5.0 Swap into 1959 Edsel Villager Station Wagon

[jahcdp]

Hello Everyone, I am new to this forum and hope to get some pointers here to an issue that I am having with this swap. I have a 5.0 and wiring harness that we sourced from a 1987 Lincoln Continental. This was a running driving car before the swap. Now the car cranks and runs but when you try to drive it will just cut off when trying to drive. This will happen if we try to slowly accelerate or stab the pedal. Just cuts off sporadically. We have a new external fuel pump that comes on with the switch and is not controlled by the ECM. Tried another pump to be sure that this was not a pump issue. Fuel pressure on crank is 40 and run is 33 to 34. The below items have been changed out and confirmed to be working.

BTW - this is a speed sensing system.
New BAP sensor
New coil
Rebuild distributor with all new parts (was hoping it was a firing problem with the coil but no change)
New TPS (Voltage is set to .99)
Have a new IAC (This may be an issue because the engine will sometimes run funky when it is plugged in. At the moment the IAC is unplugged, and car idles fine)
Charging system has a new alternator and regulator and puts 14.1 volts back to the battery)

We initally had a computer issue that when you tried to start the engine it would never crank up. It would turn over but not start. You could shoot a little gas or starter fluid into the throttle body and it would crank and run. Thanks to this forum I found that this could possibly be a bad ECU. We sourced another ECU and the problem of turning over and not starting was fixed.

I know this is rather long but wanted everyone to have all the things I have tried. Hopefully someone will have an idea of what may be happening. Thanks in advance for any and all suggestions you may have!!

 

[AeroCoupe]

First thing is have you checked for codes? Second 0.99 volts on the TPS is a wives tale. Third the ECU has to control the fuel pump.

 

[Mustang5L5]

Continental is a speed density, batch fire car with the non-HO firing order. What ECU are you pairing with the Continental wiring harness?

ECU not controlling the pump may be an issue. Speed density ECUs dont monitor the pump however. All goes back to what ECU are you using?

 

[jahcdp]

This is a speed density car and is the reason for just having the fuel pump connected to the fuse panel to a key on fuse. I have checked the codes but will again and post them here. We are running a non-ho firing order. We had another ECU that we tried and the car ran poorly. After further checking we found that the ecu was a HO firing order. So then we sourced a non-ho ecu for the car. Still does the same as the original ecu. It will take me a couple of days to get the codes and I will post here. Thanks for the information,

 

[Mustang5L5]

A picture of the label will help. Like this.

Reason I ask is because there are sorts of ECU/wiring harness/Injector mismatches that occurred within the EEC-IV run and not having the right component pairing can cause issues.

When you are driving the car, are you able to monitor fuel pressure? It runs at 33-34, which is normal, but when you put a load on the engine does it rise up to 39-40psi?

 

[jahcdp]

A picture of the label will help. Like this.

Reason I ask is because there are sorts of ECU/wiring harness/Injector mismatches that occurred within the EEC-IV run and not having the right component pairing can cause issues.

When you are driving the car, are you able to monitor fuel pressure? It runs at 33-34, which is normal, but when you put a load on the engine does it rise up to 39-40psi?

Yes the fuel pressure does as it should 33-34 at normal running and increases to 39-40 under load. We put a pressure gage on it and placed where the passenger can read as your running down the road,. I will get a picture of the old ECU and the new ecu labels and post here.

 

[jahcdp]

Here is a pic of the ecu's. the one in the foreground is the original ECu and the one in the background is the one we are running now. We are in the process of pulling the codes now and will post them as soon as we get them. I did not wire up a CEL so having to do it with a test light.

 

[Mustang5L5]

DG1 is an '87 T-bird/cougar ECU. E7SF = 1987 thunderbird engineering part number. Did you source this ECU from the same donor vehicle?


WHat has me curious is this ECU says "SFI-SD1" which stands for "sequential fuel injection - Speed Density 1". This differs from batch-fire which is denoted by "EFI-SD#" on a label.

I'm wondering if you have a batch-fire vs sequential mismatch. Need to do a little digging however. But did the ECU, wiring harness and engine all come from the same '87 conti?


EDIT: Nevermind, i found a source that states that ECU is compatible with the '87 continental. So that likely rules this avenue out. Still doesn't rule out that the ECU is bad? Pretty much we assume any ECU from that era has leaking capacitors and should be checked. You can open it up and inspect it yourself.


Lets wait for codes here. Make sure you get the engine off and the engine running codes. I would also perform the cylinder balance test which is a primitive form of cylinder contribution detection these cars had to ID misfires.

In case you don't know how to perform it, it's pretty easy. You just stab the throttle to 3/4" open after the engine running codes are complete. It's in this video below around 10:30


View: https://youtu.be/Hwtm6avQMPc?si=R4yN94Xx-Cu7lutb&t=658

 

[jahcdp]

These are the codes I have so far which are engine off: 31, 67, 81, 82, ,84 85, 87. I wont be able to get the engine running codes until tomorrow. I really appreciate your help.

 

[jahcdp]

Mustang5l5, here are the new codes. I got a 23 and 28. I have a new TPS and IAC ordered and will be here Tuesday. When I do the KOER, the first time I plugged the wire up to do the engine running codes the car cut off. We started it back up and got the code 28. Then the light stays on solid. Tried it several times and get no codes, the light stays solid. What does that mean?

 

[General karthief]

If you need a specific members attention hit your @ then the members name, ie: @Mustang5L5 and they know you're addressing them.and respond.

 

[Mustang5L5]

Code 23: Throttle sensor out of range (with engine off) I believe this one will cause your solid CEL. The engine needs a valid TPS signal.


You should take some voltage readings on the TPS to see if you have the 5v between the orange and black wire. Then you should check to see if you have anywhere from 0.5-1.25V at idle and 3+volts at WOT on the green and black wire

28 is not a Mustang specific code. Probably something off the original Continental.

Code 28: Vane air temperature sensor or circuit


I'll admit i'm not familiar with this one because it's not something in the Mustang ECU logic, and unique to other 5.0 engines. Will need to do some more digging

 

[jahcdp]

Ok thanks so much

 

[jahcdp]

Ok we checked the TPS koeo. On the black and orange wires and there was 5.04v. On the black and green we had 1.03v. At WOT we had 4.54v. I thought all this was in range but like I said before (I thought they would be here today, but you know how shipping is these days), we have a new TPS and IAC that will be here tomorrow. Now I do need to add that the car has stopped cutting off when you accelerate. Don't know what changed that but now when you accelerate it wants to stutter. It doesn't cut off but stutters and doesn't take the pedal, hard to explain but it just won't get up and go. It stumbles but doesn't cut off. Am I right that the Continental came with 14 LB injectors. I am trying to figure out if the injectors we have are really correct. They have on them Ford Denso 3181089. They were sold to me a local parts store as the correct ones but now I am not sure. Any help is appreciated.

 

[jahcdp]

Let me make a small correction, The injectors are Ford Denso F87E-D2B, and they are 14.5 lb injectors. I'm almost sure that the injectors from the factory were 14.5lb injectors also. They were canned so we can't find them to confirm that!!

 

[Mustang5L5]

Try erasing the codes, drive it for a bit and rerunning them.

It’s possible it’s an old stored code. I didn’t see if you pulled it during KOEO or CM portion of the code pulling process