T5 Crossmember...this is hard work...

[6Stang7]

This is generally poor logic Shaun. Essentially, I just disagree with your approach to making your own version. I have no problem with making your own version of anything, or even copying design ideas (especially if it saves money). But you stated that you "bought the one from M+, copied and drafted it, then returned it." This seems pretty cut and dry to me... you took their version and copied it. I can only assume that you "copied" the dimensions and design, which equates to "stealing" someone else's R&D to me. And it doesn't matter why you did it (i.e. you didn't have the tranny yet, it was easier, it saved time, etc.)... it is still stealing. And certainly, if it so "EXTREMLY easy to make", then why not just wait until you get the tranny and do the work then?

Now, if you did change the design, didn't use their exact dimensions, etc., then that is a different story. I'm all in favor of making your own version, inspired by, or even designed similarly to, another design. That is basically what I did with my AOD crossmember... I looked at several pictures of others' designs and then went and did the measurements and got it welded together. I think the fact that I put in the R&D to make it happen makes it mine, as opposed to "stealing" it from someone else.

I do think many of us overlook the value of these aftermarket companies that do the R&D for products for our Mustangs. Certainly, if someone hadn't made a version of the crossmembers I used for inspiration, then I know I would have felt more intimidated when attempting my own version. How many of us have used one of these companies' designs as inspiration or a model for some mod we did ourselves? I hate when I feel companies gouging customers (Mustangs Plus is notorious for this), but I do appreciate their work and efforts nonetheless.

I do see your point; however, I believe that what I did wasn't as bad. What I did was take measurements of were the mounting holes to the frame were, and then were the tranny mounting holes were in relation to that. I then, for the lack of a better saying, connected the dots. It's not like I got the actual CAD dawning from RMP and just copied and pasted it. I would have preferred to get the measurements myself, and design one, as that is truly what I enjoy the most. The only reason why I went this way is because I want to get my car back in drivable condition as fast as I can (for the most part, it's my daily drive). I only did this to save time so that when I did find a tranny I would be all ready to bolt it up and in. These reasons shouldn’t make what I did right; if you think what I did was wrong. I just hope it makes it more understandable.

-Shaun

 

[dodgestang]

I do see your point; however, I believe that what I did wasn't as bad. What I did was take measurements of were the mounting holes to the frame were, and then were the tranny mounting holes were in relation to that. I then, for the lack of a better saying, connected the dots. It's not like I got the actual CAD dawning from RMP and just copied and pasted it. I would have preferred to get the measurements myself, and design one, as that is truly what I enjoy the most. The only reason why I went this way is because I want to get my car back in drivable condition as fast as I can (for the most part, it's my daily drive). I only did this to save time so that when I did find a tranny I would be all ready to bolt it up and in. These reasons shouldn’t make what I did right; if you think what I did was wrong. I just hope it makes it more understandable.

-Shaun

Well I'm actually surprised it worked for you anyway. I bought a corss memeber for my AOD into a 65 FB install and ended up having to break it apart at the welds and re-weld the tranny plate at a different spot of the tub corss over bpeice cause it was made all wrong

 

[zookeeper]

This kind of right or wrong arguement is interesting. Is it right? No. Why? As was previously mentioned, everyone's doing it, so what's the harm? As Budda mentioned, whoever originally did the legwork, that is the prototype work for this worked hard to make sure it fit correctly because it's tough to do. He went the extra mile to ensure that whoever bought it would get a decent part at a fair price. Not so someone too lazy to do it themselves (say what you want, but that's exactly what it is) could "borrow" the part then bring it back after they copied it. Fabricators should be paid for their skills, because as some have found out, it's not always a walk in the park to build something. Try excercising some ethics and character the next time you want to get something for nothing. Mustangs Plus doesn't owe you anything, you got what you paid for, right? Then quit acting like spending a measley $2,000 gives you the right to shoplift stuff.

 

[gp001]

All I know is that if I see someone copy my 6 speed swap cross member I'm sending the monkeys over to rough em up

 

[StangBangRicers]

ttt

 

[6Stang7]

This kind of right or wrong arguement is interesting. Is it right? No. Why? As was previously mentioned, everyone's doing it, so what's the harm? As Budda mentioned, whoever originally did the legwork, that is the prototype work for this worked hard to make sure it fit correctly because it's tough to do. He went the extra mile to ensure that whoever bought it would get a decent part at a fair price. Not so someone too lazy to do it themselves (say what you want, but that's exactly what it is) could "borrow" the part then bring it back after they copied it. Fabricators should be paid for their skills, because as some have found out, it's not always a walk in the park to build something. Try excercising some ethics and character the next time you want to get something for nothing. Mustangs Plus doesn't owe you anything, you got what you paid for, right? Then quit acting like spending a measley $2,000 gives you the right to shoplift stuff.

