HELP- Vibration after Throwoutbearing replacement

[95snoozer]

i didnt have the time or the place to drop the tranny so i limped the car down to a shop 2 miles away so they could replaced a siezed throwout bearing.

the squeeling came on all of a sudden a week ago and i imediately drove the car home using the clutch as little as possible.

car had no odd vibration when i took it in


now that it is back it acts like i have a poly urethane tranny mount.

the car has a faint shake that goes with the motor. this is NEW. they tried to tell me its the balancer... i needed to replace it anyways, i asked how would it have started shaking this bad only form yalls test drive after fixing the car? so i replaced it myself there... no vibration fix, of course! but i did find my timing marks were off which i had assumed since i could only get away with 12 degrees on the dyno while tuning.

So i am wondering what could caus ethis... i am not a clutch expert by any means. did they mess something up when bolting the cross member back up? they claimed they dindt touch the mounts at all. Is there something in the ch assembly/input shaft they could have done wrong to make it be off balance?

now the service manager is trying to say its the input shaft shich is BS because it had no vibration when i brought it in how could additional damage occured since it was fixed? it couldnt

the throwout bearing siezed all of a sudden, i hadnt been ignoring it or anything.

I am going to put it on a lift tomorrow and see if they messed anything up with the crossmemberor something

 

[slvrbullit302]

Did you mark the driveshaft and yoke and reinstall it with the marks lined back up? Just throwing out Ideas to ya.

 

[95snoozer]

thr vibration is in neutral as well so it has to be form tranny forward


i did not do the install myself, i was in class

 

[slvrbullit302]

Ah, then I have no clue unless your balancer has gone bad. Mine was fine, parked it one day and the next morning go uot and crank it and bad vibration. Somehow the balancer went out over night.

 

[95snoozer]

its new

 

[JJ95GTID]

It is possible that they pushed the pilot bearing (behind the flywheel) in. It holds the input shaft of the tranny. If the input shaft is not supported I could see how it would vibrate in gear or not in gear. You might be able to disconnect the clutch cable from the shift fork and see if you can move the input shaft to see if it is loose.

 

[KingDiamond]

It is possible that they pushed the pilot bearing (behind the flywheel) in. It holds the input shaft of the tranny. If the input shaft is not supported I could see how it would vibrate in gear or not in gear. You might be able to disconnect the clutch cable from the shift fork and see if you can move the input shaft to see if it is loose.

Doesn't the pilot bearing only go to a certain point in the crank? How could they push it in?

 

[Killercanary]

It is possible that they pushed the pilot bearing (behind the flywheel) in. It holds the input shaft of the tranny. If the input shaft is not supported I could see how it would vibrate in gear or not in gear. You might be able to disconnect the clutch cable from the shift fork and see if you can move the input shaft to see if it is loose.

That's the first thing that came to my mind. Snoozer, if there is any doubt that this is your problem, DO NOT DRIVE THE CAR. I bent my first input shaft in my T5 because I was young and dumb when I did my first install and I sucked the tranny in with the bolts, and in doing so I knocked out the pilot bearing, within a few days I developed one hell of a RPM based vibration, which ultimately resulted in a bent mainshaft as well. It was costly leason learned to say the least. I'd pull the trans and see if the pilot bearing is Ok. If it is... then I don't know. The flywheel only goes on one way (and I doubt they removed it), and the clutch sits on dowel pins so it shouldn't be out of whack and they shouldn't have touched that either. My guess is the pilot bearing is now gone or on its way out.

 

[Grn92LX]

Paul, can you explain how the flywheel only goes on one way? I pulled mine off last week while tearing down my motor and I didn't notice how it only went on one way?

This way I figure how to do it when the new motor gets here and I go to put my 28oz billet steel flywheel on. Did you use any loctite on the flywheel bolts? How much did you torque them to? I think I read 70-90 ft/lbs.

 

[Killercanary]

The bolt holes in the crank are not evenly spaced, even though at quick glance they appear to be. The holes are offset and the flywheel will only go on one way, this is to ensure you have the weight at the right spot on the crank. I always used loc-tite before, but I read somewhere that you should put thread sealant on the flywheel bolts since they go entirely through the crank and into the oil pan area. Putting thread sealant on them supposedly prevents oil from leaking past the threads and onto your clutch. Don't take my word for it, check with fidanza or someone with some specific knowledge to be sure. I torque mine to 85ftlbs.

 

[DarkMesa8]

The bolt holes are not exactly the same distance apart in the circular pattern, some are further than others. You will have to use a little arm strength and have the bolts near while you spin (slowly, the biotch is heavy) the flywheel around until you can thread all bolts.

Its idiot proof, you can't put it on wrong. (no offense!!!)

EDIT: Damn, killer, beat me by a few seconds!

