Why I'll wait for the SVT Mustang

Discussion in '2005 - 2014 S-197 Mustang -General/Talk-' started by tommyg, Jan 20, 2004.


  1. FinlayZJ

    FinlayZJ New Member

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    I'm betting the Cobra will be in the 45K range. Ford engineers stated they wanted to use the M3 as a car to aim for. Look at its price. They also said the Cobra is going to keep IRS b/c all other cars in that market have it, so it needs to be competitive.....Vette, M3, etc. The mystic droptop around here stickers for 43K in the showroom.
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  2. Knexo

    Knexo New Member

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    Something else that know one has thought about is" how good can you really make a solid axle". Back in 97 when the new vette came out a with "old technology" push rod engine when everyoe else was doing ohc vs ohv, they got alot aof bad press. Today GM has proven with the LS1 based engine that it one of the best engines today. We don't know how much time an research Ford has put into the solid axle. Working for DaimlerChrysler, I've learned that "Piece cost per vehicle" is much more important than "development and research cost". A couple million extra in r&d can be recouped in 1-2 years of sales. I very excited to see what they've done with it in the new car.
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  3. RICKS

    RICKS New Member

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    I concur in what others have said that the IRS, and other things, are on the "keep 'em interested" list of carrots to dangle in front of potential customers for subsequent model years. The live axle has to be there so that the Mustang retains it's muscle car heritage and reputation as a 1/4 miler, so that's what they decided to go with right off the bat. No point in taking risks to possibly attract a different kind of possibly more euro-centric customer, because they can bring in that fold of people a year or two later easy enough. I could easily envision the IRS moving in as an "option" on the GT, or Ford doing a Boss XXX (whatever displacement it may be) derivative that truly replicates the original Boss recipe as being a "strictly-business" corner carver with the addition of IRS, extra horsepower, and extra braking power, but tossing out alot of the creature comfort stuff to save weight and EXPENSE, thus coming in for not much more money than a regular GT. That would really fill that niche of customer who wants to stay in budget, but not compromise performance. The guy dreaming of a Cobra, but not made of money. That's really where the Boss 302 sat in 1969. Only $200 more expensive (base price vs. base price) than the Mach 1, but heavier on the overall performance, light on the "cushy" options. I see that as being entirely feasible, and of course, for those who could afford it, Ford may allow customers to "option-up" their Boss if they so desire. In '69, you could get a Deluxe interior, folddown seat, rimblow wheel, console, intermittant wipers, etc.etc... on a Boss 302. But the basic Boss was affordable. So let's roll that recipe into the 21st century and ponder on whether a $25K bare-bones cheap-o interior road-course-ripping Boss would be a popular alternative to the GT, and of course offer a "premium" option package for those of us who don't mind spending the extra dough to get that same model, but all whistle & bell'd out as well (including the big-dog stereo, which I would have to have, screw you "purists", I've got to have my groove-on while I'm swinging the tail out in a high-speed s-curve) for around $30-32K.
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  4. Sir Hacksalot

    Sir Hacksalot Founding Member

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    You know, I read all the ****ing and moaning about a lack of IRS on the stang, and I just don't get it.

    From a performance aspect...almost every serious race mustang I see has a live axle in it. Bob Cosby yanked the IRS from his Cobra because he was breaking half shafts, some crippled lady in a 5.0/Superfords magazine went to a live axle in her road race cobra because, and I quote "we found the live axle to be more predictable".

    I think most of you people don't know what the F*** you are talking about, and are just saying chit to make yourselves sound important.

    I read that gripe, and all the other gripes about the new 2005 mustang, and I want to throw up in my hands and rub it in my hair. The 2005 mustang is THE best looking mustang I have ever seen. PERIOD. It has the styling of the old school stangs, the engineering of the Lincoln LS, and will remain a good bang for the buck. This car has excited me so much, that any plans I had for my 1993 notch have been put on hold for the time being. You ****ers should also be grateful that the 2005 mustang is here...PERIOD, and did not go the route of the Firebird or Camaro.

    Sir Hacksalot
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  5. SN95_XB331

    SN95_XB331 New Member

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    Solid axle==cheap & very high strength. An IRS is not gonna beat it in that dept.

