Head Recommendation For An Unusual Cam

Discussion in '1965 - 1973 Classic Mustangs -General/Talk-' started by Braden65, Aug 1, 2014.


  1. Braden65

    Braden65 Member

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    1965 289 that we freshly rebuilt. Bored .40 over.
    Mild flat tappet cam I posted the cam spec sheet. Apparently its unusual specs.
    Edelbrock 600cfm carb
    Weiand stealth intake 8020
    Comp cams Roller rockers 1.6
    Stock heads as of now and stock exhaust. Stock straight 6 c4 auto and stock rearend plan on upgrading both in the future. Hopefully they make it there. I plan on upgrading exhaust after I save or do they need to be done at the same time so they match? Iv heard good things about the afrs 165 and 185 iv heard of 75-100 horsepower gain almost sounds too good to be true. but not sure which one I should get or if the afrs are right for my setup, maybe edelbrocks would be better being cheaper? My current stock heads are pulling studs so time to upgrade. Also will I have to worry about porting aftermarket heads? Or can I get them already port matched? Thanks. There's so much I don't know yet so I'm learning as I go.
     

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  2. 84Ttop

    84Ttop They make new pistons every day, so why worry? SN Certified Technician Mod Dude

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    Either the AFR 165 or TFS 170 cylinder heads will get my vote. You have a higher likely hood of the pistons hitting with the 185's. This would need to be checked either way however.
    Porting and port matching isn't something that you will need to be worried about with a setup like this. The AFR will be cnc ported already and the TFS has a "fast as cast" port that was designed from a ported cylinder head. With the mild cam that you have I highly doubt that you will see 75 or 100hp gain. I think that 50hp is much more realistic. The stock exhaust will be holding you back at this point and it's a great time to consider upgrading that as well.
     
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  3. Braden65

    Braden65 Member

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    If I decided to upgrade to a bigger cam down the line would I be restricted at all? The trick flows need bigger pistons if I decide to go over .550 lift but the afrs get valve float over 6,000 rpm with a hydraulic roller (I have flat tappet) so it seems both have slight drawbacks which may never affect me. But I'm sure the gains are worth it. Thanks for the information
     
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  4. 84Ttop

    84Ttop They make new pistons every day, so why worry? SN Certified Technician Mod Dude

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    You will always need to check PTV clearance when installing a new cam. With that being said, the "twisted" valve angle of the TFS head allows a 2.02 valve to fit with your stock pistons up to a certain point. I can't seeing you ever using a cam .550 lift or bigger unless you were strictly making this a drag car. As for the AFR's, valve springs can easily be changed down the line to accommodate higher operating rpms but the 165's will still remain only a 1.94 intake valve. In my opinion it is not advisable to run the stock engine block over 6,000rpms anyway. This would require the use of more and more specialized parts and put you farther and farther away from having good street manners. Either head will work well for you. If you do make a decision for one or the other, I would call the manufacture and get the part numbers directly from them. They will recommend specific spring pressures for your application with a hydraulic flat tappet cam. The difference in seat pressure can be 100lbs or more from hyd roller to hyd flat tappet. Choose a spring package with too much spring pressure and you can have premature wear on your hyd flat tappet cam. Also, and this apply to now, be sure to use an oil rich in zinc to help with the longevity of your engine.
     
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  5. Braden65

    Braden65 Member

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    You explained those very well! Thanks I guess ill just make a decision. Can't loose either way
     
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  6. rbohm

    rbohm Founding Member

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    with only .472 exhaust valve lift, and 214 degrees duration, you shouldnt have any PV clearance issues even with the 185 heads. the intake just doesnt have enough lift to be an issue even with a 2.02 intake valve.

    and by the way, the cam you selected isnt unusual, in fact there are many cam grinders that have similar grinds in their books.
     
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  7. barnett468

    barnett468 Active Member

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    hello


    the eddy street heads are ideal for your set up and much less than afr. eddy makes the heads below with two different valve options. you need to call eddy and ask them if the flow chart they list is for the small valve or the big valve. they claim it is for both which is impossible. if it is for the small valve you are in business, 2.02 intake is too big for your app. even if the smaller 1.90 heads flow up to 10% less than the chart they still flow way more than your stockers.

    are your pistons flat top or dished?

    what octane do you want to run? more compression means more power but requires 91 - 93 octane.

    either way you need to mill the eddy heads to 56 cc's otherwise your compression will be low.

    you can get by with stock exhaust, however it will not run nearly as well and might run a little warm

    with flat pistons, these heads, headers and your cam, intake and carb, you might have around 265 hp
     
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  8. Braden65

    Braden65 Member

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    What rpm range do you think it'll pull at?
     
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  9. Braden65

    Braden65 Member

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  10. barnett468

    barnett468 Active Member

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    hello;

    ok those are the 1.90 valves but summit has free shipping so compare final price.

    your dished pistons are killin you. you will have kinda low compression even after milling them to 56 cc's. you can mill them more but then you need to mill the intake to fit $180.00. or mill the intake surface on the heads.

    i think you are stuck with kinda low compression but the good thing is that you can likely run 87 octane.

    i would mill the block so the pistons are .003 - .005 below the deck but you need to subtract what you mill off the deck from what you can mill off the heads. around .036" is likely the most you can mill off the headst. and block combined before you have intake fitting probs.

    that cam will like 3.23 gears better than 3.00 or 2.80.
    .
     
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  11. Braden65

    Braden65 Member

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  12. Braden65

    Braden65 Member

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    How much difference horsepower wise do you think leaving them at 60 or 54 would do? Amazon is free shipping surprisingly . 3.80 gears are in the plans. High rpms on the highways shouldn't bother me too much
     
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  13. barnett468

    barnett468 Active Member

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    hello


    you should NOT leave them at .060"

    if you want to have low hp then just run the stock heads.

    factory heads are 54 cc on both flat top and low compression dish pistons
     
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  14. Braden65

    Braden65 Member

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    What do you think milling would cost?a rough estimate?
     
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  15. barnett468

    barnett468 Active Member

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    hello

    to mill the block it might be 120.00. the heads might be 40.00 each.
     
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  16. Braden65

    Braden65 Member

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    The car is all put together. I'd have to pull the engine right to mill it? Hoping they can mill while In the car. Happy thoughts. But 40 a head even 60 a head is reasonable
     
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  17. barnett468

    barnett468 Active Member

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    hello;

    they can not mill the block in the car so i think the best for you is to just mill the heads around .036" and leave it unless you want to mill the intake manifold also. kinda a bummer about the pistons being dished.
     
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  18. Braden65

    Braden65 Member

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    how much of a difference do you think they'll be from the afrs? i haven't seen an advertised power gain like i see plastered everywhere with the afrs.
     
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  19. barnett468

    barnett468 Active Member

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    hello;

    you are not understanding what they are saying.

    you will see no real gain with afr's. everything must match. if you put afr 205's on, it will barely tun because they are too big.

    small heads, small cam, small compression, small intake.

    or

    big heads, big cam, big compression, big intake.
     
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  20. Braden65

    Braden65 Member

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    Afr 165 have 60cc chambers same as the edelbrock. I'm genuinely curious why the edelbricks are 600 cheaper. Slightly less quality? Less research so are able to make them cheaper? Do they both put out comparable gains when used on the right applications?
     
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