance, street manners and etc. who knows they may have a cam on the shelf that will match your needs perfectly.

hope this helps and good luck.