351C questions
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bluevenom867
I will have images of molesting stuffed animals in
Please have your builder slap him self on the fore head....
Because a 351C and 351W are two TOTALY differant engines.
Because a 351C and 351W are two TOTALY differant engines.
bluevenom867
I will have images of molesting stuffed animals in
mustangman33 said:
So your asking 351C vs. 351W say,out of the factory?
Give me the Cleveland!
The 4V 351C had some monster heads and valve from the factory,and yes,I would say the block is stronger to some extent.Only down side is the factory oiling system and the coolant system (water pump set-up is differant from a Windsor I believe) wont fit right up to a Fox.And also,even though heads are decent,the ports are huge and really arent effective untill around 5000rpm.
mustangman33 said:
Yes this is nothing new.I`m not sure of the exact modifications required,but remember it`s nothing really serious.
It is possible to use 351W heads on a 351C block or even 351C heads on a 351W block.
(if you don`t believe me,you can research this out yourself)
A 351C block would be stronger that a late model 351W block,and the 351C has smaller main journals that a 351W,which is a plus.
3" for the 351W and 2.749" for the 351C.
As for oiling,the 351W is noted for a better oil system overall,but for street use it shouldn`t be an issue.
351C`s way back in the day were used in very high rpm racing applications which made oil system mods necessary,just like in most other factory engines.
timewarped1972
Member
yeah, they call it a clevor.....lol....351 c heads on a 351 windsor......actually, the boss 302 used cleavland style heads, just machined to bolt straight on to a sb ford.
to put cleavland heads on a windsor, you need a custom intake manifold ( probably hard to find and pricey nowdays) and you have to make a modification to one of the water passages and add or delete a cylinder block head bolt hole. this was done way back before aftermarket heads were around for cheap like they are now. so there's no need to do this nowdays unless you like funky projects or have all the parts already and the know how.
the 351 was noted for some oiling problems but only at high rpm.......which, in stock form they were detuned alot with the cam and intake, but when people started swapping in decent cams and intakes they did have some oil starvation problems at sustained high rpms....also fixable.....
i can't think of anything that is compatible bolt on wise with a cleavland and a windsor, totally different in most ways.......except the heads are close enough they can be interchanged, but it's not a bolt on deal.....
the cleavaland also had basically 3 head offerings in the late 69 early 70's......4 barrel heads and 2 barrel heads....different port size and valve size for each.....then, there were 2 different 4 bbl heads, open chamber ( more hemi type) and closed ( quench type), they used the closed quench type on the hot 4bbl engines like the one used in the 1971 boss 351 ( one bad ass car i might add!).......
while i'm on the cleavland rant.....the 351 cleavalnd also morphed into the ford 400 and the 351 "m" which ford used in everything through out the 70's. the 400 was a stretched and or stroked 351 c with 2 bbl heads, and the 351 m was this 400 c, but was stroked to 351 using i think a 351 c crank and special pistons......rumor had it they ran out of 400 guts and used 351 stuff, or, that they had a need for 351 ci engines, and decided to morph two together with special parts to keep up with demand for that size engine but in the cleavland form.........not sure about those rumors though.....
there, my old car junkie knowledge actually fit in some where in 5.0 tech, lmao..........
note, i'm sure there's more up dated stuff by now but, the old ford performance book by pat ganahl, had really excelent info on all the ford engines of that time......
to put cleavland heads on a windsor, you need a custom intake manifold ( probably hard to find and pricey nowdays) and you have to make a modification to one of the water passages and add or delete a cylinder block head bolt hole. this was done way back before aftermarket heads were around for cheap like they are now. so there's no need to do this nowdays unless you like funky projects or have all the parts already and the know how.
the 351 was noted for some oiling problems but only at high rpm.......which, in stock form they were detuned alot with the cam and intake, but when people started swapping in decent cams and intakes they did have some oil starvation problems at sustained high rpms....also fixable.....
i can't think of anything that is compatible bolt on wise with a cleavland and a windsor, totally different in most ways.......except the heads are close enough they can be interchanged, but it's not a bolt on deal.....
the cleavaland also had basically 3 head offerings in the late 69 early 70's......4 barrel heads and 2 barrel heads....different port size and valve size for each.....then, there were 2 different 4 bbl heads, open chamber ( more hemi type) and closed ( quench type), they used the closed quench type on the hot 4bbl engines like the one used in the 1971 boss 351 ( one bad ass car i might add!).......
while i'm on the cleavland rant.....the 351 cleavalnd also morphed into the ford 400 and the 351 "m" which ford used in everything through out the 70's. the 400 was a stretched and or stroked 351 c with 2 bbl heads, and the 351 m was this 400 c, but was stroked to 351 using i think a 351 c crank and special pistons......rumor had it they ran out of 400 guts and used 351 stuff, or, that they had a need for 351 ci engines, and decided to morph two together with special parts to keep up with demand for that size engine but in the cleavland form.........not sure about those rumors though.....
there, my old car junkie knowledge actually fit in some where in 5.0 tech, lmao..........
note, i'm sure there's more up dated stuff by now but, the old ford performance book by pat ganahl, had really excelent info on all the ford engines of that time......
timewarped1972
Member
windsor heads on a cleavland?? well, if it is possible, it's not a bolt on.......like i said i think you'd need a special intake manifold......they made one for the cleavland to windsor swap but i don't know if they do for the vice versa......not positive on that one.....you'd be better off finding some cleavland heads.even the 2bbl heads when ported were pretty killer heads....and those you could find cheap....you'd probably want 4bbl heads though if your trying to make monster power....what your talking about is definatly a custom project that would need some research....which being the internet is what it is i'm sure you could find it.......i'm sure there's a cleavland message board out there that would have all the answers
bluevenom867
I will have images of molesting stuffed animals in
I though you meant internals being able to interchange between blocks,they cant.
Heads can be interchanged with some modifications to the coolant passages.But puting 351W heads on a Cleveland motor is really kinda stupid.
Its usualy the other way around,putting 351C heads on a Windsor.And yes it called a Clevor.
They used to make maniflod for the swap,but you just have to look for one.
Heads can be interchanged with some modifications to the coolant passages.But puting 351W heads on a Cleveland motor is really kinda stupid.
Its usualy the other way around,putting 351C heads on a Windsor.And yes it called a Clevor.
They used to make maniflod for the swap,but you just have to look for one.
See I have alot of work and money put into my heads, thats why I wanted to put them on a Clevland. What Im tring to accomplish about 500-600hp N/A, and able to add a 200 shot, but don't wanna spend like 2500 for a Dart block, gonna add a girdle, and maybe a half fill, would this be achievable with that Clevland.
stangjunkie
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- Nov 15, 2004
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timewarped... i wish you could give us more information on the 351... i really dont feel like theres enough info there... GEEZ!!! Thanks thats one of those files im gonna save so when someone else brings it up i can paste it and people might think i know what im talkin about
For info on the 351C from people who know what works from years of experience, check this forum out - http://www.network54.com/Forum/119419/
88Stangboy
Banned
351clevland....the small block that thinks its a big block......Hmm, stroke it to 408 to take advantage of those huge heads, drop on a Vic. Jr. intake, a nice .560ish lift cam, about a 750ish carb. and it should be a hell of a combo....At least thats what the guy up the street did to his in his 69' Mach 1 and that thing will haul balls any way you look at it.
