PATS...I think

[COramprat]

OK...

I disconnected the fuel pump and the fuse blew so I guess it's back to the PCM to see it that is where it is.

Is the Anti-theft tranciever in that circuit?

 

[steve_stang2003]

OK...

I disconnected the fuel pump and the fuse blew so I guess it's back to the PCM to see it that is where it is.

Is the Anti-theft tranciever in that circuit?

The transceiver is located in the steering column.
The wires get chaffed and will cause all kinds of problems.

FWIW shorts /broken wires usually occur where there is movement, like in the steering column.
You don't have a remote start do you?

Remote start units if not properly installed can wreak havoc with the PATS system.

 

[cjones]

here are the wiring diagrams for fuse 18. part 1 of 2 posts

 

[cjones]

here are the wiring diagrams for fuse 18. post 2 of 2.

the first image on the first post is a PDF file. start with that one.


edit: if you look at these you'll see pg3 has a 20 amp fuse for the PCM and pg4 has one for the Fuel pump. they are the same fuse circuit #37 Yellow

 

[COramprat]

I disconnected the CCRM and the fuse stayed hot and then connected it the fuse blew on the two modules I have then it is likely it is down line from the CCRM. I should be OK there. Am I reading that right? The CCRM is on the same circuit? Also since I still blew the fuse with the fuel pump disconnected so that rules it out.

I'll work on the PCM next as soon as I quit burping gasoline from my little episode yesterday...

 

[cjones]

the best way to check for a short is to unplug everything that uses the circuit.

then one by one reconnect them until the fuse blows, starting with the unit that the power has to go through first, then the next and so on. in this case connect the CCRM first and everything else disconnected. if the fuse blows in this case then the CCRM or the wiring after the CCRM to the other units are at fault. test the wiring with an ohm meter from CCRM connector to GROUND.

i think this is what you were asking, if not, let me know.

 

[chuck943]

If I read this right you are blowing Fuse 18 in Battery Junction box? or the EEC fuse? The EEC fuse
is the feed to all solenoids and valves in the EEC system that requires 12v. MAF,Injectors, Evap purge flow sensor,Evap canister purge valve, all O2 sensors, EGR vacuum regulator, and Trans range sensor if automatic.
I would suspect one of these are shorting and not the PCM. I would get a 20 amp ckt breaker to install in place of fuse and start unplugging them one at a time to see when short goes away or unplug all of these first and then start connecting them back one at a time to see which one shorts it. The ckt you are working on is the red wire to all these, but short could be the solenoids or valves themself and not necessarily the red wire.

 

[COramprat]

If I read this right you are blowing Fuse 18 in Battery Junction box? or the EEC fuse? The EEC fuse
is the feed to all solenoids and valves in the EEC system that requires 12v. MAF,Injectors, Evap purge flow sensor,Evap canister purge valve, all O2 sensors, EGR vacuum regulator, and Trans range sensor if automatic.
I would suspect one of these are shorting and not the PCM. I would get a 20 amp ckt breaker to install in place of fuse and start unplugging them one at a time to see when short goes away or unplug all of these first and then start connecting them back one at a time to see which one shorts it. The ckt you are working on is the red wire to all these, but short could be the solenoids or valves themself and not necessarily the red wire.

It's the EEC/Fuel pump fuse...the Maxi fuse in the fuse box under the hood. When I disconnected the CCRM and it didn't blow the fuse would that narrow down where the fault would lie?

 

[COramprat]

The transceiver is located in the steering column.
The wires get chaffed and will cause all kinds of problems.

FWIW shorts /broken wires usually occur where there is movement, like in the steering column.
You don't have a remote start do you?

Remote start units if not properly installed can wreak havoc with the PATS system.

No remote start but your suggestion about the circuits where there is movement makes sense.

So to synopse everything into one post...

1)I had a problem a few weeks back with my rad fan. I found that the connector was sort of loose...fan is about 6 months old...so I pulled it and stabilized the connector with tape and a tie wrap. (I'm thinking I may go back to that problem and replace the fan since it has been giving me problems anyway. Maybe that is a cause now but the fan fuse has held)

2)In the process of narrowing down my fan problem I bought a CCRM thinking that there was a bad fan relay there. Turns out that wasn't the problem but then I started getting the bucking, the bouncing off the rev limiter feeling, a few times. One or two of those where it completely shut down. I pulled the CCRM and looked as if the harness was loose. Reconnected it and everything seemed fine for a couple of weeks.

