Epa Nazis

Discussion in '1974 - 1978 Mustang II Talk & Tech' started by 74ProII, Nov 13, 2005.


  1. Wart

    Wart I'm Mad as HELL and I'M not Gonna Take it ANYMORE! Founding Member

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    What I wonder is how many of you crying about our rights being removed by, of all things, restrictig our access to paint, are in favor of the patriot act.?
  2. Wart

    Wart I'm Mad as HELL and I'M not Gonna Take it ANYMORE! Founding Member

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    I'm compelled to agree.

    We aren't talking you basic enamel paints, todays coatings will kill. Depending on how their misused determins how long it takes for someone to die. Or suffer ill effects.

    And you have to wonder how many of your average homeowners, or even advanced homeowners, have a facility to contain overspray, outgasses or means of proper disposal of waste materials.

    I think many don't understand our impact on the enviroment is accumulative, it's all adding up.

    Before someone goes off labling me a tree hugger, I have no children, least their mothers have been wise enough not to bring them around me. This world ends one minute after I croke makes no difference to me, personally.

    However I do feel a responsibility to society as a whole to keep this planet viable for your children, and their children, and their children, and so on adnausium. Why should I get what I want and shyt on those who come after me? Even though getting 'mine' and shytting on everyone else does seem to be the way the world works doesn't mean I have to be that way.
  3. dmoody

    dmoody Founding Member

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    The death toll was actually 2.6 million Vietnamese. Thank God for the 7 million tons of bombs, napalm, agent orange, etc we dropped. I bet if the war had been fought in America instead of in Vietnam, the number of Americans killed would have went up drastically. I think we're a little spoiled... just imagine if somebody flew over your house and accidentally dropped a bunker buster?

    It is interesting that you should mention the TET Offensive which inflicted heavy losses on both sides and was seen as the turning point when we started loosing the war.

    d
  4. Blue Thunder

    Blue Thunder Active Member

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    We were attacked without warning, and held them off, and in fact, killed so many of them that they werent able to mount another large scale attack for 2 years.
    The media showed graphic images of the aftermath, and that's when people here really saw what was happening over there, and public support for the war dwindled.
  5. Wart

    Wart I'm Mad as HELL and I'M not Gonna Take it ANYMORE! Founding Member

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    Hey, U.S. forces .... we're going to attack on Tet ... Yeah, incase you don't know thats 30 Jan this year ... Pass it along.

    No shyt we were attacked without warning. Would you have warned the Germans a message about D-Day?

    D-Day and Tet were both turning points.


    Did we see pictures?

    I don't remember seeing many.

    It was more that Tet involved cities south of hte DMZ. That is, in U.S. occupied territory.

    After Tet all the North had to do was offer resistance. A game of attrition. There was no need for a major offensive, why would they expose themselves if they didn't need to.

    The French went through it, they tried warning us.

    Thunder, you should try learning a bit more about Vietnam than heresay, it's an interesting subject.
  6. Johan

    Johan Member

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    Too late.
  7. Wart

    Wart I'm Mad as HELL and I'M not Gonna Take it ANYMORE! Founding Member

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    Problem with labling someone a tree hugger is your just marking yourself as someone who doesn't give a damn who has to pay for your selfish acts , or how long they have to pay for it.

    And that makes those who lable others a lower form of life.
  8. Blue Thunder

    Blue Thunder Active Member

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    Well, hell, the stereotype "tree hugger" also seems to enjoy releasing child molestors and violent criminals back to the streets, (the conservative judges are almost always more strict than liberal judges) and they also seem to enjoy taking away the law-abiding citizens ability to defend themselves against such people by ****ing all over our Constitutional freedom and trying to ban legal firearms. It's the "tree huggers" who seem to enjoy supporting easy welfare for the lazy and to pay for it, they increase taxes or cut government services(like road maintainence) for those who work, and it's "tree huggers" who seem to enjoy enforcing affirmative action programs on employers, that in actuality, discriminate against all non-minorities and cause those receiving the rewards of such programs to become less competitive and less productive. It's the "tree huggers" who proclaim to admire and respect open mindedness, debate and free speech, all the while discriminating against anyone who speaks from an opposing mindset, personally insulting those of such opposite opinions, and often violently protesting against anyone who disagrees with them.

    So I'd say it's the stereotypical leftist "tree huggers" who are the lower forms of life.
  9. Blue Thunder

    Blue Thunder Active Member

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    History is a set of lies agreed upon.
  10. 74ProII

    74ProII Founding Member

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    WE always could get "ELF" to take over for the "IRA", they got a good start already.
  11. 74ProII

    74ProII Founding Member

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    Why know history, it is better to ignore it totally, and blame everything on the educated....dooooooog.

    "Ignorance is trainable, Stupidity is hereditary"
  12. Wart

    Wart I'm Mad as HELL and I'M not Gonna Take it ANYMORE! Founding Member

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    Your entire reply is soooo ..... Stereotypical.

    :rlaugh:
  13. Wart

    Wart I'm Mad as HELL and I'M not Gonna Take it ANYMORE! Founding Member

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    Been my observation Stupids on the increase.
  14. Wart

    Wart I'm Mad as HELL and I'M not Gonna Take it ANYMORE! Founding Member

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    That's a train of thought used by someone when they wish to discard facts.

    {edit} As an example, the French tried warning us off of Nam. This is a fact.

    You tried blaming the french for getting us involved in Nam. That's a fiction but you find someone to agree with you and by your thinking it will behistory. A history void of fact which makes it a ficticious history. But the fiction will continue as long as people continuing believing lies.

    I'm sure in 30 years or so, and possably sooner, your children will be saying how France and Germany got us involved in Iraq.