How did I shop lift anything here? Did I cause a loss in profit to them? Who are you to call me lazy, you don't even know me. I never said M+ owned me anything. I just said that it's not logical to refuses service to a person who has spent thousands so far, and will spend thousands more; over a $130 part. Now, if they do it for ethical reasons, then that's another story. I wish I was as rich as you, and $2,000 was measly; but it is not for a full time college student, working part time as much as he can for only $7 an hour. You tell me to try exercising some ethics, so I will suggest that you find out what Thomas Hobbes means by "what the so called philosophers talk about." I am not saying anything about you per say, just that you enlighten yourself.

-Shaun

 

[6Stang7]

Well I'm actually surprised it worked for you anyway. I bought a corss memeber for my AOD into a 65 FB install and ended up having to break it apart at the welds and re-weld the tranny plate at a different spot of the tub corss over bpeice cause it was made all wrong

I donno if it will work or not, I haven't made it yet. I am assuming that it won't, and that I will have to moddify it to get it to fit correctly.

-Shaun

 

[Glen's 1965 5.0]

All I know is that if I see someone copy my 6 speed swap cross member I'm sending the monkeys over to rough em up

This I gotta watch!!

 

[3spd on floor]

*best 60's TV show voiceover*

will the monkeys remain faithful to the football? find out next time on "Stangnet's Behind the Cars, Ethics Speical"

 

[gp001]

The monkeys can get tough when they need to. Here is a pic of them hunting terrorists in 2001

 

[zookeeper]

How did I shop lift anything here? Did I cause a loss in profit to them? Who are you to call me lazy, you don't even know me. I never said M+ owned me anything. I just said that it's not logical to refuses service to a person who has spent thousands so far, and will spend thousands more; over a $130 part. Now, if they do it for ethical reasons, then that's another story. I wish I was as rich as you, and $2,000 was measly; but it is not for a full time college student, working part time as much as he can for only $7 an hour. You tell me to try exercising some ethics, so I will suggest that you find out what Thomas Hobbes means by "what the so called philosophers talk about." I am not saying anything about you per say, just that you enlighten yourself.

-Shaun

Ok, here it is as simply as I can put it: if you think what you did was OK, then I assume you were up front with the salesman when you bought the part right? You told him that while you had no intention to actually buy the thing, it sure would be nice if they could pay someone to box it up and ship it to you so that you could measure it, didn't you? Anytime you say something behind someone's back that you wouldn't say to their face, or act less than honestly, you compromise yourself. They don't teach that in any college course I've ever taken because honesty isn't too popular these days, it's all about the individual and the "what's in it for me" syndrome that's all too pervasive in our society. If you choose to do the right thing simply because you may get caught, you still aren't getting it. Honesty is doing the right thing even though nobody's watching. As far as me being rich, not quite. I've never made more than $43K in a year, and after making the house payment, car payment, insurance, medical bills and the like for my wife, three year old son and myself, there isn't a whole lot left. But you simply won't convince any business that you're a valuable customer simply because you spent $2K there. Ask anyone who employs people in a small business what they pay out in "unseen" bills like electric, rent, workers comp and insurance and you'll see why every dime counts and why I'm so adamant about doing the right thing when it comes to supporting the businesses who support our hobby.

 

[3spd on floor]

got some pics of mine...sorry its so dark, i'll try to get some better ones later if anyone wants them.

 

[DarkBuddha]

Looks good... pretty nice looking welds too. Now I'm envious. One day I'll get some time to get back to Tampa to do some more work...

 

[tekhausa]

So what did you end up doing about the parking brake?

 

[3spd on floor]

i honestly havent figured out the parking brake deal yet. I think i'm going to just cut the old attachment off and weld it to the new crossmember.

i would have done it already but i gave myself a hernia and havent been able to install the trans yet... and now i'm stuck back at school, so i probably wont be able to do much work on the car til spring break, maybe not til summer. living away from your mustang SUCKS.