Well this is it guys. besides some painting and windows, We're on the final mechanical stretch on this project: The A/C! For the r12 system, it states on the vehicle tag it takes 2Lbs 10ozs. I've got 8ozs of PAG 46, 7lbs of R134A just in case I find a bad seal with the UV Dye addictive, and the Conversion nipples. I've got access to a Manifold guage set, pump, and an empty r134a cylinder to capture the old R12. However, i have not been able to locate it yet. I've never done anything like this before. I've added to r134A systems that were low, thats about it. I have read that if you mix the mineral oil in r12 systems and PAG oil, it will create chlorine gas and eat away at the a/c lines.
1987 Ford Mustang 2.3L R12 to R134A conversion. Recommended way of draining old system and oil?
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If you have R12 in the system now, and it's holding pressure, why not just top it off? You can still get R12 on ebay and nobody is checking for the proper certificate. I've bought a lot of R12 this way even though i hold the right EPA cert for it.
R12 is going to give you a much colder system than with R134a. No need to change oil or flush it. I can manage 35-38 degree vent temps at idle on a hot day with my R12 system.
R12 is going to give you a much colder system than with R134a. No need to change oil or flush it. I can manage 35-38 degree vent temps at idle on a hot day with my R12 system.
This was something i was unaware of. I actually have no idea it's still holding pressure or not, I never checked it. Buuuuut if for the same price as R134A and a lot less work, i'll wait a week or two to get the real stuff. Does it take the same gauge attachment as the old R134A with the puncture?
I remember as a kid on hot summer days the A/C on the 1993 5.0 Convertible would be so cold that even on a 100 degree day with the top down, you'd have snowflakes coming out of the vents and start accumulating on bottom of each vent. Thats the kind of Cold i'm looking to achieve.
There are differences in the manifold set and R12 is still more expensive.
I would quickly depress a Schrader and see if you have pressure and then decide what to do.
I would quickly depress a Schrader and see if you have pressure and then decide what to do.
I guess I should have completed the thought, if I stick with r12, the total cost of the materials: Accumulator, Orfice tube, conversion kit, and the 36 or so ounces of r134a, thing of pag oil, and a seal kit, plus all the time to do it would be way cheaper if there is still pressure in the system. I'd rather spend $50 on the two cans and a line attachment for the gauge on ebay and 10 minutes vs $100-120 plus atleast 3 hours of labor time to hopefully clear the lines. I was so angry leaving the shop after 30 seconds of being there, I forgot to cheap the pressure. I'll check it tomorrow. Paint reacted on my upper and side Windshield trim and trying to find new ones or decide if tomorrow is going to be Laquer Thinner Tuesday.
manicmechanic007
5 Year Member
Read up on converting one to R134a
You need to use ester oil not pag 46.
The ester will allow the two oils to mix and work without creating acid
If you buy a retrofit kit, it will come with the fittings, a sticker and a can of ester oil R134a mix
Once the ester oil is in there you can service it with R134a and all is well
You need to use ester oil not pag 46.
The ester will allow the two oils to mix and work without creating acid
If you buy a retrofit kit, it will come with the fittings, a sticker and a can of ester oil R134a mix
Once the ester oil is in there you can service it with R134a and all is well
Depending on the retrofit, I bought a kit with only the conversion nipples from a local parts store. To my understanding there are about 3-ish ways to do this:
1.If system is already holding pressure, buy R12 and top it off. R12 takes mineral oil.
2. If not completely flushing system, or not replacing dryer and orifice tube use Ester Oil to prevent acids from forming.
3. If system is being flushed and serviced properly, use Pag oil and r134A. With this service, adjusting the A/c Clutch switch? (Not looking at my notes) is recommended by some but is controversial whenever discussed on forums or IRL.
I'm trying to find the links to sources i gathered this information from, inbetween customers, and will try to update this post when I can. I spent an hour with 1 other person tracing down the a/c lines trying to find both service ports and came up empty handed. You'd think two people running their hands across every single inch of a/c lines you'd find something? Nope. Lol. Been trying to google or find any other reference material but coming up empty besides referencing 36-01 in the shop manual.
I will defintely double check now. Thank you.Not here off the AC compressor? (red and blue caps)
That is a really clean underhood!