 

[Grn92LX]

Thanks, that helps

 

[95CobraMike]

take it back to the shop and tell them to do it right....if they find something that THEY didnt do....they fix it for free

 

[95snoozer]

It is possible that they pushed the pilot bearing (behind the flywheel) in. It holds the input shaft of the tranny. If the input shaft is not supported I could see how it would vibrate in gear or not in gear. You might be able to disconnect the clutch cable from the shift fork and see if you can move the input shaft to see if it is loose.

how do you check to see if it is loose?
as in how do you move the shaft back and forwarth without pulling the tranny?

 

[95snoozer]

Also since i have already driven the car home, what damage do i look for on the input shaft that this would have caused already

they are going to try to blame it on the throwout bearing somehow i know, because they WILL.

 

[BBrinks]

Also, check your motor mounts. If they left the engine unsupported when they took out the trans, they could have stressed them a little.

 

[Scot_94GT]

That's the first thing that came to my mind. Snoozer, if there is any doubt that this is your problem, DO NOT DRIVE THE CAR. I bent my first input shaft in my T5 because I was young and dumb when I did my first install and I sucked the tranny in with the bolts, and in doing so I knocked out the pilot bearing, within a few days I developed one hell of a RPM based vibration, which ultimately resulted in a bent mainshaft as well. It was costly leason learned to say the least. I'd pull the trans and see if the pilot bearing is Ok. If it is... then I don't know. The flywheel only goes on one way (and I doubt they removed it), and the clutch sits on dowel pins so it shouldn't be out of whack and they shouldn't have touched that either. My guess is the pilot bearing is now gone or on its way out.

I'm in the middle of a clutch upgrade too...how do I NOT knock the pilot bearing out? I have a plastic clutch alighnment tool, so I should be able to get the clutch lined up prety close, but how do I know I am not knocking the pilot bearing out or place when I push the input shaft through the clutch disc?

 

[JJ95GTID]

I'm in the middle of a clutch upgrade too...how do I NOT knock the pilot bearing out? I have a plastic clutch alighnment tool, so I should be able to get the clutch lined up prety close, but how do I know I am not knocking the pilot bearing out or place when I push the input shaft through the clutch disc?

What you will run into is when trying to install the tranny it will not go in the last inch or so. This is because the fingers of the pressure plate are pressing against the throughout bearing. So, you need to hook up the clutch cable and have someone push in the clutch from inside the car. The tranny should slide right up to the bellhousing and then you can bolt it down.

Or what I did (Not suggested) is put all four bolts in evenly. I tightened them a 1/4 turn each until tight. It took a long @$$ time to do but it worked. I didn't find out the method above until after I had replaced my clutch. I got lucky.

 

[JJ95GTID]

how do you check to see if it is loose?
as in how do you move the shaft back and forwarth without pulling the tranny?

If it is vibrating then the input shaft is loose already. On second thought, moving the clutch fork won't tell you if the input shaft is loose cause it rides on the throughout bearing which slides on the steel input shaft retainer 'tube'. You're gonna have to pull the tranny or call up the shop that did the work and tell them "I think you guys may have pushed out the pilot bearing. Can you come and tow it to your shop? If I drive it anymore it may cause more damage that you will have to repair or replace my input shaft on my transmission." That will get them thinking .

 

[95snoozer]

or call up the shop that did the work and tell them "I think you guys may have pushed out the pilot bearing. Can you come and tow it to your shop? If I drive it anymore it may cause more damage that you will have to repair or replace my input shaft on my transmission." That will get them thinking .

OMG i did this and after an hour of fighting the guy finally told me that he would do it. he said if he puleld it and nothing was wrong i would have to pay, i told him no, there was nothing wrong with the car when i brought it in.

he went on to tell me that the motor was probably messed up, wtf? NO

he said there it was impossible to push the pilot bearing in, AND he kept calling it a pilot BUSHING, i kept correcting him and telling him that IS NOT what i said. I told him i understand its his place to play CYA, but his shop ***d it up, they are gonna have to replace it. he was very childish and ignorant and was cussing the whole time. this is the Owner of the shop

when he pulled the tranny there were left over ball bearings in the bell housing!!!! he is saying there might be some in the clutch. well probably!!! just 1 would throw it off balance.

they are saying i told them not to look at the clutch pressure plate or flywheel. WTF? why would i say that? they pulled the tranny and called me, i assumed they pulled the bell housing. I asked them if they had checked out the clutch because io had been worried about the condition of it since the bearing had gone out they said it was good and it would be ready in the afternoon

after a few hours of arguing the owner pulled the tranny and is redoing the job the way it should have originally be done

any ideas how i can keep them form putting a lean on my car for teh bill since i am NOT paying for them to do the job right the second time around?