    I'm pretty confident the aftermarket will push the newer solid axle design to a level we've never seen. Imagine a solid axle stang with a longer wheel base, better weight distribution, wider track--hmmm... sounds like the old Y2KR (and that really handled!!!) And considering it's got the features we've complained about for years missing in the SN95 platform, I think the issue of keeping up w/the "canyon carvers" becomes history. So there's a lot of potential for solid axle handling. I think those looking for "the luxury" (ride quality, smoothness, no drama in handling, STATUS), the IRS is gonna be the ticket. As for performance, I see only a slight advantage eventually w/ the IRS (as long as there's an aftermarket :) ). For example, my WRX only feels better in the bumps, and about the same as my "bullitized GT" on the straights. It has the same skidpad #'s as the current Cobra, BUT if you start modding that suspension, it *will* end up feeling like any lowered stang (very firm!). And up the turbo boost? Say good bye to snow/rain traction, etc... (ok, dry traction is....excellent!) So in the end, we're all in the same boat.

    Also, since the aftermarket can make the current stang ride as good as an IRS car on the open track (i.e. only problem on the street is the bumps/bump steer!), any problems with the new design can be addressed with the long-standing knowledge/experience from the Fox/SN95 platforms.

    No matter what's your favor (solid v. IRS), we all still try to go in a straight line as fast as possible. Choose your weapons wisely :)
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  6. Bob Cosby

    Bob Cosby Founding Member

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    Just to clarify...I never broke a halfshaft. I only went to the track twice with the stock IRS, both times with a 100% bone stock car. However, the live axle swap was the first mod I did (even before a K&N filter), and I had it planned before I ever even got the car. :)
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  7. 95ripper

    95ripper New Member

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    I am not complaining, the new live axle set up looks way better than the current, in fact I may look at doing something similar to what they have done with my 95, I have the triangulated 4 link. There is going to be a night and day difference between the '04 live axle and the '05. I am glad they did the research and came out with a live axle. I am just saying that in cornering and correct irs will be better than a live axle. Some people will disagree with me, but the key is a correct IRS. the irs's in the previous cobras were a decent design, but not an optimal, with a clean sheet like the new mustang, it sounds like they designed the car it self to run both very well without too many compromises to either. Just by design an IRS will corner better, not only do you get independent movement which will keep tires flat to the road during bumps, you can tune in camber changes during suspension movement which will give better grip in turns, and lastly you get less unsprung weight.

    I am in no way complaining about the new 'stang, I have already been to the detroit show to see it, and I will be going to the chicago auto show to see it, I love it, and I can't wait to see it. I am actually supporting ford in not putting the IRS in it at first, I think it was a smart move for the, there is a strong base of people who only want the live axle, drag racers, and I hope they offer the IRS in a car comparably priced to a gt with it for the road racers. I see a good use and need for both, especially if the live axle setup handles as well as it looks, I think it will be a great rear end. I am extrememly excited about the new stang and only see pluses about the entire design, cosmetic and mechanical.
    #47
  8. Sir Hacksalot

    Sir Hacksalot Founding Member

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    Bob, you are as sick as I am. It's nice to know that I am not the only person that looked at the IRS and said, Hmmmm, that needs to go. :lol:

    Hax
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  9. Mach460

    Mach460 Founding Member

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    Oh well..one thing I have learned about Mustangers is they're never happy with their cars...otherwise the Mustang aftermarket would have died 10 years ago.

    Heck...I'lll bet you if there is a special edition with IRS on it and more power, the drag guys will complain as to why a special edition gets extra power but no live axle. Either way, I've made my opinions know and my hope is Ford realizes that despite what the straight liners may say, THERE IS a market out there for GT level Mustang with IRS and they at least offer it as an option.

    Until then, I've got two Mustangs to keep me happy, and being a huge rally fan, that Subaru WRX STi would make a fine addition to my collection.
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  10. 95ripper

    95ripper New Member

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    Well said, we all have different tastes, and want to do different things with our cars. That doesn't mean that anyone's ideas are wrong, just different.
    #50

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