Just a couple thoughts:
1. Do not add oil unless you have verified that it is required. [Lots] of people over service the oil with these [off the shelf cans] and can't for the life of them, figure out why their A/C still doesn't work. Answer: It near full to the top with oil.
3. Capacity with R134 is roughly 80% of what it is with R12. There is no switch adjustment necessary. The change is made through the volume adjustment of the R134 in an R12 system.
I am still running my OEM A/C pump from 1986, converted to R134a in roughly 2001. My only A/C system mods aside from the R134 conversion are some elongated A/C hoses to accommodate a Kenne Bell.
1. Do not add oil unless you have verified that it is required. [Lots] of people over service the oil with these [off the shelf cans] and can't for the life of them, figure out why their A/C still doesn't work. Answer: It near full to the top with oil.
3. Capacity with R134 is roughly 80% of what it is with R12. There is no switch adjustment necessary. The change is made through the volume adjustment of the R134 in an R12 system.
I am still running my OEM A/C pump from 1986, converted to R134a in roughly 2001. My only A/C system mods aside from the R134 conversion are some elongated A/C hoses to accommodate a Kenne Bell.
I haven't noticed much of a change. It may be true that it takes a little longer to cool but it still works better than a lot of modern cars.
I should also note that I still run the OEM cooling fan (you know the one... it cleans the leaves off the driveway in the fall). I can not imagine an electric fan with that kind of CFM.
There is definitely a difference of what ive got under the hood here. What's your thoughts?Not here off the AC compressor? (red and blue caps)
Here are the photos I was able to get to upload into the website, for some reason my phone took them in an odd format and won't upload the others. My mounting bracket, a/c lines, and a/c compressor are not quite the same. Ford part number is E8D- 1988 Taurus? The fck? And I'm afraid to even ask why there are clamps. There are a/c service ports, but they are facing south towards the ground and some douche put loctite on the caps . I filled them full of free-all and called it an early night. I'll try to see if I can't free the caps tomorrow, if not, I'll take a long knife along both sides and make quick work of them. Depending on the news, might be getting some new a/c parts.
Mustang5L5 definitely not going to be happy to see the amount of dirt under this hood. I'm debating on an engine degreaser foam just to rid the shame after seeing the red beauty earlier.
Well i've seen a lot of things in my time, but hose clamps on an AC line? That's a first for me.
Given the non-factory bracket and the install methods, i would guess that's a "custom" install job that someone did at some point? Might be dealer-installed? I've never seen the 2.3L version of this so couldn't be sure but it was a thing with the V8 cars.
I'd be shocked if that's still holding pressure. Glueing the service caps on, but using hose clamps? wow. I think at this point i'd make a plan to pick up some AC parts off rockauto and try and put the stock OE system back on. Will make it a bigger project unfortunately. and you'll need to source the OE brackets and tensioner like the above photo.
Given the non-factory bracket and the install methods, i would guess that's a "custom" install job that someone did at some point? Might be dealer-installed? I've never seen the 2.3L version of this so couldn't be sure but it was a thing with the V8 cars.
I'd be shocked if that's still holding pressure. Glueing the service caps on, but using hose clamps? wow. I think at this point i'd make a plan to pick up some AC parts off rockauto and try and put the stock OE system back on. Will make it a bigger project unfortunately. and you'll need to source the OE brackets and tensioner like the above photo.
I'm thinking that an "mostly" entire underhood A/C System service is going to have to be the route I take. I'm wondering if this might have been non A/C vehicle that was "Converted" over. I'm about a 70/30 on that its not holding pressure. Just enough of I think I probably shouldn't attempt to disconnect the hose clamps until I remove those caps. Now that I come to think of it, the latest stripped car the shop owner did was a 1990 2.3L and if things will interchange over, I bet he'd make a deal with me for it all if he hasn't sold any of the A/C stuff yet. Will everything from the 1990 swap over to my 1987, air conditioning wise under the hood?
After everything I've had to do to this car, personally I feel like a lot of people would be really angry at this point, but I'm just relieved that this was the last surprise I could run into. When I say this car has been a nightmare and a half from discombobulated things throughout the vehicle, I truly mean it lol. Every bit of the way i've been taking notations of what isn't stock anymore, the original part numbers, the new part numbers, and any modifications made, along with the date when.