    Will they tell this lie from ignorance, because they were told an agreed upon lie, or because of brain damage due to their exposure to isocyanide laden paints and their waste?{/edit}
  15. Blue Thunder

    Blue Thunder Active Member

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    That's a train of thought used by everyone in the position of writing history. That is why Napoleon said it. Unless you were directly involved in the Vietnam conflict, or know someone who was, you can't be certain of what's fact and what's fiction. Lastly, "The french warned us not to go into Vietnam" you keep writing reminds me of a broken record. I actually read it the first time you posted it. The French had been directly involved in Vietnam's government for 100 years, so I'd say regardless of what they "warned us about", they're still responsible for what developed. Regardless, even though you repeatedly focus on the side comment of my main point, which was to state that our presence in Vietnam was a military victory and a political defeat. A kill ratio of at least 18:1 is a military loss?? Here's a simplified analogy for you; You're a kid, living in a rough neighborhood. Your friend has been arguing with some local punk and he gets in a fight, gets his ass beaten up by the punk. You don't like what this kid stands for, so you run up, and the kid punches you in the face and blackens your eye, then you get ****ed and break both his arms, his legs, his ribs, etc. You beat him so badly he's in the hospital for a month. Meanwhile, your mother says she can't stand the fact that you got a black eye, so she forces you to move away from the area, and after you leave, the punk gets out of the hospital, and he beats your friend so bad that your friend dies. So then the neighborhood starts saying.. that YOU lost the fight because the punk gave you a black eye and killed your friend? (That little part about you putting him in the hospital is forgotten, apparently) You are America, injured from the loss of 58,000 of your best, but healing and as strong as ever, your mother is the liberal media, protestors and politicians all rolled into one, the punk is North Vietnam, your friend is South Vietnam. How exactly is an ass beating like a very conservative 18:1 kill ratio considered a military defeat? Our allies lost, yes, because our politicians folded under the pressure exerted by the massive liberal movement of the times and the media influence. For the last time, as many retired generals have stated, Vietnam was a military victory, but a political defeat.

    * If the liberals had sprung up during the late 1930s, instead of the 1960s, we probably would have withdrawn from WWII after the first couple months, so I guess I count us fortunate that it happened later rather than sooner.
  16. Dano78

    Dano78 Founding Member

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    Wart... you're a leftist tree hugger?? :nonono:

    I'm gonna have to lean with Blue Thunder on this one. Dad was a Marine (3rd and 9th Marine Divs) and Gramps was in the AirForce. Dad served from '68-'70 stationed near Khe Sanh at LZ Stud (aka Vandegrift- in the Quang Tri Valley). He was there durring the NVA attack and almost takover on Khe Sanh in Jan '68. He views Vietnam in general as a military win from any standpont and plainly blames the politicians and the media for distroying the US efforts.
    Gramps was a hot shot NCOIC with the Ordnace Disposal unit stationed in Cam Ranh Bay.

    The Tet offensive was a BS call from the N. Vietnamese side. Here we had agreed on a 'cease fire' for their holiday and the bastids doubble back on their word and launch a full scale attack. You CANNOT compare this to D-Day. There was no 'cease fire' agreement on D-Day. Of course, this is war and really anything IS typically fair game. Thankfully we wern't flat on our backs and were still somewhat prepared for such an incident and they didn't inflict as many casualties as they were hoping.

    And no Wart, I don't support the Patriot Act. I believe it steps over the boundries that are already in place and I'm sure that the govt. can come up with better ways of protecting our country from crime/terrorism without it.
  17. Blue Thunder

    Blue Thunder Active Member

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    Sounds like you come from good family.
  18. Wart

    Wart I'm Mad as HELL and I'M not Gonna Take it ANYMORE! Founding Member

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    Define leftist tree hugger.

    I've read quite a few definitions written by those who must dump their used motor oil down the drain.



    Thank them for me.




    I guess we all have our own definition of winning.

    Mine doesn't include getting chased out of the country.



    Only that it was a turning point in the war.



    That makes you a Liberal child molester. According to some.

    :crazy:
  19. dmoody

    dmoody Founding Member

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    Amazing you should say that. FDR was one of my idols growing up. I loved the man for his resolve and steadfast dedication to the American people. By modern definitions he was perhaps one of the biggest liberals to ever inhabit the White House. Ever heard of the Civil Conservation Corps which built bridges, parks, etc, etc all across the country? What about when you go into a bank and you see that stamp saying the bank is insured by the federal government? What about minimum wage? What about balancing the budget during a war *and* a depression.. FDR done that. What about the whole concept of not attacking unless we're attacked (aka Pearl Harbor)? Do you think great presidents like FDR or Lincoln would have invaded Iraq? These presidents really cared about Americans not just the wealthy 10%, which never signup their sons and daughters to go to war, but all Americans. FDR and his wife, Eleanor, would walk outside the White House and actually feed the people camped out on the lawn during the Great Depression.

    Yeh, I've had members of my family serve in every major war. My uncle lost his mind in Vietnam and came back schizophrenic... does that validate my opinion any more or less? Can I tell you of the times when he thought he was right there back in the jungle yet he was in a wheel chair with one leg gone and a wasted mind living with my father? Would that make my point anymore valid? I know what happened in history, it isn't our kill ratio or some stupid point like that which history judges the victor. What wins a war is peace and prosperity for those involved. If democracy doesn't bring that to the people then it won't prevail no matter how many people we kill. We didn't succeed at providing that for the Vietnamese and we haven't succeeded at providing that for the Iraqis.

    d
  20. Wart

    Wart I'm Mad as HELL and I'M not Gonna Take it ANYMORE! Founding Member

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    d,

    Well said.

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