3)Went to the track Weds of last week...no issues but after work Sat I drove to a car show and it began the bucking again then shut down completely. The theft light blinked rapidly then later I noticed it went into a pattern of 1 flash and six. I found the blown EEC/fuel pump maxi fuse and replaced it. It fired up so I thought everything was OK. Next morning...same thing...fuse was blown. I pulled the computer to make sure everything was tight and no wear or tear on the connector/wires. After that the fuse blows as soon as the key is turned to the on position.

4)I pulled the CCRM and the fuse held. Reconnected it and the fuse blew. It also blew when the fuel pump was disconnected. I dropped the fuel tank (in the meantime dumped gas directly into my mouth when it leaked from the fill hole and left me spitting and sputtering for 30 minutes). Looked around the fuel pump and everything looks good there.

So the question...all of the components listed for the EEC could be a cause BUT if one of those is fused already then it would blow that fuse 1st correct? Like the fan fuse would blow before it took out the EEC fuse? If the fuse held when the CCRM was disconnected but blew once it was connected again could I assume that something downline for the CCRM could be the culprit?

 

[chuck943]

nope if its the eec fuse, that feeds the switch side of the EEC relay inside the CCRM. Then that feeds all the EEC solenoids/valves like I posted earlier. When you disconnected the CCRM you cut off the current to all of these items . Your search is only begining.

 

[COramprat]

nope if its the eec fuse, that feeds the switch side of the EEC relay inside the CCRM. Then that feeds all the EEC solenoids/valves like I posted earlier. When you disconnected the CCRM you cut off the current to all of these items . Your search is only begining.

Oh well...see post 29 if you didn't see it.

 

[chuck943]

Yeah I was replying to post 28. Let me make sure we are on same page you are talking about 20amp EEC fuse,middle one in top row of fuses(the row just below the relays)

 

[COramprat]

Yeah I was replying to post 28. Let me make sure we are on same page you are talking about 20amp EEC fuse,middle one in top row of fuses(the row just below the relays)

Yes...the 20amp fuse marked EEC here.

http://autorepair.about.com/library/illustrations/bl046a-lib.htm

Mine is a 96 but it is in the same position.

 

[01Steeda]

I know your a major do it yourself guy rick, but on somethign this much of a PITA you might wanna take it in. It is gonna take alot of time and aggrevation if you try to do it in your free time.

 

[cjones]

have you done what was said in post 26??

if not, then you're only guessing.

if the fuse held w/ the CCRM unplugged and blew w/ the CCRM plugged in then there is not a short in the wiring between the fuse and the CCRM. the CCRM may still be at fault. if the fuse blew with the FP disconnected then the FP most likely is not at fault.

 

[COramprat]

have you done what was said in post 26??

if not, then you're only guessing.

Not yet. My daughters graduation was this weekend and I've been doing all that goes with that.

if the fuse held w/ the CCRM unplugged and blew w/ the CCRM plugged in then there is not a short in the wiring between the fuse and the CCRM. the CCRM may still be at fault. if the fuse blew with the FP disconnected then the FP most likely is not at fault.

I have 2 CCRM's. My old one and one I bought used. The fuse blew with both of them so unless both are bad I'm guessing I can look further.

I'll have more time to work on it when I'm off again but with a few hours of light left tonight I may do something today.

 

[COramprat]

I know your a major do it yourself guy rick, but on somethign this much of a PITA you might wanna take it in. It is gonna take alot of time and aggrevation if you try to do it in your free time.

I know what you are saying Spike but I don't have the extra cash (or won't spend the extra cash) to have someone else do it so it's up to me. Really I hope to get it running again and I'm going to sell it. I'm just tired of one thing or another every week it seems. I know you know what I'm talking about there.

 

[COramprat]

Figures...

I picked up another set of jack stands since this thing is a pain for me to crawl under. Anyway on some advise to check for chaffed wires I found one of the O2 sensor bundles resting on the midpipe. I removed it but it didn't burn through but looking further up the wires where they connect to the harness for the O2 I see on of the wires has been chaffed where it was resting on the tray that the harness usually attaches. It was left dangling by the guy who did my tranny I guess (never ever going back again...too much crap I've had to go back over and fix after him). Anyway I taped it up with electrical tape and put my test fuse in. Held up when I turned the key and the theft light is back to normal...goes off after a few seconds instead of flashing. I replace the correct fuse and it is all good but I have the gas tank pulled so rather than put it all back I'm going to replace the fuel pump since I have it out then fire it up.

Thanks for all the help...I'll let you know if all is well once I get the fuel pump in.

 

[cjones]

glad she's up and running

 

[COramprat]

glad she's up and running

Well almost...I have to put the tank back in but I'm waiting for the fuel pump. Hopefully I'll have it up an running again after work Saturday